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Good morning!
>We really haven’t done much start line stuff – I was kind of worried about ruining his stays forever – but I’m feeling like he’s more ready now. >
Totally! And I have full faith in your training skills. You are not going to ruin his stays! And of course the platform can come out in crazy hard environments if needed. It is all about good feelings and getting happy success.
>I’ll also get to leash and between legs set up like I’ll be doing in actual training/trialing now that I think he’s having some good success.>
Adding that plus adding obstacles tips the scales into the stays being harder, so the stay itself can be easier (shorter duration) to be sure he has a high level of success.
>This morning I asked him to sit and wait as I started to put the bowl down and tried to hand him a few kibbles to reinforce as that was happening. He kind of partially closed his eyes and turned his head away, refusing to take the kibble, like it was some kind of a dastardly trick. >
“MOTHER WHY DO YOU PUNISH ME BY MAKING ME EAT FOOD WHILE I AM WORKING?!?!?” Hahahahaha So funny! I love stories like this.
That is definitely really interesting behavior! Was the kibble you tried to punish him with oops I mean hand to him the same stuff that was in the bowl? It might give us an insight into reinforcement and expectations (reward prediction errors). The most recent studies talk about the brain constantly updating expectations, similar to how AI is constantly updating how it works. Fascinating stuff! I wish my brain would update as fast as puppy brains do, though haha
There is a lot of bandwidth devoted to stays while breakfast is being doled out – and the expectation might be that the breakfast bowl is the reward. It is both the work and the reward, maybe similar to how these dogs view stock.
And being asked to eat kibble from your hand was an unexpected thing (in a non-happy-making-way) so it was almost aversive in that moment when all expectations were set on the breakfast bowl.
His response doesn’t surprise me, based on the nice combination of Border Collie (and BC ancestors) plus feral dogs in Australia (seriously, Dingo!) used to create Koolies. BCs are not big eaters during work, and less ‘domesticated’ (hello, dingo!) breeds are also not big eaters.
This is probably because of how their nervous system works when they are in work mode (which might be similar to survival mode for the more feral breeds). I saw it with my first BC-Croatian mix who, as a young dog, would also look like I beat him with a stick when I offered a food reward from my hand (or when he was in a stay in front of a jump and I tried to pet him LOL!). Or he would move his head away to look around the offered treat and keep looking at the work, as if the offered treat was a form of distraction for the focus forward skill 😂 And these were GOOD treats like cheese or meat!
I have a video somewhere of a shaping session that I thought was FANTASTIC – he offered a behavior, he got a treat, then I would break it off and play tug. As I was patting myself on the back for a job well done, I turned off the camera then turned around to see he had spit out every.single.cookie and I didn’t even notice hahahahaha Oops!
But, by making eating a part of the ‘work’, they learn that eating is good AND reinforcing even in those work moments, as you can already see with Vibe everywhere else in his life (he is a good eater!) And there is tremendous benefit for the nervous system, arousal regulation, gut biome, and all of it because everything is related.
>I am in so much trouble with this kid.>
Ha! Not at all! He is super cool (Kool!) and will present some fun training questions and challenges, but fun times are ahead for sure!
Tracy
Good morning! Thanks for the updates!! Excellent progress, everything is going really well.
On the tunnel rocking horse video:
>We had a little confusion with the “around” verbal on the wing (usually we use the barrel) – but she got past it fairly quickly.>
Yes, she sorted it out really well!! I think part of her question at the beginning was the visual of the toy dangling – she didn’t quite know what to look at. To help her out, you can squish up the toy so it is all in your hand, or stick it in your pocket so your hands are free 🙂 That way you can emphasize connection. We don’t need precision rewards here so you can have the toy in your pocket and pull it out at the end of each rep.
She had some questions about turning to her right to get the 2nd wing (on the right side of the screen) – she did great when you started with that wing, no problem!
To get it more smoothly when you are starting from the tunnel, or when you are running to it after wrapping the other wing and sending her into the tunnel, we need to get you ahead of her for now so you can show her the line to the wing with clear connection (dog-side arm back, eyes on her eyes).
So you can send her to the tunnel from an angle where you will be further ahead on the exit. Or send to the other wing from closer to the tunnel, so you can try to get to the tunnel exit head of her. That will give you time to show her the connection and get the right turn. If you are behind her, she is going to the wing but wrapping to her left
At the end, you did wing – tunnel-next wing and she did great! That 2nd wing at 2:55 was a left turn AND you were ahead and connected so the sequence was smooth and fast. Super!!!
>Verbals Question! Does it make sense to have her barrel verbal match her jump wrap verbals?>
Yes – the verbals are the same, meaning “wrap the thing” 🙂
> Assuming I eventually have a different left wrap/right wrap verbal… Im still so new to so many of these verbals that Im having a hard time committing >
Based on her speed and how courses are evolving to have more distance (and even more speed, yes – you will want different left/right wrap verbals. You can use your around as one of them, and choose another like check or dig, anything that makes sense to you will work really well.
>Lateral Lead Out
I would recommend watching this on mute :). I didnt use the front facing camera this time, and the phone chose to pick up the rooster/chickens/horses as opposed to me.>Ha!!! I love the noises!!! So fun and really not too noisy at all – at least until the rooster crowed and all 9 of my dogs leapt up and ran around barking 😂 😆 🐓
The rocking horse warm up looked great! Her commitment is looking strong and you are able to send her from further and further away. Plus, you are getting really good at recognizing how to fix something on the fly: For example, you needed more connection at :40 (she ended up behind you, thinking it was a blind cross perhaps (when you broke connection to look forward) so you kept going (perfect!) and made a great adjustment on the fly at :45 to add more connection. Double perfect!
When you added the lateral lead outs, she did really well! Very few questions and very strong commitment. She had one question but I think it had more to do with what she was seeing in the handling cue at 2:23 – hard to see if you were facing the barrel but we can see your shadow! Your shadow was facing forward so she did not take the barrel.
Compare to your shadow on the next rep at 2:39 where you were facing the barrel more and stepped to it, so she got it. Yay!You can also work these games with the toy scrunched up or in your pocket – that will free up your hands and also it will start to fade out the visual of the toy so she doesn’t rely on it as a cue to engage with the games.
>Sniffari She loves these! She does tend to start looking to me for direction/interaction or just deciding to lay down and observe after a short period of time>
That is great! Border Collies don’t necessarily automatically do extended sniffing, so you can let her do some world watching and observe the world – that is definitely something BCs love and it can be decompressing too. Or you can scatter treats all around as you move to keep the sniffing going.
> but Ive started encouraging a relocation which will re-start the exploration.>
Great! When she stops exploring/sniffing, it might be her way of saying she is done with that area. And introducing a new area is a great way to get her sniffing/exploring again.
>Ill see if I can be coordinated enough to get a video of a sniffari this week that doesnt cause motion sickness.>Ha! That is the hardest part of it LOL
Great job here!!
Tracy
Good morning! Nice session here!
At the very beginning, he was pumped up to be outside.
Was he eating grass or dropped treats? The chewing got in the way of some of his commitment LOL He didn’t really do it when you walked away with connection, so definitely keep that connection as you move away to the jump.
The countermotion went really well to the left! He got it pretty easily, except when he was chewing like on the 2nd rep (relatable, I can’t concentrate on work either if I am chewing a snack 😂)
To the right seemed a little harder – he had to think REALLY HARD at 3:06 to release and find the jump with you waling towards him, but he got it! Super! Then you had a really long tug session as part of the reward. That was great 🙂
He got it again at 4:10 but it is definitely hard. When you revisit it, he might have it locked in (latent learning!) but if he still says it is hard, you can put the toy or an empty food bowl down on the other side of the wing as a visual aid.
It might have been a bit harder on that side because that is a harder side, plus you were really good about moving forward then releasing. I could see his brain working hard to process it, good boy!!
>Hopefully in the next few days I can get my husband to help move the tunnel and bags out to do the rocking horse exercise. Otherwise it will be the little tunnel and one wing in the basement to start.>
Perfect! Either way, that is a fun game 🙂 Keep me posted!
Great job here!
Tracy
Good morning! Great job working with this beast of a course 🙂
Yes, there are spots where he had questions – two are easy tweaks to add (and the 2nd one was related to the first one)! The first question is probably the hardest one to adjust and we will need to play around with it a bit.
That first question was on the opening line. 1-2 was super nice but then he went really long over 3, which altered the line 4-5. You did get the better turn at :51 by really turning towards him and decelerating, but that prevents you from get up the next line as quickly as he needs you to.
>It feels like he should have had nice turns because I was right there though.>
Part of what was sending him long was your acceleration away from the landing spot of 2. So as he exited 2, he was seeing giddy up cues 🙂 and we can flip that to help get a turn on 3.
Something to work on to see if this is what will help:
As he exits jump 2 and you finish the FC, stay closer to the landing side of 2 and send away to 3 with both hands up and a strong verbal turn cue (can be his name or a right verbal, whichever one you feel is stronger). Keep turning your shoulders away, though, so you can keep moving up the line. Think of it as handling with 2 hands on the steering wheel of a sports car 🙂 with the cues starting as he lands from jump 2. That should give him the info sooner to add a little bit of collection before takeoff to 3, which should set a nice line to 4-5.
He found 4-5 really well after the first rep with your connection and clear verbals! When he pulled in on the first rep, it was partially because the line from 4-5 was a little different based on the turn at 3, but mainly because you were quiet and turning away. He seems to like forceful connected handling 🙂
His second question was about where to go to find 6. He (correctly) stayed on a parallel path to your line of motion at :34 and :54 and that is a GREAT thing because we need him to stay on his line at a distance.
So to get the turn to 6: you started the blind earlier at :54 so it helped but your motion was still on that parallel line (so you could get clear of the line and show the 7 tunnel) and so he didn’t turn til he saw the reconnection at the end of the blind. That was the rep where you stayed at 3 and rotated to get him to turn, so you really had to blast up the line to get to 6-7.
Less rotation at 3 (and sending to it from further away) will get you there sooner, and also you can start the blind before he takes off for 5 – that way he sees the new connection when he lands from 5 and also sees the line towards 7.
But I think the direction of motion will make all the difference – sending to 3 from the landing side of 2 (instead of getting close to 3) will make it easier to get to a good spot on the landing side of 6 while supporting 4-5.
The middle section was gorgeous through 12!!!! Wow!!! Nice weave entry and flip to the next line!
>I think because I was behind and couldn’t put pressure on his line?>
We don’t want him to need your pressure on the line, so a couple of ideas for you 🙂
We can use the parallel path concept that he is very good at to support the line to the backside – stay in motion rather than decelerate at all, because deceleration is part of what pulled him in to the front side.
And, a suggestion about arms:
The dog-side arm turned your shoulders to the front side of the bar (like at 1:10) which is likely why convergence was needed to get the backside at 1:22.
So an option without convergence is to use your opposite arm to cue the backside! As you are moving up the line on this sequence, your left arm (dog side arm) is down, and your right arm (opposite arm) comes up and high, to point to the backside entry wing. And you have big connection to his eyes, saying the backside verbal directly to his cute face. The outside arm emphasizes the shoulders showing the line to the backside, even from a big distance.Using the outside arm to cue a backside it not something commonly seen in North America but the Europeans use it with tremendous success! So it is worth a try, because you will be able get really independent backside behavior without having to use motion towards it.
Play with it without the layering once or twice to get a feel for it, then try it with the layering and see how he does! It will be incredibly advantageous to be able to cue the backside from 3 miles away there 🙂
Great job here! Have a fun camping trip!
Tracy
Good morning!
It is kind of sad that outdoor trials are going away but also I don’t miss the times when the weather was terrible.
>Of course I agree that he needs to learn how to collect and keep the bars up: – When there are a bunch of collected jumps in a row – When I move suddenly – If I say something.>
He has made dramatic improvements in being able to handle a bunch of collected jumps in a row. That trial video is proof! And mostly he is fine with you talking over the bars… except for praise. Praise pulls his focus towards you and doesn’t provide info about what is next, so that is where we see bars (after praise). So…. No more praise on course, it doesn’t help him 🙂
The sudden movement is hard when he is on that collected line towards you (like exiting a front cross).It is definitely nice to be able to use the facility when you are there for your class! That is a nice perk!
>So what I see is that he is not jumping quite as long when I ask him to collect – adding a stride – but he isn’t coming as close to the jump as I’d like him to.>
On this session – the reps that were most informative were when he was a couple of strides away from the jump. Having him start right at the jump doesn’t help because what we need is for him to move into the weight shift which starting that close doesn’t produce (he kind of pulls himself over it, rather than pushes over it)
Asking for the sit before takeoff is a helpful game as it does produce more use of the rear. The next step for that is having you moving away and not needing to be at the bar or leaning forward to get him to sit (a verbal cue only, or taking the cato plank back out)
>he is flipping in the air to land on the line but not in a good way, in a weird upright way.>
What that comes from is pulling from the front, kind of flinging over the bar.
In this case, to begin teaching better collection on these awkward slices – it has to start on a lower bar. He was on a tall bar here and had a lot of failure without knowing how to properly adjust (bars down and ticked bars). The low bar (12”) will be helpful for him to sort out the striding and be more successful, then the bar can gradually go up. That way he can learn to handle the tall bar without flinging himself.
>Consider the left wrap at :58: it is not ideal but I would take it if I could get it on a course>
That was a little wide because the timing was a little late – he was already preparing for takeoff.
>On the other hand, at 1:07 I would like a sharper turn. However that is much better than the one at 1:15 when I am on the takeoff side of the jump.>
On all of the reps in that section – he was slipping after landing. Watch his front end slip out in the direction opposite where you want him turning towards. And then his hind end has to engage to keep him upright rather than to power through to the next line.
The slipping plays a major role in the turns here, for 2 reasons:
– slips will require an extra stride to adjust after them, widening the turn
-if he is slipping, he is going to devote his mechanics to remaining upright and not to digging in to get a great turn. He really needs to trust his footing in order to make adjustments before takeoff.I know that no one wants to talk about how slippery the flat turfs are but we can’t get great turns at high speed unless we can eliminate or greatly reduce the slipping. And Casper is not likely to slow himself down – so we need to help with the footing to produce the collection on the takeoff side. Have you ever tried any of that foot spray (Tacky Paw or something) which gives better grip? There is a big facility local to me which has turf similar to this and lots of folks use the foot spray.
And for training, grass should provide good grip to begin changing the mechanics to get more collection on the takeoff side.
>As far as flexibility, when I am right on top of the jump (:34 for example) I think it looks pretty good. He gets a massage every week and sees the chiropractor every month – this makes me feel like he is “ok”. However, I can add flexibility exercises, if you think they would help.>
Basically, we want more ‘slither’ through the front end. Even at :34, he is jumping kind of as one unit with only a little bend through the body. I would be good to see more of a C shape to his body there.
So he is physically ok and uninjured, but doing flexibility exercises can give him the ability to bend even better. From the human perspective – I can get blind crosses done pretty well, but if I did more yoga and more stretching to be more flexible then the flexibility required to re-connect on a blind would be soooo much easier and clearer to the dog. In other words – I can turn, but I am not that flexible so my turns are not that great. It is the game with the dogs 🙂Let me know what you think! There is a lot to unpack with teaching turns!
Tracy
Good morning!
Lift gave great feedback here! Great job embracing the challenge 🙂
>I finally realized that a bit of decel and more connection would get the jump she had run around before but then held onto it too long and got her commentary on the push to the backside following it.>
Yes, the decel helped set the line better but that section was all about connection.
At :21 and 1:28, you took off without connection (your thought bubble said you were thinking about the layering) so she stayed on her parallel line past the jump.
You were definitely more connected at 1:40 when you decelerated a bit and that totally helped! But then you took off and disconnected for the layering (1:42) and that pulled her off the line to the layering (she marked the moment with a cuss).She is still in the stage where she can’t save you if you disconnect on something more complex like this, so the feedback is helpful!! The goal is that you can take off but keep your head turned towards her and make connection so she can see the line. It doesn’t have to be really hard connection or staring 🙂 but she does need to see your eyes and line of shoulders.
When you were connected, like at :23-:29 and 1:14 – 1:26 for example: she took the lines including the layering! And you were connected at :27 and she took the backside because you were on her line to the front.
Getting the right line to propel her into the layering without verbals was a little harder – but when you stayed closer to the previous line and accelerated with connection she got it really well!
So overall – we should keep revisiting the silent running. It will sharpen up the connection which Lift will really appreciate and Kaladin will benefit from too.
Great job here!
Tracy
Hi!
> My focus was on rewarding when i made a mistake, he got many cookies. At one point i kept sending him round wings trying to figure out what i was trying to do with my body… but hey he seemed to enjoy it.>
Yes, he was all in to get lots of treats and do lots of easy wraps as you worked out timing! And also yes – I think there was an additional dog barking in the distance along with the neighbor dog barking the whole time. His brain was working HARD!
The trick to these flick aways is having later timing: keeping your arm extended towards him and feet together, then letting him get to less than an arm’s length away from your hand before moving hand or foot. That is hard for us humans!
The reps where he had questions – you were too early. I know, we are almost never too early in agility but this is a skill where we mess up by being too early 🙂 What I mean by that is your foot stepped back and your hand started the turn away when he was still a meter or so away from your hand, which cued him to go to the other side of the jump or turned him towards you.
But on the reps where you held your position until he was very close to your hand? Super! You can see that right at the beginning, and also at :49, 1:31, 2:33 – those were my favorites in terms of timing.
The hand seems to be the most important element for him, so you can lean towards him a little and fully extend it towards him. At 2:15 we have a good camera angle of the arm position – it is bent at the elbow and kind of near your hip, so harder for him to visually lock onto. Plus your foot is already stepping back – but you held that position until he got pretty close to you, so he still got the turn! Yay!
And there was an insight into how hard his brain was working, with the new cues (turning away is not intuitive for dogs!) and the big barking all around him: At 2:24 you pointed forward and broke connection sending him to the wing, so it looks like he grabbed your arm. So be super clear with send connection, no pointing forward ahead of him on the sending, so he can see the info very clearly even when overloaded with a lot of internal and external stimuli.
Great job here!
Tracy
Hi!
>Ugh! YouTube do better. 😜 Yeah, it was in an endless processing loop. >
Ha! YouTube is a cat – does what it wants, when it wants, doesn’t care what the rest of us think.
>. I am doing a LOT of reinforcing of the stay. I know I’m going to need it with him, so I really want him having good thoughts about it.
He did a great job with his stay! And the current balance of rewards leans more towards the stay rewards, which is great – the running agility part of things is going to be BIG FUN so developing all of these happy thoughts for staying is great.
You can add in lining him up at your side into the sit, which then simulates the line up and lead out. You did have the between-the-feet lineup towards the end of the session which went really well! I also like to add the leash in during these early stages of stay – moving in on leash then taking it off is actually a Big Thing to young dogs, so I don’t want them to be surprised when we bring them into trial environments.
And then you can also start to fade the platform quickly because those props get hard to fade when they are in for too long. It can be faded easily by replacing it with smaller and smaller things to sit on (like a dish towel moving to a hand towel moving to post-it note LOL). Adding in the process of line up next to you or between your feet then you lead out will actually assist in the fading process because the platform is not what creates the sit, it is the context and cues of it happening when you arrive at the position in front of the jump together. And the process is familiar and valuable, even when the platform is gone. Moving into the sit with you facing him a few feet away is a context you won’t need a whole lot of for agility and he drove into the sit faster when he was with you moving to it.
The serp countermotion went great! He was very happy to commit and drive around the barrel – great job with the reward placement too! He only had one question at 5:47, but that was probably because everything happened so fast he was not quite ready. You adjusted it for the last rep and he did great!
You can add in moving the arm up and connection shifting to the barrel, then take another step or two, then release him. That way he is not thinking the arm and the release are linked – you were being super clear about the arms moving not being the release as you moved around the jump, so you can do the same thing with arm movement which might look like a cue (but is not a release cue).>We’re heading to New Mexico this weekend for Game On! agility camp next week>
Fun! I hear it is a great camp!
> We’ll be driving the brand new RV – I’ll have to remember to share an MTV Cribs video of it with you. It’s full-on dog/remote work pimped out.>
Yes please!! Congrats on your new rig! My RV is all about dogs and remote work, but definitely not something that belongs on MTV Cribs – possibly looking more appropriate for Hoarders lately hahahaha
Great job here! Have fun!
TracyNoted, no cold or filled pasta for him LOL!!!
But what about bagel with butter?
And I am glad he likes pizza crust – I like pizza and my dogs often get pizza crust rewards 🙂 I find it very toy-like to throw LOL!!
T
Thanks for the video! Excellent work!!!
Fennel is adorable and spicy and fast and I love him!!!! You two are looking great, I blows my mind that he is your first dog!
Sorting out the distance & layering cues will be helpful because he seems like he is really fast and has no interest in slowing down. That is great!
About the verbals: Because he is relatively small, we don’t need tight turns at all on this type of line. So at :13 is sounded like you called his name or quietly said left? And at :32 maybe said left? Those might be too much turning cue for him (especially at :13 when you also turned away). He did SUPER well at 1:03 and 1:23 when you had GO as part of your verbals. His line was great, so you can play with lots more GO GO GO no the big layering lines.
> then rewarded because it was a hard jump for him.>
Throwing the reward there was excellent! You will easily be able to handle the next part if he gets out on the layering line, so making it valuable with lots of rewards was totally the right thing to do.
The other thing that will help him stay on the lines will be to sort out connection: you had your arm up high at :32 and the other 2 reps, which is fine as long as he can still see your connection (your face and eyes). You might find it easier to keep your arm down pointing at him, or even using an outside arm pointing ahead to the next jump (with your eyes on his cute face) to help him get out to the layering lines. It is all about where your shoulders are pointing, and where you look definitely influences that. Looking pretty directly at him almost always points your shoulders to where you want him to go.
> bar came down on jump 2. Not sure why, but still really pleased!>
That was a lttle disconnection moment (1:22) where as he was approaching 2, you were looking forward to and pointing forward to 3. He was trying to sort that out and ended up pulling the bar. Connection is more about what he sees – I am pretty sure you could see him there, but but with your arm up high and you looking forward, he couldn’t see the connection and your shoulders turned. So in that part of the sequence, a low arm and direct eye contact as you move will keep it fast and smooth 🙂 It will feel weird at first, possibly, but works GREAT!
One other thing for the smaller dogs to consider – even though he is just as fast as a big dog, he still has to take more strides between some of the obstacles. So to be able to set the lines into layering more easily, a small dog hack 🙂 is to run closer to the obstacles before the layering (jump 1 and 2), practically skimming the wing of the jumps. That will give him even more acceleration cues, to propel him past the tunnel and to jumps 3 and 4.
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
Tracy
Good morning!
First, let me acknowledge the hilarity of using the word “croissant” in this sentence:
“actually worked perfectly for him to grab his croissant out of it.”
So funny! But also, very effective. We really do want him to self-croissant LOL!!
And also really funny when Shaelyn had to run for her life to not get hit by him at :30 – he was not going to stop LOL!
You can also throw it sooner in the sequence more often – he was looking at you a bit on jump 3 (:09) so he did get a reward for that at :20. You can mix it up so the rewards appear out on the big lines more unexpectedly. A happy surprise is very motivating!
If you watch the section from :39 to :42 in slow motion, you will see that he is reading your cues very closely! You closed your right shoulder forward and looked ahead which accidentally cued a blind cross. Good boy! Here are isolations of what he saw:
https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1E-ww0Fgp-k0Ju6cJ8fvDC7bXN2tZAVquu_onqiYHbNY/edit?usp=sharing
Your conversation with him was so funny and you are correct about his response LOL!
So keeping your arm back to him (fully extended, elbow a locked, pointing to his nose) and your head turned to him so he can see your face will help him not think you are cueing a blind 🙂
>He seems to have the one direction figured out in this game but was unsure of the other direction>
His mechanics were good in terms of how he was moving, so his question might have been more about how the line was set. On the first couple of reps, the set was good and the reward throw was early, so it was a little harder to see what he was reading in terms of the cues.
On the rep where he had a question: The foot plant & pivot of your motion (which created a decel and sharp turn) at 1:05 pulled him off the line and also closed your shoulders before he was set onto the new line past the tunnel – he thought about it and was not sure so did not take it.
You threw the reward earlier on the next rep but I think you also set it better. One way to set it more is to get closer jumps 1 and 2, so as you turn at 2 you can move along the parallel line to 3 more and won’t get stuck at the tunnel (which is what created the decel/pivot at 1:05). So you can play with that and the reward timing can be when you see him locked onto the layering jump.
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
Tracy
Hi!
These went great!
I especially loved your blind crosses here! On the first sequence, you had a super nice BC at :34 to get the front of the jump and a super nice BC at :46 to get the backside. EXCELLENT mouse line and re-connection on both of these because he had no questions about where to go.On the second sequence, really nice blinds at 1:10 and 1:28 too! Your timing and connections are spot on!!!
He is reading the layering really well so you can propel him into it sooner so you can get to wherever you want to be next 🙂 On the first sequence, you can lead out less and start the verbal to jump when he is at jump 2 (like you did at :44). That will help you set the line and keep moving ti make it even easier to get miles ahead 🙂
On the 2nd sequence you had more motion driving into the layering at :51 and then you added a nice early verbal at :59 – no questions from Sly! Yay!
Since he is layering so well… you can totally trust him and keep moving to the next line. At :54 and 1:02 and 1:19 you slowed down a bit, but that decel cue can create collection which we don’t want here and delays you from easily getting up the line – for example at 1:28, you had a little bit of decel while he was layering so you had to work harder than needed to get the blind.
If you keep your verbal going (jump or ‘go’) you can probably keep moving at high speed there and I bet he stays on the line. It is a good question to ask him!
Great job here!
Tracy
Good morning!
>Lift & line-up between legs
1) it wasn’t strong enough for her to want to come in that close when she was too aroused>I think building it up separately from agility can help bring it into agility – and it is great for arousal regulation and keeping her close!
> 2) as she started scanning for movement more, >
It probably moved into the agility arena before the behavior was ready. So it is a fun trick to play with at home – and then they get obsessed with doing it (which can be annoying LOL) but that makes it easier to transfer to harder environments.
And it creates a fun default when the leash comes off: leash off, line up (rather than scope for motion).
On the video:
She really liked the layering and the high energy cues for it! and yay for nailing the weaves!! She is giving really good feedback about info – thanks Lift! Here is what I think she was saying:> Then decided to try to add 6 & 7 in and got some variations including her jumping over the edge of the bottom step of our deck>
In that section, it was a connection question. She was exiting the previous line and you then turned forward to talk to the jump/handle the line, instead of handling the dog who was still behind you.
She had a small question at :18 about front side or backside, you can see her make a little zig zag there. She had a big question there at :56 – There is converging motion towards the backside wing but not a lot of connection which is why she went towards the steps. Motion was the only cue she had (verbal is based on motion and position) so she was trying to sort it out.
Then at :59 – you turned your back on her (broke connection) so she only saw your back and got small mad (spin then froze) when you said ‘sorry’. I saw small mad because it did not look like The Big MADZ we sometimes see LOL!
At a similar handling the obstacle/line not the dog caused a bar down at 1:56 – when sending her into the layering, you were looking forward to the jump/pointing to it which actually turned your body to the weaves. She had questions: thought it was the weaves then realized it was not and tried to go back out, but the approach angle was too hard and she dropped the bar.
I grabbed a few screenshots of that sequence, so you can see how talking to the obstacles changes what she sees as cues:
https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1Q2U9G4VwCZVsRK5CFJ-2xORaxL67geMryqRdQrh5mPg/edit?usp=sharing
Basically, looking forward and delivering the verbal cues ahead to the obstacles (I call this talking to the obstacles 🤣😂) changes the info about the line, bringing her to the obstacle or the side of the jump closer to you based on what she sees.
So here is a fun challenge to get you talking to the dog and not the obstacles:
Using this pop out or any pop out… run it without any verbals. Just run it with connection! Old school LOL! Your arm can be pointing back to her, but not to the obstacles. You can mentally say the verbals, but say them to her in your head and not out loud. She will give you feedback on the physical cues, which is really helpful because they are really the most important cues.And when you can run it without verbals, you can add them back saying them to her and not to the obstacles. I think it will make a massive difference for her (and Kaladin too, even though he understands lines and verbals more thanks to all of his experience).
Nice work here! Let me know how the silent handling goes 🙂
Tracy
Good morning!
An outdoor trial! It took me a minute to understand what was going on LOL -I was like “wow, Barb’s field looks AMAZING” haha! Outdoor trials are no longer happening in so many places, but I really love them.
Looking at the course: the first thing I notice is that most of the distances are tiny for him: really collected one-stride distances that he handled REALLY well, good boy! And the weave independence was amazing.
>(although he goes much longer than Enzo did before turning into the weaves).>
You did give him multiple big GO ON cues until after he landed from the last jump on the line, then cued the turn to the weaves. My guess is the extra support was because you don’t quite trust the layering yet – but it explains the extension you got there. You asked for it, you got it 🙂
>I didn’t trust him on the layer, so sent him VERY long and wasted a ton of time>
Ha! I read this after I wrote the above.
>he dropped a bar that I don’t understand.>
That bar was at :17 – that section had multiple tiny distances in a row. He managed the striding brilliantly and then you stood still and said good boy… the standing still and praise turned off the delivery of info so you can see him start to look at you. As he gathered for takeoff, you started to move again so he tried to adjust over the bar (bar down).
>Maybe the bar came down because I wasn’t moving soon enough to show him the line (??).>
Yes – especially in the specific context where he has no room to adjust.
Those are definitely a bar-down triggers for Casper: praise (because there is no line info for him) and you standing still then moving as he jumps towards you.
So do your best to not praise and keep moving. Easier said than done! But also, that is something we can break out and show him more of: it is almost like a Mecklenburg recall to heel, where he has to jump in towards you on a challenging angle and tolerate your sudden change of motion as he approaches takeoff. I would start with a low bar to get success and then over the course of a few sessions add two things:
– more drama and suddenness to your change of motion
– Higher barWhich brings us back to this:
>I handled the “same” way with both Casper and Enzo.>
At this stage of Casper’s career, you might not be able to handle them the same way. You might need to handle Casper from behind more – instead of the FC in the opening, do a RC on the line. That gives him more room to adjust in the smaller spaces. Enzo doesn’t need that, thanks to experience and moving differently.
One thing I notice about Casper (and a lot of agility dogs) is that they are not super flexible and they don’t articulate (is that the right word?) their head/neck/front end as they turn. It becomes more obvious on the soft turns – and wider turns are the result. Many folks have conditioning programs, but very few focus on flexibility. So something that will really help: more flexibility! What types of things do you do with him to promote getting him to flex and bend like a noodle?
Plus, structure will influence this so every dog will move differently. As long as they know where they are going and are flexible/strong, we let them sort out how to make it happen. More on that below.
On the video:
>– As much connection as I thought I could>
Connection was great! No notes on that 🙂 Lovely!
>– Two hands on the first turn >
Getting a little more turn on jump 2 was hard here. There are a couple of reasons for that:
– the 2 hand cue needs to start before he makes a takeoff decision, so he can adjust his stride for a better takeoff. It was happening here after the halfway point between the jumps, so the takeoff decision was already made.
– the motion should be decelerated through it. Think of it as steady motion, not too fast, not too slow. You were stationary on the release then accelerated forward, then decelerated then accelerated again. Casper reads motion a lot so that seemed to be overriding the other cues. You can try leading out a lot less, releasing, moving forward and showing the 2 hands on the wheel as he lifts off for jump 1!
But also – these layering skills are relatively new to his toolbox, so he is still sorting it out. He was already a bit tighter on the lines than he was in the previous session, so I am inclined to just work on good timing and not over-running lines, to let him keep sorting it out.
>– He doesn’t know the backside verbal as much as I thought>
Totally agree! He is relying on the physical cue, and that physical cues needs to happen several strides ahead of him for now. When you could be ahead by 2 or 3 steps before he landed from the jump before the backside, he got it well! If you were parallel to a little behind him: it was a no go and he read front side based on motion (verbal and upper body did not override that).
>I feel like the secret to this is a nice sharp turn at 4 but I’m busy layering and can’t make it happen.>
Since motion and position is currently his main cue, the secret is to not go as far down the line to 3! That is what you did with Enzo so you had an easier time getting back up the line without needing to out run the dog.
>Lastly, I included Enzo doing the drill which he did easily both ways. And it was easy to see that his turns are much closer to 90 degrees.>
Yes – you are seeing the difference between an Agility Grand Champion and a dog that is newly arrived in Masters 🙂 Plus, Enzo is smaller I think? And moves differently, so those turns are a little easier. And older, so in training Casper is running faster.
Casper did a good job with the bars here, though! The bar & wing on the jump before the backside came down a few times, but that was mainly happening because he just didn’t understand the cue.
I will venture to say that the backsides are a low priority for now 🙂 so adding more distance skills to get you there sooner and also more experience for him will help.
He had a bar on 3 at 2:12 – you started to stay on the other side of the tunnel then switched and put the tunnel on your right, converging into the 3 jump. He saw that and was not sure what to do with that sudden change of motion, so took the bar.
Don’t stop for that bar for 2 reasons: it was totally handler induced by the tunnel dance 🙂 AND by the time he saw you stop, he had cleared two more bars really well (so it is confusing as to what you are giving feedback on)
>Maybe I should devote my summer to trying to get Casper to collect and turn nicely 90 degrees and do the LYD with Enzo. What do you think? If I continue with Casper, I don’t think I’ll get much benefit from this course, since we’ll wind up doing baby things, like trying to get a decent 90 degree turn.>
Excellent question. I think Casper needs to work in CAMP this summer, with our main goal being solidifying the teamwork. This includes:
– sorting out how to handle him so you feel completely certain about how to get him through a course. I think you are completely certain with Enzo. But not certain with Casper yet – and it might be a different picture than what you’d choose with Enzo.
– Tweaking distances to work him almost exclusively at the collected one-stride distances he will see at trials, like the Selthofer course. That will also affect handling choices and I think for now it will mean a lot of handling from behind then using distance, and adding FCs or BCs in places where it won’t interrupt the flow of his striding.
>since we’ll wind up doing baby things, like trying to get a decent 90 degree turn.>
Let’s not worry about getting his 90 degree turn to look like Enzo’s 90 degree turn (it won’t, they move very differently). What he needs is to work a lot of the lines at the correct distances, so he can continue to sort out his striding (he has made massive improvements), so you can sort out timing and handling choices.
Then what will happen is both of you will attack the courses with confidence – and then he will automatically tighten up the lines and turns.
Tightening up those lines and turns will happen naturally when he doesn’t have questions. He tends to drift wider when he is not sure – but that is fine for now. If we can lock in the flow and teamwork, getting rid of questions, things will get nice and tight! No questions in his brain will open up bandwidth for the mechanics of turning better, and he will sort out how to turn better AND go really fast 🙂
So I vote for NOT going back to baby things (I am giving myself a vote LOL). But we do need to work him at proper AKC distances based on the judges coming to your area, and we don’t need to worry about getting backsides at a distance for now. That will come easily when the other things lock into place.
One last thought about getting tighter 90 degree turns:
If you spend the beautiful Michigan summer working on just that turn, you’ll both stick needles in your eyes 🙂 So yes, work the recall-to-heel with the change in motion described above, and work on adding more flexibility to his body. But the rest of it will come with flow on course! And often when we time dogs like Casper running courses with us giving timely info but otherwise staying out of the way – the visual looks like wide NASCAR lines but the timer says it is the fastest way to do things 🙂So I vote for Summer Of Casper.
Nice work here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHello and welcome!!! It is great to see you here and I am excited to see Fennel! Yay!!
The video is marked as private so YouTube won’t let me see it. Can you reset it to unlisted? You should be able to do it by clicking on Edit Video then Visibility, or directly on Visibility depending on the device. YouTube loves to change settings on us and hide videos 😂
Thanks!! I am looking forward to seeing it!
Tracy
