Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
Hi!
>>We took a few days off agility this week to work on Nosework
Nosework is fun!!!!
>>and learning how to behave in the world lol.
Wait, what? Are we supposed to teach that? hahaha just kidding 🙂
>>Chapter also ran into our piano and smacked his leg pretty hard on Tuesday. He limped for a outlet minutes and then seemed fine but I wanted to play it safe.>>
Ouch! Poor Chapter!!! Smart to play it safe. He looked good here!
On the serp sequences – the trick to getting the serp jump in the middle and that pesky last jump is about your running line: very close to the middle jump and not pulling away from it – so then you as run past the middle jump, you are running almost directly towards the last jump. That also means he needs to find the first jump (or the jump after the tunnel) pretty independently, which is a good skill for a young dog! When he didn’t read the line, it was because you were pulling away.
On the first video –
On the first rep – you were pulling away from the middle so he came into the gap.
2nd rep – better line to middle jump, less pulling away!
3rd – good!! You stayed pretty parallel to the jump the whole timeOn the 2nd video, to be able to get up the line to the last jump – when he exits the tunnel, be connected but running parallel (and close to) the middle jump so when he lands from the middle jump, you are on your way to the last jump.
1st rep – you had a pull away moment there
2nd rep – a little bit of a disconnect caused the oopsie, but better line as you ran past the middle jump!
On the 3rd and last rep, you were pulling away from the middle jump, which is why he did not read the turn back to the last jump.
So you can try to send him into the tunnel, use connection and a verbal cue (like “jump”) to support the next jump and run past the middle jump (serp jump) close enough to touch it, which opening your upper body up – feet running to the last jump.
You can break it down so he can read it, then work your way backwards until he can do it at full speed 🙂
Let me know if that makes sense! I think the tweak in running line is all he needs 🙂Tracy
Hi!
Good work on the sequences, it is fun to see him doing grown up stuff 🙂
1st video:
Jaakko turn – bearing in mind that the motion is more of a commitment cue than the step-back or rotation, you can actually wait longer to begin the rotation (which, as strange as it sounds, will end up allowing you to leave sooner LOL!) Here’s what I mean: On the first rep, you stopped your motion early in order to rotate – but it ended up making a bit sideways and your feet were facing the RC line – and I think a bit in the middle of the bar – so he committed then rear crossed as you stepped through. On the 2nd rep, the motion was much better in terms of moving forward longer and towards the wrap wing , so he committed nicely and turned the correct direction. And you seemed to have no trouble getting out of there for the next line. So the fast-slow transition element will cue the commitment, then you can basically turn and run away 🙂2nd video – Remember that the threadle cues the line so you don’t need to manage the line 🙂 On the first rep, you were managing too much – you changed motion, pulled and then tried to send back out so it set the line to the tunnel. Keep moving towards the next jump and only use your upper body (and verbal :)) You did this much better on the next 2 reps, and he found it nicely 🙂 You caught yourself using a jump cue after the threadle (not the end of the world LOL but not really needed) as the in in cue also cues the jump. The rep at approx :35 was REALLY nice – good timing, you kept moving, and you moved to the jump (not to the tunnel). The last rep was good too! I think he had learned the sequence by then, so remember to balance it with keeping him out on 180 or backside line rather than the threadle line.
On the zig zag grid – interestingly, on the first couple of reps he added a stride on the first interval but then easily bounced the 2nd interval. That was likely due to him having to figure out how to get organized to step into it properly (it is a really hard grid). So you can open up that first interval a tiny bit until you get the bounce back. Then as you flatten the grid – do it really gradually so he always bounces. If he adds a stride on one rep – ask for the same exact thing on the next rep. If he still adds a stride… open it back up a little til he bounces again. Then keep that configuration in place so he can bounce it several times in a row, then tighten a tiny bit. You can also play with shortening the distances in the intervals, with the goal being bouncing. There is no specific recipe that fits all dogs, so feel free to play around and see what keeps him bouncing. It will likely be a game of inches and it takes a while to get it flattened while keeping the bouncing.
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
>>I want to go back and revisit those serp exercises on the flat and on the wing, but I am not fully understanding the mechanics. You explained in detail in my comments, but I don’t think I’m getting it right. Is there any chance you have video you could post?Let me know if this helps with the visual:
(starting around 2:37)
Hi! These are 2 of the hardest skills and he is starting to really figure them out 🙂
On the threadles – keep your motion nice and sloooooow for now, so you can walk without rotating your feet, but you can also let him really see and process the hand cue and the verbal. You can get the hand cue even higher and repeat the verbal, starting before he takes off for the first jump. I think that will really help! On the reps where you were not moving as fast, he really did well with you moving forward. When you tried to go fast – he wasn’t quite ready for that speed and couldn’t quite get the threadle rolling. So keep your speed slow and you can gradually increase it while keeping your feet moving forward.He did a GREAT job on the first part of the zig zag grids!!! It is such a hard grid! The dropped bar was because of the toy dropping in early, but the opening reps were terrific. He will need you to tighten it more gradually – starting with the rep at 1:15, he started to add steps rather than bounce, so that flatness was a little too hard. On the next session, start back to where he was able to bounce it so nicely – and then maybe tighten it by an inch 🙂 If, at any point, he stops bouncing, open it back up. He has a lot of body but I am confident we can convince him to bounce this grid 🙂
Nice work!
TracyHi! I agree – the serpy stuff is really hard for her!!! You were doing your absolute best to be really clear and precise on the handling – and she still had a list of questions LOL! So – let’s change the picture. Sometimes the change of picture will make the concept click into place.
I think angling the jumps will make things MUCH easier, kind of like the zig zag grid but not as close together as that grid. So instead of the 2 jumps in the ‘flat’ position, angle the outer wings towards center, so she is almost going straight at first as you doing the serp handling. Then, you can gradually start to angle them back towards straight (like the zig zag grid) while you continue the serp handling. That should help with the send-and-go you were trying to do in the beginning of the video, and the serps on left that you were doing later on. You had all sorts of good things happening with the handling and the toy placement – she just was offering a different response LOL! So you don’t need to change the handling or toy – just try angling the jumps and see what happens. Let me know if that makes sense!
Tracy
Hi! You have gotten a lot done, she is doing really well!
ZigZag grid: her zig zag jumping looked good! Her first rep was slightly off balance but then the next 2 were lovely. The stay was hard, I think she was cheating a bit 🙂 Interestingly, she had a rock solid stay on the 5 jump grid. I wonder if she tends to break more on new and weird looking grids? Then on the ones she is more comfy with, she is more relaxed and solid. Speaking of the 5 jump grid – definitely looking good and more balanced!! And the stays were really solid (you got a nice reward in there too). She is turning into such a nice jumper, really lovely! You can keep flattening the zig zag grid and keep adding motion to the 5 jump ladder grid.
Threadle:
This was hard on 2 jumps! I think that there was too much motion for now – she was following the line of your feet and would stay on the 180 unless you turned your feet. So – for now give yourself either more of a lead out or start ahead & send her to the first jump so you can walk through it more on 2 jumps. That way you can emphasize the upper body and verbal cue – and not turn your feet. Eventually you will be able to add back the speed but for now, she has trouble separating the motion from the upper body. Walking will keep you in motion and let her process the word and arm cue to override the foot position 🙂Serp sequences –
She smoked you on first rep, just got a little ahead of you after the tunnel send. You had better position on the rest of the reps! She has a little trouble staying out on the line sometimes on this sequence and on the next video when you flipped directions – you can angle the middle jump (serp jump) very slightly towards her, so she lands looking at the bar and isn’t tempted as much to come into the other side next to you. And then with the motion on the next rep, you can add in a little name call to help her come in (although I see why you didn’t try to help her come in too much, because she had come in too much previously). Once she remembered the serp line on the 3rd and 4th reps – really nice! I think that slight angle of the middle jump will help her see it even better so you can run even faster up the line.Serp sequence video 2 – the other direction
On this one, she had trouble finding the line 1-2 with your moving parallel to it (to move through the serp line). She did better finding 2 when you stepped in and supported it with motion, so you can definitely keep doing that. And the slight angle of the bar towards her will help her find it so you can run the line you originally planned – the line is correct :), she just needed more support because it was a bit of a backside to her. Once she figured it out, she did a great job driving through the serp!! The tunnel push at the end is a hard one, you can try converging onto her line sooner so she changes leads over jump 3 to turn to the tunnel.
I noticed she was not being very zippy bringing her toy back LOL!! She might be at the stage where bringing the toy back means you will take it then line her up again, so you can have her bring it back then throw it for her again or send her off for a run with it again – just so she doesn’t end up thinking that bringing the toy back is a bad thing 🙂
Great job here! It is fun to see the pieces coming together!
TracyHaha it was me – I posted one of those birthday fundraiser because Facebook asked if I wanted to do one. So people thought it was my birthday and they donated – which is totally fine with me LOL!!!! If it is my birthday all week, I wonder if it would be OK to eat like a pig all week, or only on my birthday?? LOL!
VERY fun about the weave training!!!! He is so smart – he is picking it up quickly!
T
Hi!
It sounds like things are resuming in your next of the woods, very fun! And Jess will give you plenty of good stuff for the contact training – is her facility open again?>>Can we post videos thru late Monday night?
Sure! I will check in again on Tuesday 🙂
>>I doubt we will be able to get thru everything especially since the threadles didn’t go well. Is it worth trying the sequences anyway? At lease maybe the serps and crosses…
The serp and crosses sequences are definitely worth playing with! The threadle sequences can go on the back burner until he is happy with threadles on 2 jumps. Threadles with the handler running forward take a while to train… plus they are not that important for young dogs (which is why I started them late into the class). So no rush – it is more about building the concepts then the sequences.
Stay cool – the temperatures and humidity have gone sky high here!
Tracy
Hi!
First video – Wow, the 3 jump serp looks really great!!! You were connected and working each line! He is still having to think about it a bit (totally normal, it is a hard line for young dogs) but he is getting it better on each rep! Be prepared for him to get even faster when he is totally comfy with it 🙂 You did a good job reminding yourself to keep moving especially on the later reps 🙂 You can put a tunnel out past the last jump as a way to stay in motion!2nd video – good reward on that start line! I think he doesn’t know exactly when to start, it looks like he starts when you reach a certain spot past the jump. Sometimes you have released him, sometimes not. So be sure to clarify for him when the release is: lead out, praise, then release or reward. He isn’t being naughty, I think he legit believes it is go time when da momma reaches a certain spot LOL!
The serps are looking good – You probably don’t have to go quite as close to the 2nd jump on the send – you can probably send from further away and then leave to drive up the line. He read the middle serp jump nicely on the 1st and last rep! You were a little further ahead at :32 when he missed the jump, but he might have been avoiding it a little because on the previous rep it sounds like he whacked his feet on it? If he is sensitive enough that he doesn’t want to hit the bars… YAY!!! That is good 🙂 So you can try being as far ahead but maybe not moving quite as fast, to see if the motion was the issue. You can send from further away to get there without having to sprint 🙂
Great job, he is doing really well!!
TracyHi! I think these looked great! I liked the first couple of reps with the FC – they were on time and connected and he read them really well. I loved the next couple of reps with the blind! You were on time and connected, so that allowed the info to be even sooner and he was faster through them. I was about to say I liked the BCs better but then at about :50, you did 2 FCs – very fast and on time, and he was SUPER fast on those too. So I like them all LOL! He had the one oopsie of dropping the bar at 1:14 when you showed the toy on the re-connection – the toy was a little distracting. You did the same on the next rep and he was perfect. I think he might have been anticipating the release a little on the focus forward (leaning forward a bit) so you can throw the reward back to him when he focuses on the first jump.
Because this went so well, the next step would to spread the distances out so you really have to run run run 🙂 And alternate straight lines back to the tunnel with FC or BC to the tunnel… and you can even do FC or BC back to the other jump 🙂 Have fun with it, keep him on his toes 🙂 Great job here!Tracy
Hi! I know how exhausting it is to wrestle with the internet!!!!!! There are times where I want to go back to pony express LOL!!
But it was worth it – so much lovely work on these clips!!
Wow, zig zag looks great!!!! I think on your next revisit, you can start exactly where you left off for a rep, and then flatten it up all the way. He is doing a great job on this!!!! You can also go back to a little wider and go to 5 jumps. He is doing an impressive job on this! This grid is much harder than he makes it look.
Serp sequence:
1st rep – nice job on the open upper body to get him to come in! Then when he came in at :03, you turned forward and pointed at the tunnel you wanted… which actually caused your shoulders to indicate the other side of the tunnel so he didn’t turn back. But you fixed it beautifully on the
2nd rep at :12 – you kept your shoulders open, t*ts to target, all the way through landing – that created the 2nd turn you wanted beautifully! And great job rewarding it.3rd rep – he went past the serp jump, we’ll call it a young dog moment 🙂 He saw the juicy tunnel and you were moving and he couldn’t quite make the turn. I think you upper body position and your name call were all strong – I blame the steady motion. But the steady motion was correct handling. You got it on the last rep by changing your motion – so now on your next revisit of the serps, try to stay in smoooth steady motion. No decels to bring him on… but also don’t go too fast yet because motion is exciting to a youngster. Send him away and walk through it towards the tunnel, no change of pace. You can also do it on one jump near the tunnel 🙂 If he struggles to come in, slow down your pace but remain in motion throughout. If it is easy: go faster 🙂
Combo sequences – that first jump is a serp with a juicy tunnel distraction, so he had young dog questions when you tried to move on the first rep. Great job breaking it down and clicking him for taking it! Showing him what you want made an impact – he was then able to get it in motion when you came back around through that section with speed on the full sequences! Nice! The rest of the sequences looked good too – nice and connected, and smooth! He was able to power through really nicely 🙂
Combo sequences 2:
He did a great job on the first jump here!
He committed really nicely to the wrap jump here and you got your verbals out! Yeah!!! On the wrap – I am a big fan of using the ‘new’ arm here like you did – just add in more decel so you are rotating as you indicate with that arm, to give a stronger collection cue. At :04, you had the arm up nicely but you were still moving forward, so he took of in extension and turned when he landed. You had a MUCH better rotation on the 2nd rep at :17! He was still a little wide because it started a little late – because you switched the toy to the other hand LOL! I am sure you didn’t even realize it – as he landed from jump 3, you switched the toy. Ideally in that moment, you would start the decel then rotation. The toy switch is what delayed you by a step. So either try to leave the toy in one hand (I find that hard to do :)) or shove it in your pants (although that is kind of a large toy for that :)) or leave it on top of the tunnel and grab it on the way back before the reward. Or a smaller toy, which can be pocketed or stuck in your pants.Great job on these! Baby dog is growing up and doing some really high level skills work!!
Tracy
These are all good!!! You can also revisit the lazy game so you can stroll around and reward him for taking things. Also, it is a great opportunity to do tons of throw-back rewards for stays. Couch directionals on a wing in the house are also good (you’re on the couch, not him hahaha). I also like fitness stuff and tricks, so I can be stationary and the dog does all the work haha!
Also, for the teeter, you can set it up like the bang game, pull up a chair to the end, and have him back up into position – that is great for hind end work on the teeter!
I’ll keep thinking of knee-safe games…
TracyHi!
>>Ti took off chasing birds with Josie at his heels, I called and she pealed off him and came running back to me. How quickly which arm to use in a threadle doesn’t matter ya know? Extra cookies for Josie.
Yes, so true!!! A great recall is about 10 million times more important than threadle arms 🙂
I think 2 separate things where happening here:
Threadles versus serpsSelf-control on cookie targets LOL!
First, the threadle:
>> I was getting in my own head and trying to figure out how she would know when it was threadle vs serp. I’m just using arm back for serp, should I use opposite arm too for threadle? Other difference is threadle will have the ininin verbal.>>
Yes, verbals are different for sure. Not just the in in verbal, but I also recommend a turn verbal on the threadle jump too: if it is a really tight turn into the threadle, I might use my wrap cue and then the threadle cue. The threadle cue doesn’t really tell the dogs what to do on the jump, it is more about what to do on the *next* jump (take the non-obvious side). So my wrap cue says :turn tight on this one! then I go to “and take the non -obvious side of the next one!”
Also, positional cues are different (serp position is different than threadle position, in terms of the lines we run).
Now which arm? Personally, I see no reason to lock yourself into only one arm cue. I use the dog-side arm (also known as the “open door arm” when we swing it back) sometimes – but only on the easy threadles where I am in a great position. I use the cross arm on the harder threadles and also when I am behind (the dogs just don’t see the open door when I am 20 feet behind, ya know?) So train both and then you will begin to know where/when she needs to see each one.On the video, she was doing well and I really liked the balance rep where she seemed to have no trouble staying out on the 180 🙂 Yay! Try to just keep your upper body open and not rolling in and out to cue the 2nd jump. The oopsies were more about the cookie target 🙂
So on the cookie target – for threadle games, for now – use an empty cookie target. Separately, train her to ignore a cookie on the target (or a toy on the ground) and come in and touch your hand – come to momma then maybe you will go back out for the cookie 🙂 You can start with a remote feeder, or a bag of treats, anything where she can’t exactly self-serve 🙂 Then go back to the naked cookies on the target. On the threadles, she wasn’t lacking understanding the threadle cue – we can’t assess understanding of it because she was just locked onto the cookie 🙂 So the empty target might be just enough distraction for now on the threadles/serps as you build in understanding on ignoring naked cookies 🙂
Let me know if that makes sense! She is doing well on these!!
TracyGood morning!
Threadle concepts are hard, so no worries if it takes a few sessions to build them up. Teaching threadles are definitely an up and down progress!! It can be frustrating, I feel that pain. One thing I definitely recommend is to balance with 180s more than you did here. I’ve found that dogs go into threadle mode, so the threadles look so easy in a session… but then go to poop when we try to show the dog the difference between the 180 and the threadle. On your first 180, he was still threadling – then he go into 180 mode LOL! Totally a normal session – so I do more alternating of the 180s and the threadles while the jumps are still angled (the 180 is more of a backside, but that is fine). More balance will let you know if he is actually responding to the cue, or if he is just in a rhythm.
So, using a slightly angled threadle set up, do more alternating within the session. Also, give the cue for the next thing on approach to the first jump – you were giving the in in when he landed. Now, it was easy on the easier set up but it got harder when he had to see the 180 side as well.
You can also add in more space between the threadle jumps, so he can have more time to process the cues: 10 feet wing-to-wing can help! And you can stand kind of in the middle and send him to the first one, so you are ahead and can give him the cue as he is on the way to it.
Threadle cues rely on the ‘weaker’ cues (arm and verbal) to override strong cues like motion – so it takes time and can be very up and down (just like running contacts LOL!!!)
The set point looked really good – in typical Benni fashion, he processed the challenge of the new jump height and was just fine here. Yay!!!
Let me know what you think! The threadle process is frustrating sometimes, but you are on the right path for sure 🙂
Tracy
