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Hi, Tracy,
You didn’t see an earlier post of the transition exercise for wk3, so I deleted it from this listing, added our latest session, and this video is a compilation of what we’ve done so far. First clip is first session. Second clip is in another part of the house, with Yuki watching on the other side of the glass slider. Yuki was not happy that Keiko was getting clicked and treated. I think Keiko was probably enjoying that. ;). The third clip is our first try “out and about”. This is in a area of our yard Keiko does not get to be free in. Treats are on the fence post on my right side. She seemed to feel we should be in the agility field (which is behind where the camera was positioned and why she kept moving in that direction.) We obviously need to do this exercise more – both in boring in-house settings and in more difficult out and about areas.
Hello!
We also took a turn ( pun intended) with the skill set. Since I’m not doing it exactly like your video, I want to be sure What I’m doing is ok. I’m just showing you a short video showing how we started (hand send with no treat in hand, treat tossed to back) and getting to the complete wrap to treat in hand. We did this on both sides. I had to concentrate on on moving a foot. Forward or bending into her, so I think there is a little swayng here and there on my part. She seemed fine. I plan to do this from a bit back, then try moving forward a little as she goes around, and then try introducing the verbal. Am I missing a step or moving too quickly? Thanks!
Kristie
Thanks so much, Tracy. Yes, I need to move more and cue sooner, and I appreciate your willingness to keep reminding me and pushing me in that direction.
When I learned the flick, the handler did a little rock back with their feet while circling the hand to indicate the dog’s motion. From what you’re saying, it seems I should try to minimize (and maybe get rid of) that little rocking motion and just try to keep moving forward while flicking the dog over the back side of the jump, and then moving forward toward the handler. Am I understanding that correctly? I found myself doing a little of the rocking automatically when Yuki and I gave it a go today, so I want to be sure I don’t introduce something extraneous to Keiko. I’m pretty sure I can fade the rocking with Yuki, it’s me I’m going to have to work on. ;). Suggestions? Thanks again, ~KristieHi, Tracy,
I totally agree with your feedback and comments. Motion and timing are HUGE! – and they are things I know I need to work on. I seem to be consistently late with cues, so keep picking on that with me.
Okay, onto a different topic: what you are calling “threadle wraps” and I refer to as a “flick.” I trained these with Yuki a few years ago. She hasn’t done one in almost 2 years, so I decided to see what, if anything, she remembered. I was really pleased that she knew what the verbal and my motion meant. I I have a video clip of us giving the flick a try. You’ll see her stop after each wrap since I tossed a treat each time to reinforce the memory and her performance.
Okay, my comments – I would prefer to have both my dogs have the same verbal and visual cues for the backside wrap “sandwich.” It’s just easier for me, and has worked well for Yuki. Do you have a preference with how I train Keiko on this maneuver, or is it all right for me to use the “flick” approach? Here’s a clip showing Yuki giving the Flick a revisit after a long time away.
Thanks for your feedback. ~Kristie
Hello, again!
And here’s Yuki’s work on the same sequence:
My feelings about my handling on the first day’s run were pretty much the same as mentioned above. I needed more motion and enthusiasm, cues both verbal and visual needed to be sooner, and I had to get rid of that false turn thingy. Not pretty and Yuki told me all about it. (She has never been shy to let me know when she thinks I’m blowing it..). Made similar changes when I ran her 2 days later, and I saw an improvement. She is a tight turner, and I think she did better on the second day. She did knock a bar – do you have any insight on that? Time-wise: Day #1 22.55 secs., Day #2 20.62 secs. What other changes would you make in my handling? Thanks!
Hello, Tracy,
I’ve got two video sequences for the Sequences for Success exercise. One is with Keiko, the other with Yuki. So interesting to run an experienced dog who has been away from agility for 14 months, and a green dog who has just reached her 19th month of age. ;). I’ll put them in separate posts so it’s easier to follow.
We did these on 2 different days, with a day off (they each had an agility class on that day) in the middle. Day #1 was a later in the day and a bit warmer, otherwise the humidity and general feel was the same.Keiko first: While the first run was okay, I could see soooo much I could improve. I felt I could move more which might translate to more fun for her. I was not happy with my false turn on the second loop around the jumps. I felt I was late with my handling, especially for the jump to tunnel loop, and could certainly get out my verbals earlier.
I decided to do a reverse spin on the second loop and try to get my deceleration and turn away done sooner and faster for the jump to tunnel loop. There are 2 “after” clips. In the first one, I think I did move more, was more animated in talk and cues, and did the change in handling I wanted. However, I think my decel and turn on the jump to tunnel (last loop) was late and slow. Keiko consistently went wide there, something she didn’t do on the first day. I think the heat and/or the fact that it was a brand new thing we were doing could have affected her behavior on that. The last clip I ran with the squirrel. She knew I had it, and seemed quite pleased, she still went wide – and I did a lousy throw! :(.
Time was really interesting. Day #1 she took 25.45 secs. Day #2 first clip was 20.33 secs, clip with squirrel 20.68. Though there are a lot of variables at play here, I do think that the changes I made in my behavior and handling did have a positive impact on Keiko’s time and performance.
So, what is your reaction? Thanks! ~KristieOooh oh! Excitement. Figured out how to do a split screen so here are 2 videos. The first one is the split screen, the second is the first video I put up with this posting with the videos sequential. You get to choose which one works best for you. 🙂
HI, Tracy,
To reply to your comments:
“These are good! For the ‘over’ cue – does this also imply a slight collection, a gentle turn? It does when I use that type of cue, and it is a nice balance to the gwan versus the tight turns.”Yes, that’s what “over” means. 🙂
“•Flick (for back/360 wrap around wing of jump we are passing)
And I think it belongs with these – is it a threadle wrap so she starts between you and the wing, or a backside push wrap so she is on the outside of you? As agility continues to evolve, you will likely need a verbal for each – the push circle wrap takes priority right now, and then the threadle wrap can be added later.”Flick is with her between me and the wing, and doing a 360 circle around the wing, backside first. It’s a term from OMD – I’ve had a fair amount of instruction from OMD coaches and instructors here in CT. Haven’t seen any of the outside/backside push you mention here. Does it have a name or are people just coming up with their own cues?
“One thing I am noticing as the dogs mature is that the praise was working when they were babies but now it is delaying the info, so they either come off lines or look at us too much. We will keep an eye on how Keiko feels about it, because at some point you might have to eliminate the praise in favor of giving her faster/sooner info on course, especially when she is going at flying squirrel speed 🙂”
You’re right – I will need to watch this. Right now, what I am noticing in the class we are taking is that when I get more revved up and use more verbal praise, she does better and seems to enjoy herself more. If I’m focused more on handling and cuing, she gets more serious and, sometimes, seems worried.
“And in training, I would take a decent amount of time to walk the course and practice the left and right to have them planned and ready and rehearsed – because yes, it is way too hard to figure it out while the dog is running, but if the verbal is already in my mouth and brain, then it becomes very easy to g[get out while running 🙂 We will be adding more of that rehearsal in coming weeks here 🙂”
I’m glad you’re going to give us some tips and exercises to give this a try. I’ve just evolved to using “turn” and my girls (bless their Aussie hearts) have seemed to figure out what I mean. It’s been many, many years, so I have a rather ingrained habit to break…..Something tells me you’ll have a way that works. 🙂
Hi, Tracy,
Here’s my thoughts on my agility verbals:Verbals for Agility:
Forward:
•Go on! (keep going in a line over the next obstacles straight ahead. Sounds more like gwan)
•Name of obstacle as obstacle cues (saw, tunnel, over, walk-it, frame, table, hoop, etc.)
•Weave (to look for entrance), then weevweevweev while weaving to reinforce staying in poles.
•Bottom (2o2o position for all 3 contacts). Saving “hit it” if we run into an issue somewhere
•Over (go forward and take jump)Distance/discrimination:
•Get out! (Take obstacle that is not on straight path such as a pin wheel, layered obstacle, gamble, etc.)
•Here (come to obstacle near me, not necessarily one that is “straight ahead”)
•Far (go to far end of tunnel, even if can’t see entry)Various Turns:
•Turn (on rear cross, turn in opposite direction from way we had been heading)
•Back (go to the back of the jump, take it while turning toward me
•Wrap (go forward over jump and come back to me on same side as sent)
•In-In (use in threadle situation as well as instead of forced front cross to tell dog to come to the back side of the jump rather than over the front, then to turn and jump over the jump in a slice)Others:
•Sit/Wait (Start line)
•With me (VERY useful for Snooker, and in tight situations. Means come to my side and move with me until given a different cue)
•Around (wings, barrel in NADAC)
•Down (table)
•Loose noose (exit behavior to put head through slip lead noose so we can Go Get Cookies!!)
•Flick (for back/360 wrap around wing of jump we are passing)Also, I have been working (for a while, it’s a work in progress) at getting my verbals out earlier, especially when the dog is in a tunnel and can’t get a visual cue from me. And, as you’ve seen in videos, I use lots of praise words and noises. 😉
You’ll notice a lack of “left” and “right” or something similar. Keiko and I have done many exercises and sessions with you using “lef-lef” and “rye-rye”. However, I have never really used this type of directional cue with any of my dogs in trials because I can’t be sure to figure out the direction they need to be turning when we’re running, so the simple “turn” cue has served me well. If you’ve got some tricks about being able to tell left from right in the stress/excitement of a trial run, I’d love to hear them. 😉
Thanks! ~Kristie
Hey, Tracy,
I think you deserve a break now and again – and this hardly sounds like a relaxing break! We’ll all be fine if you need a day or two to regroup. Have a safe flight and trip. ~KristieLove your feedback and ideas, as usual. ;). I like the mat or leash idea for when she has to “hang loose” while the instructor talks.
Yes, I can take her for a visit to the new barn location, and I can even just pay for a “drop in” class to see how things go. I may take that route first. I know she is capable of doing the things they are doing in that class, BUT I don’t know that she’d do them in such a new and different environment. I have no problem putting her in a class that’s “too easy” agility-wise, but would probably turn out to be somewhat challenging from her pandemic perspective. Thanks again, Tracy. Take care, ~KristieHI, Tracy,
Thanks for your comments. I’ll try to hit your questions.Focus: I can lose it during a run when she is heading straight toward the people and crated dogs, so try to do some calling and treat tossing to get her re-focused and going forward on the set. I almost always lose it during the time the instructor is talking because she (instructor) says “just let her wander I want to show you this”. Then I have to reconnect with my girl. I prefer your idea of doing the “get it” game, I’ll see if I can get the instructor to work with me on that. It doesn’t happen at the end of the run because that’s when the reward is tossed (lotus) or, today, the chuck-it. She is also really relieved to be able to run back to her crate. I think she has a lot of stress she’s trying to deal with. The extra fun I brought into it today caused her to really focus and use her energy up (!) then she was ready for her crate. She was very tired and somewhat subdued at home in the afternoon. Again, I’m not surprised. The training building is 1 hour away, and the session lasted 3 hours this morning. 5 hours is a lot. She didn’t bug her sisters here until early evening. 😉
Her class is Monday evenings, hour drive, hour class, hour drive home.I have just learning I can try her in a class in another location with a different instructor. It’s a barn/horse arena so everything is totally new and different. I’m inclined to hold off on that for just a bit longer while we work out a happy system with the class & Saturday sessions first. These are in the same indoor location with the same instructor, and in a building owned by Keiko’s breeder. Keiko played in this building with her litter mates as a baby, and one of her litter mates is in her Monday class. She often indicates to me that she thinks she and Java should be able to play!
Okay, I think I touched on most of your questions/comments. Anything else I should consider? Thanks so much, Tracy. You’re right – it’s really hard to know just what our pandemic pups can handle and need right now.
Take care,
~Kristie
Hello!
Well, well. We had a chance to give the squirrel a try in a workshop/class this morning. This was given by the agility teacher we currently have, in the location where class is held. Usually in class, after doing one run, Keiko does a lot of sniffing and checking things out in this room, and, though I have been ramping up the treats, I still lose her focus. This morning was a 3-hour session with some additional (new) people and dogs, and there is no barrier between the “audience” (dogs in crates, people sitting around) and the agility set-up.
So I decided to try ramping it up. We did our first run with just food treats, and she did quite well. However, when the instructor asked us to repeat, she disconnected while the intructor talked, and I never really had my girl “back” for that turn. This was my “baseline” data. ;). Then we ramped it up. I got out the squirrel chuck-it, and also got out my super-duper excited voice (me babbling), and off we went. She was a bullet! Missed a jump (late cue and she was going too fast to make the turn) but her run was lovely and she flew for the squirrel at the end. Simply delighted. We did a second run, again with positive results. The instructor wanted a third run, but it was obvious to me that Keiko had shot her wad, so we did a tunnel, chased the squirrel, and called it quits. One of the women in the class, who has known me (via agility) for over 20 years, commented that in my early runs, I did not pour on the enthusiasm and babble that I used in the later runs. So, combination of super-hyped mom and squirrel seems to work well. 🙂 It’s been tough watching my girl who is so focused at home lose it in class and weekend sessions. We both came home quite happy. I do think, too, that I need to limit how many tries she gives any particular sequence in a turn. She doesn’t seem to stick with doing something over and over like some dogs will (unless, of course, it’s chasing her squirrel or disc…..) What do you think? Continue in this vein? Other ideas? Thanks, Tracy! ~KristieHi, Tracy,
Ah, yes, you ARE an evil woman!! ;). Poor pup, she won’t know which end is up! ;). I’ll have to see if she is able to focus on anything (me, the toy, the exercise) in class. Yes, she’s had a lot of work on the left in classes like LLW, Basic Manners and Out and About. Agility helps us even things out, but the left side seems to stay stronger, probably due to the early training. Even though Covid kept us out of classes for too long, we’ve been trying to make up for it. I do love that she is both food and toy motivated – gives me lots of options and things to try in different situations.
Take care – ~KristieHi, Tracy,
We have Thinker Keiko here in spades! She thought it quite weird that I would give her a command that caused her to stop while I went on moving forward. As you’ll see, I moved at a slow pace, and did reward a couple of stop-not-sits. I loved the long long stand where she had to think about my last verbal and finally sat. We’re not ready for much more motion, but perhaps some latent learning time will help this process in her mind, and we can try a snappier pace. “Spin” was not gonna happen for this today. I think it still needs to become more automatic and natural for her. Any comments? Thanks! ~Kristie
