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hi!
>>Now I just need to figure out how I want to address it for his class as I am hearing that eye contact for ready123 is a condition of his eventual graduation.>>
Hmmmmm maybe tell them you taught focus forward on your feet? LOL!
>>And he can still get fixated on movement or a sound when he is not at home. He’s slowly growing out of that and is better about focusing back on whatever we were doing but that has been more of a challenge with him than my other Shelties (not sure if the intact Male part is playing a role there as my last boy was neutered at 6months before I knew about agility and growth plates)>>
It might be a combo of slow to mature and pandemic meaning we haven’t gotten our boys out to as many places as we normally would have. I am in a similar boat: Contraband is the same maturity level of Elektra (who is 6 months younger!).
T
Hi!
>>I get a kick out of how hard you are “selling” this on the video. I get it! I get it!>>
Ha! I have to sell it because it is a different training approach LOL! One silver lining of the pandemic, I guess, is the extensive revamp of the puppy foundation program – the puppies are doing amazing things and everything is different than what it was even 2 years ago.
I am glad it made sense to Enzo! I think the video looked really good. The backside wrap should be very easy to get because you can be closer to the entry wing – the independent slice is the hard one. As you are doing the parallel path – make the big connection but don’t be so big that you turn your feet and move sideways – feet always go forward 🙂 That is why I use the outside arm with Voodoo (and to start with the puppies but I plan to fade it with them). You were rotating a bit on some of them. At :24 when you added the jump before the backside, you gave one big moment of extreme connection and outside arm for a heartbeat – that was all he needed to get to the backside. NICE! And it looks like you were way ahead and connected on the exit of that jump – very cool!
The other backside approaches looked easy 🙂 And at the end, the regular line versus get out versus backside: really nice!! He appeared to have no trouble with the differences in t he physical and verbal cues on each.The discrimination work gave him a massive brain workout, I love it! He looked largely successful (a blooper here or there is fine, it means he is getting some challenge :)) On the backside, be sure to move into it as well so he is not making the discrimination on motion or lack of motion. One of the things we add with the pups is sending them into the tunnel then meeting them at the tunnel exit to move into the next cue (wrap or backside) – the motion certainly adds excitement LOL!!
Great job here!
TracyHi!
>>“The backside is all about the opposite shoulder.”
So, THIS is the thing I never knew!That is why video has been so helpful – slow motion lets us see what the dog is reading versus not reading and Annie is a very honest dog!
>>But it makes me wonder, when do I get to point at the wing — or more generally, at the takeoff spot?
It will vary by dog and situation, and things have updated in the past couple of years. The European trend in handling (which I like) is to give the cue and assume commitment without needing to step to the takeoff – it allows the handler to get in and out of lines faster. There is more emphasis on rotating sooner, more commitment training and more verbals. OMD has updated to include a lot of this, with the OMD handlers that I know (MEB does a lot of connection work now, and I believe all of the OMD East Coast folks like Jen P, Jessica A, MEB, etc have added a ton of verbals an earlier blinds). So a lot of the rep to takeoff that we would do is now stripped out, in favor of earlier rotation, cuing with the other hand on thing line collected FCs and spins, and moving away sooner (because the commitment is more trained and less dependent on the handling, if that makes sense :))
>>And indeed, pointing at the takeoff spot has served Annie and me very well for years, but I can see where there is a lot for us to gain from Regular Connection (shoulder back). So my question is, can Regular Connection coexist with OMD-style handling where I get to point at the takeoff spot?>>
Yes, and also we can update some of the OMD moves (I don’t consider myself an OMD handler but I do follow the OMD coaches to see what they are up to, plus I do get to see lots of them at seminars when one of the Europeans come over to teach. OMD is REALLY different looking now than it was even a year ago). The trick is to basically figure out what works for Annie, creating her own system within the handling you are comfy with and what she is comfy with 🙂
>>I actually tried out my new Regular Connection at a recent trial (even though we weren’t really ready to debut it) and Annie ran around a *lot* of obstacles. Easy ones, like the 2nd half of a 180. And she flew into *every* off-course tunnel. I desperately wanted to point at the takeoff spot, but how do you point and also keep your shoulder open to the dog? What’s a girl to do?>>
Do you have any videos? It could have been a ‘goldilocks’ issue, where we need to find what is too hot, too cold, just right in the connection 🙂 And it could have been trial arousal causing the errors: young dogs don’t process things as well at a trial as they do in training, or they need info differently/sooner. If you post any video of bloopers that you have, we can look at what works and what is not working to help create the Annie System 🙂 Everything you describe is so typical of young dogs at trials, I fully expect my young dogs to do the same when they start trialing in the spring LOL!!!
Tracy
Let me know and we will sort it out 🙂
Perfect! I think the regular ‘get out’ will be more useful if your goal is good commitment on AKC/USDAA style courses. Onwards to sequences!
Hi! There are looking really smooth!!! It comes down to tiny details to sort out which is best 🙂
On the spin reps, I think the 3rd rep was my favorite 🙂 They were all good but on rep 1 at :05 and rep 2 at :13, you might have been rotated early which meant you had to hold for longer – so she looked up at you for a heartbeat when she landed from the jump. On rep 3 at :22, you moved in deeper to the tunnel and made a really nice transition into the spin: she was fast and never had to look at you, plus it looked more comfy for you 🙂On the FC at :29 – another really nice transition! The only suggestion here is that you make a clearer exit line connection so she can know sooner which side of you to be on – she was a little wide at :31 looking for the side you wanted her to be on. You had better exit line connection and :40 and her line was much tighter there.
The 2 spin moves to the other side of the jump after the tunnel both looked good! Strong transitions on both. You got into the BC after the tunnel really well! She read the second spin (rep 2) better because you kept moving out of it – on the first one, you waited to connect before moving away so she slowed down. When you kept moving, you got connection and a sweeter line. Yay!
Great job on these! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi! It is always fun when the dog also does a great job!!
No worries about the bonus jumps in the beginning: it was the only thing out there and many of the dogs are grabbing it, probably because it is the only thing there 🙂
On the out cue – she did really well! Try to keep your out hand lower, no higher than the center of your chest – you became the Statue of Liberty a few times with the arm overhead LOL! That will make it harder to run when you get it into the big sequences 🙂Backsides: this is a harder skill because the dogs can see the front side so easily 🙂 You got her going to the backside by stepping into it and using a strong connection which is perfect to get it started. She was almost perfect on lots of angles with that cue, and she was great about taking the jump (and not running past it!) At 1:07 you released the cue and pulled away a tiny bit early so she ended up on the front – ‘hold’ the cue until you see her looking at and heading towards the backside wing, then leave, like you did at 1:11.
The next step on the backside is to get it even more independent so you don’t have to step to it at all 🙂 set her up on a line that is facing the backside entry wing a little more and then try this: start moving on a parallel path to her line, with you heading towards the center of the bar (while she is still staying) then give the big connection, THEN release her with the backside cue… and keep moving/connecting/giving her backside cue. No stepping to the entry wing – see if she can push away to it. If not – move your line over to where the entry wing meets the bar on the next rep and try it without the step. If she can do it, we will keep moving you further and further over so that you can run forward, no steps needed, just using upper body connection and verbal. The outside arm helps, just remind it to stay low and not get overhead 🙂Great job here! Onwards to the sequences!
TracyHi! Lovely work here!!
Good girl Annie on the get out skills!! You had to be pretty adamant: when you gave the first cue, you were pretty polite and she did not turn her head. Then you repeated it like, “No, really, GET OUT” and she did. Yay! So fun! So keep the adamant, insistent cue going, it builds the extreme connection and helps her! My only suggestion is to try to keep your get out arm a little lower, so it is easier to run forward. The balance of ‘don’t get out’ was easy for her 🙂The backside is all about the opposite shoulder. When your opposite shoulder came forward/ahead of your body, she was nailing it: For example at :17, When she was on your right, she did a great push when your left shoulder pinged forward ahead of your body. (And double gold star that she came back and took the jump perfectly too).
When she was on your left, your right shoulder was staying back behind your body – so she did push away at :28 when you stepped in but that did open up the line to the bonus tunnel LOL!
Then compare the outside shoulder in the last 2 reps: when she was on your left at :36, your right shoulder stayed behind you and she took the front. When you switched sides and she was on your right at :42, note how your left shoulder came forward/ahead of you for a moment and that is the instant she turned to the backside. It is indeed really subtle, but Annie does the subtle thing really well LOL!!
So, to exaggerate the feeling of your outside shoulder coming forward, use your opposite arm for a few reps to point to the entry wing of the backside as you connect to her eyes. That will bring the shoulder forward. Then, as you get the feel and as she gets more used to seeing them, you can fade out the outside arm pointing and just use connection.
Let me know if that makes sense! I think you and she did a great job here 🙂
TracyHi!
Yay for getting work on the paper done!!On your skills video: it is harder when there is only one jump out there, we do get more flicking when the dogs assume that we are messing up and we *must* want the jump LOL!! But, with a bit of calling her name and frizzer magic, you worked this really nicely: she needs to trust the cue because she won’t always see the obstacle we want, when you are asking her to not take one she can see. Helping her with her name and the closed shoulder was good! You can also use more distance away from the jump and try arm-across-the-body with the reward so she can see the connection even more clearly. I liked your big parties when she got it right!! Yes, revisit it but it might be better to revisit it with a cone or jump out ahead so she can see why we would not want her to take the first obstacle she sees LOL!
On the backsides: very nice difference between front and back! Yay! Yes, you are using a small step to the backside – you can put a line on the ground for yourself to see if you can move straight up the line and fade out the step. I don’t think the step is a bad thing right now, it is small and from a distance – but as you mentioned, I don’t think you need it and it will be advantageous to be able to cue it without stepping: gets you up that line super fast and early! It looks like she understood to take the jump after the backside – perfect!
If you find that she will commit to the backside without the outside arm and only with the strong connection and shoulders – that is great because it is one less cue to give and it is easier to run forward as well 🙂Onwards to sequences!
Seq 1:
Looking at each of these reps, the camera angle was perfect to see what she was looking at before she exited the tunnel. On the straight exits, she was looking straight. The only difficulty was the timing of the turn cue on jump 3 – on the 3rd rep, you decelerated earlier so she had the best turn. You can be at the wing and decelerated pretty early with her, so when she exits the tunnel you can plan to start the decel.
On the get out reps: she was looking straight before she exited then turned to the get out right as she as exiting – which means the cue was a little late. You can start telling her to get out right before she enters the tunnel, so she is already getting out before she exits (and you can of course tell her again and again :)) I think she did a great job on the get out jump here, so telling her before she enters the tunnel will make it even easier.Seq 2:
First up, REALLY NICE FC on the purple jump to get back to the tunnel!
You were further away from the get out jump at :57 and 1:23 which put you in the perfect position for the FC at :58 and 1:24 and you were on the line and finished with it so early, great timing, lovely line, great exit line connection. I think you mentioned she used to jump behind you on the FCs and they were hard? These were fabulous.
On the next one at 1:10, you went closer to the get out jump so had to hurry back to the FC – it was almost perfect but maybe one stride late rotating so her turn was good but she ticked the bar. Still pretty darned good!
Now, the get out – as with the first sequence, try telling her before she enters the tunnel to see if she can settle her jumping in? With you further away from the jump here, it is definitely outside the bubble so she had jumping questions. She didn’t splat the bar or anything, but she jumped really big trying to process it. You can also work the skill separately by working tunnel-get out jump with you moving forward but closer at first… then gradually moving further and further away.Sequence 3:
I see the same questions on the get out jump here too, in terms of her jumping big 🙂 You were closer to it on the first and second rep but still a few feet away – it allowed you to get the turn on the purple jump pretty nicely! When you went in closer to the get out jump on the 3rd rep, it helped her with her jumping but made it later for you to get the turn on the next jump. You had better timing on the rep after that for sure and set up nicer turns on both. Two thoughts for you:
We can keep working the get out so she feels more comfy working the lead changes at that distance – both with you being closer as I mentioned above but also we can bring the get out jump in closer to the next jump – there will still be lead changes for her to work but it will allow you to get both turns.
And, these sequences are allowing us to figure out what she needs for each context: if you see this at a trial, for example, you know that the best results are when you go in closer to the get out jump. And on the next 2 reps, where you did the “come me” threadle/wrap move: that is a STRONG skill so you can choose that as your top priority! You were able to get a good turn on the get out jump AND on the come me jump too.Which brings us to this:
>I’m aggravated with myself…I feel I can problem solve and fix what I am doing wrong pretty good…even before watching the videos back. BUT, why can’t I get it on the first try??? If I know what I need to do…why do I keep making the same stupid mistakes??? Ok..this might have a lot to do with trials too.>>
Interesting insight!!! Trials are really hard because we do have to get it as perfect as possible on the first try. And you are definitely NOT making stupid mistakes! But if you feel like you are not as strong at getting things right the first time, we can focus on that! My first suggestion is to keep a list of handling reminders: literally, write it all down in the “Things To Remember For Kindle” notebook. For example, write a list of things that are strong and what context to use them in. And have a list of ‘skills in progress’ to avoid at trials.
I have a list for each dog (and one list for each dog in flyball too LOL!) and I read my list before the walk through so my strengths are fresh in my mind. That has really helped me screw up MUCH less, plus I don’t come out of the ring and *then* remember that I have a skill I could have used 🙂
So if you were to write a list of the strong skills and things to remember with Kindle, what would be on it?
Great job here!
TracyHi there!!
First sequence – This is going well – I think this is where you mentioned being earlier on the BC at the spin at :05 and :17 and I agree – you held the FC connection too long so she thought she was coming to your left side. You can go to the BC part of the spin as soon as you see commitment to the jump so when she lands, you are already looking over your right arm.
On the jump after the tunnel at the end of the sequence – you had a good verbal connection going but you ran a path that supported the jump with motion. It is fine to do that there but it was not really a ‘get out’ because your motion moved along the line (rather than forward to the red jump).When you added the FC at :28 – you had less motion along the line so it was more of a get out cue (she found it easily!) and you got the FC in on a nice line at :29! I think if you get the get out even sooner you can do the FC one stride sooner so you are further up the line when she lands.
You used an even more clear ‘get out’ at :35 and :47 to set up for the threadle – nice!!! You got the Threadle easily and then FC after it was super nice because you were right there and able to rotate early. She really was TIGHT on those turns! My only suggestion there is to start the get out cue before she enters the tunnel (then say it again while she is in and again when she exits :)) so she doesn’t even look at you and looks directly to the get out line.
Last sequence – nice opening, I was happy to see that she did not send herself out to the get out jump at :55 (you can call her before she goes into the tunnel so she knows before she exits where to go). As with the very first sequences here, go to the blind cross on the spin at :57 before she takes off: as she was landing at :58, you made a strong connection over your left shoulder so she turned too tight and had to go back out when you made the blind to your right side.
At 1:01 you gave the backside verbal but not enough extreme connection, so she took the front side. At 1:11, you used more motion to get the backside after the tunnel. A couple of ideas for you to make it easier:
– give her the backside verbal before she enters the tunnel, so she is expecting it. You were quiet til she exited, and at that point she was already turning towards you
– right before she exits the tunnel, exaggerate your extreme connection so she sees it as she exits. You were in regular connection on the send at 1:01 and 1:11 so she was not pushing away as well as the extreme connection will give you.
That will make it easier to get the super independent backside, which puts you right at the red jump to handle the 6-7 line.>>On the last sequence 6-7, i should have laid down a mouse line. It seems the tiniest arm fling now will send her>>
I don’t think the arm caused the wide turn 6-7, it was more of a motion thing: When you used motion to get the backside, you ended up cuing 6 with motion with your feet facing the landing side (and movement towards it too) – so she was wide at 1:13 for sure 🙂 With the more independent backside send, you can decel and move away sooner or add a spin there to tighten it up 🙂
Nice work! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning! She is so feisty now, barking at you LOL!
You are off to a great start here – her out is looking good! When you were coming towards the camera, it looks like you did a better job moving straight (on the first rep moving away from the camera, it looks like you stepped towards the jump on the out). It is totally normal that she would ‘offer’ the jump on the ‘don’t do the jump’ rep, mainly because there is nothing else out there (and just coming to you is not something we have worked on in a while). But then she got the idea and was perfect.
Your connections looked completely different and that is GREAT! On the ‘don’t get out’ reps you can also call her name and have a tiny bit more head turn (rather than being completely disconnected) but your shoulders being a bit closed made things look really different from the get out cue. You were a tiny bit too disconnected here but it was fine for one jump to help her understand when to NOT take it 🙂
But I think she is ready for the sequences now! So when you do the regular lines, a bit of arm back and some eye contact/regular connection should be perfect in comparison to the very dramatic ‘out’ cue. And yes, you can totally add the backsides on one jump too, I think she is ready for that as well.
Nice work!!
TracyGood morning!!
She did well here! She was super happy to commit and that is the most important part.
I see what you mean about locking onto the jump LOL!!! Good news: PLENTY of value for the jump. That is what made it harder on your right but you did work through it really perfectly. When I read your description as the vide was loading, I was going to suggest exit line connection (rewarding across your body) to help her ‘unlock’ from the jump when you didn’t want it – but you were already doing it and it really helped! It was easier when she was on your left, partially because she was not facing the jump as much (she was lined up straighter) and partially because maybe she is stickier on your left? On your right, she lined herself up to face it (and stalk it LOL!) so it was harder to get her to NOT take it. The other thing you can do is close off your connection more in the ‘don’t take it’ moments by closing your right shoulder forward enough that you are almost disconnected. But because our ultimate goal is supreme commitment at all times – don’t do tooooooo much of the ‘don’t take it’ stuff on one jump – as long as she understands it in sequence and isn’t flicking herself away, you don’t need to work it too hard. Your get out work is looking GREAT! That is more important for Miss Tilly so you can over-balance in the direction of “commit to all the things”. If she gets to the point that she is over-committing then we can shift the balance back.
I think she is ready for the sequences – getting the ‘get out’ at speed will be harder for her but super useful when she is comfy with it 🙂
Nice work!!!
TracyOh crud, somehow I missed this, sorry!!!!
I was watching his head on these to see how he responded to the various connection shifts: I think he definitely did better in setting up the turns when you were looking more directly at him, rather than swooshing forward to the landing spot (he was wider on those). Here are specifics:
On the FCs at the beginning: your regular connection and exit line connection were great on all reps 🙂 Your shifted connection was slightly different:
You were swooshy at :18 on the first one, so he landed wide then turned. At :28, you picked up the connection to his eyes much sooner and he turned much tighter 🙂 Connected more to his eyes also adds decel and rotation, which he is reading as well. At :42, you were more swooshy, indicating the landing spot more than looking at his eyes, so he was a little wider.
So looking at his eyes is the winner there 🙂On the spin reps:
The first one at :49 was more to his eyes – pretty tight!! 1:01 was more swooshy, looking ahead to the landing spot: wider. So the winner here is also looking at his eyes, like on the FC reps.At 1:13 when you moved to the next sequence, you led out laterally and he had a question about how to takeoff for jump 1 – you might have been a little too lateral for his comfort zone there, so being a little closer will help him (and you will still get to the FC).
On these FCs: At 1:17, you were indicating the landing spot with your right arm out – he was a little wide and turned on landing. On the 2nd FC on this one at 1:23, you were looking more down to his eyes and not at landing: nicer turn!!!!
One more vote for the more direct eye contact as part of the turn cues 🙂The switch at 1:35 looked REALLY good, that is a strong move for you and Wilder 🙂 I thought your left cue there at 1:41 was nice and early but he hit the bar, so maybe arms lower will help so he can see the connection more?
The last sequence also looked really good: Nice connection on the landing of 1 to set the line 2-3! The blind at 1:57 was GREAT – nice support, nice timing and very clear exit line connection. He had a really nice line there!
You had 8 on the other side of the jump, so the lines you set were good! (The original 8 was on the other side of 6) – when you took off at 2:10, you looked forward a bit so he looked at you – remember to maintain connection and give your push cue to his eyes to keep that line clear.Overall, this looked really great! The main takeaway that I see is on your turn cues, he prefers when you look at him and not support the landing side (he is committing really well without needing a swoosh to landing :)) I bet Lit’l Bit will be the same, which makes it easier because you don’t have to remember different things for each dog 🙂
Great job!!
TracyGood morning!
>>I get tighter turns with direct connection, but need to work on timing, and without changing the line?>>
Yes, he is very responsive to the direct connection AND maintains commitment so you don’t have to shift your connection to the landing spot, you can just leave for the next position. Very cool!
And because he is so responsive, it looks like you can go to the direct connection as he is landing from the previous jump – too early and he starts thinking threadle (good boy) 🙂
Tracy
