Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
Good morning!
Yes, the hardest part of this style of backside training is to say the LaLa to him and not to the barrel 🙂 Saying it to the dog’s eyeballs when he is behind you will cause you to turn at your waist a bit and pop your outside shoulder forward of your body, which is the cue he is reading (not the eye contact). If we look a little ahead, the outside shoulder ends up behind our bodies which is more of a front side cue. When Your 2nd rep was more to his eyes so he got it, 3rd rep (:38) was more to the barrel so he took the front. 1:00 was more to his eyes – and voila! Backside LOL! Same with 1:26 and after that 🙂 Yay! Looking good!
It also helps if you move for 2 or 3 or 4 steps up the line before you release him with the lala – that way he can read the line of motion to find the backside and it will be much easier to move further across the bar as you add challenge. You were generally releasing and moving within a step, so he had to read the motion and hear the verbal all at once. He seems to have a fabulous stay, so this is a great time to put it to use 🙂
Nice job here!
Tracy
Hi!
>>so I think I might use left and right to be loose and loop and ri-ri as tight turns.
Perfect! That sounds like a good plan!
I think he did really well with the threadles – but yes. do less with your arm to help 🙂 At :47 he started to sort out that he he had to leave the hand cue in order get the tunnel, so now keep going with that concept – the hand cues both the in-then-out so he doesn’t need to wait til it shows him the out element.
About rewarding… – was he just not terribly interested in the toy? You can use a ball for this, or a manners minder out at the end of the tunnel (the remote feeders actually add a decent amount of challenge in the impulse control department too!
>> I also will have to add some balance in my next session because I’ve been doing about 99% treadles lately – time to do some “tunnels” too.
Perfect! I think this will be easy for him.
Serp countermotion – This is also going really well! You can reward sooner to help get the ball rolling at the start of each session. As he is looking at the bump, you can toss the cookie back to the landing spot on the other side of the barrel. That will also help keep his eyes off of you as you move forward, so he will be looking at the barrel & bump. He is better at looking ahead when he is turning to his left (2nd half of the video) than to his right – interested! But either way, that earlier throw and having the treat land on the other side of the barrel (away from you) will totally help solidify this, especially as you go to the advanced level with even more motion.
Porridge heating:
>> I’ve been working with him on going silent and holding the toy close to me as a cue to let go (for now, until I can start adding a verbal). And he was releasing and not jumping much.>>
Yes, he did really well! Remember to reward the release by giving him the toy right back as a reward, rather the cuing a behavior. The immediate toy-as-reward for the release makes a big impact and gets a faster and more reliable out 🙂
The toy play went really well, he was engaged and in a good state of arousal (his sit at the end of the toy session was spot on!) It was a little challenging – his responses to certain behaviors were not quite as shaprt as they might have been with cookies? But he did get them on the 2nd cue – and so it was a good oportunity to work through stimulation.
Cookies are naturally less stimulating – so his responses were very good on the first cue for the most part and his sit was also really good. So, with food (because it gets him slightly “cooler” than toys): if you want him “hotter”, you can cue a trick, run a few steps, then deliver the dancing cookie. I think that will bring him into a similar state as a toy would and can be super useful for places where either he is not yet comfy playing with a toy, or you don’t want to use a toy (I often use food right before I go into the ring, not a toy). Being able to use both and then choose based on the situation is ideal, so he is off to a VERY good start with this! It is definitely a game to bring into as many places as you can 🙂
>>And I did a session of the left/right with less motion and we was ticking the bumps/bars less. I might do one more session like that and then add motion back.
Great!! I think that is a good plan. The ticking will stop when we educate him about the specifics of jumping and when he doesn’t have to multi-task as much.
>>How long will you be taking homework videos for this class? We’re off on vacation next Wednesday…
Wow, that sounds *wonderful*, I hope you have a fabulous time!!!!!!! I figured generally the 15th would be the last day, but if you have videos after thatm feel free to put them here and I will take a look 🙂
Have fun!
TracyHi!
Thank you for the kind words 🙂 I appreciate your willingness to try all these new things, you and Kai looked AWESOME!!!!
>> I have a concern about working live with Kai as he will be 5 mo old ( not as old as you desire) and we aren’t as far along as this class went( we are working on it).
You are more than welcome to work live! We can break things down (or build them up) as needed – I let the pups lead the way on that! Some of the games will build on what we are already doing but also there are plenty that are brand new and no one knows yet (I guess I better teach my own puppies to get the games on video hahaha!) My smaller pup, Elektra, is 5.5 months old so she is very close in age to Kai.
>>Our next video is coming!!
Yay! Can’t wait!!
>> Ps.. i feel too many of your current students excel way beyond me.. i showed 2x in agility and both lost both of those dogs to death/disabilty issues. Starting again is so much fun and you are teaching me amazing skills not even approached by my past classes.>>
I am so sorry to hear about losing your previous agility dogs. Heartbreaking! And you are not behind anyone else – we all have moments of glory with the puppies where everything goes perfectly! And moments where it feels like we have never picked up a leash in our lives. Ha! I try to leave some of those in the video 🙂 In many ways, you have an edge because you are more of a ‘blank slate’ – nice young puppy and you don’t have any baggage from former techniques (which means you don’t have to unlearn anything, you can start fresh :)) The mechanics of training are the hardest part and those just take practice – and you are doing a great job with that, especially with such a quick puppy 🙂
Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
This was not a bad session really, there were lots of really good parts and there were parts where he was clearly communicating what he *thought* the release was and where the value was 🙂The first :28 seconds looked awesome! And there were other really good reps in there too. No need to release to just you – the configuration dictates the chain of in then out – which is why at 1:07, he came towards you then back out (on the other side of the jump because you were blocking him, so he was just moving the chain over).
Now about breaking the stays on the station: I think 2 things were happening with that. First, I think he was predicting that when you assumed the serp arm position, the release was next – so on the reps at :45 and :57, he held the stay and self-released on the same rhythm that your releases came earlier in the game. Some dogs are very rhythmic, practically musical, and Lazlo appears to be one of those for sure. Dogs are brilliant predictors, so that is what he appeared to be doing. Smartie! And, second, the value of the serp game is very high right now (yay!) so he was happy to leave the station to engage in the game (and, because the value of the serp game AND the station are both high, he did not appear to get frustrated or disengage when things were not rewarded – that is great!)
So, a small tweak for you should help (I do this ALL the time because it turns out that I am VERY predictable according to all of my dogs HAHA!): throw rewards back to him on the station as you move into potision and more importantly: when you assume the serp position. Make the rhytm unpredictable 🙂 What I mean by that is: as you move into position, put your arm out – then throw the cookie back to him (he is going to leave the station to get it, which is perfectly fine). That helps him understand that the position does not necessarily predict the release: only the verbal predicts the release. Because he learned it originally from a cookie toss, he might read the position & hand signal as the cue and needs more understanding that the release is the cue in this case.
You did reward him really nicely on the station, but it was with you always going back to him to deliver it. So, by showing him the position and then, while you show the position, throwing a reward to him – that will help clarify that he should wait for the verbal and not try to anticipate when the hand arrives in position 🙂
So – yes you can totally keep working on the stay as a separate thing, but you don’t need to stop advancing the games! You just need to transfer the stay into the games by helping clarify what the release is 🙂 I don’t think of it as a few steps backwards, I think of it is a clarification.
Let me know if that makes sense!
TracyGood morning!
>>Session at lunch I used food and toy for the evening session. He had trouble doing a spin but that is a harder trick. He offered a sit after each time. Last night I tried this inside with food and he could only offer a down (even when I asked for a sit). I have to edit those sessions down before I post them.>>
The spin is harder especially with the toy, I think because the pups need to turn away and they can no longer see the reward. He will figure it out, though 🙂
Interesting about the down inside! You might have been leaning into him a little bit? Or sometimes the added stimulation results in a down with herding dogs.
Porridge heating looks good – he has lots of good tricks that you can totally build into an eventual start line routine. One suggestion with food – use it more like a toy 🙂 Have him chase you for it (run a few steps then deliver it) and/or have him put his front feet up on you to get it. That is very stimulating, which helps get engagement especially in new locations. He was caught in a bit of a crumb search or odor pool when the cookies were stationary, which means he was *almost* in the perfect porridge zone but not completely.
Minny Pinny looks good! He seems to be pretty equal in left and right, in terms of bending and being able to bounce them. He is alternating between bouncing and trotting so you can tighten the distance maybe 6 inches to see if you can get more frequent bounces.
On the toy porridge moment – this got him ready really well! No cookie odor distractions and I think the minny pinny after it went better (nice bending and more bouncing). It might also have been a cooler time of day, which helps too 🙂 It looks like you widened the distances a little and it took him a couple of reps to get the bounces going again, but he did! Yay!
Great job on all of your minny pinny reps with your placement of reinforcement, it really helped continue the bending! I agree that he was more comfy bouncing with the bumps in a little closer together, but he was able to sort out the bounce very quickly at the bigger distance, so you can leave them at the bigger distance at this point.
Great job!
TracyGood morning! Looks like you made the most out of your practice time!!!
Minny Pinny: There is so much I like about this session! He is bending really nicely and has sorted out how to bounce and not add additional strides. He also seems to be going into the minny pinny on the left and right verbals as the CUE and that is exactly what we want. Yay! You added additional countermotion challenge and he did fine until you got a bit too far ahead while moving quickly.
Here is an additional challenge for you – mainly a flexibility training element for him:
start him in the same position he ends in on the reps without countermotion, where he is parallel to the pinny. The difference is that you will be in between him and the wing, as opposed to the ending where he is between you and the wings (let me know if that makes sense). But starting him parallel to it (same as the ending) you are asking him to bending into that first bar/wing too. When we start the pups straight on, the bend is not as challenging but it looks like he is ready for more 🙂Serp exits are going well! He had one rep where you were a little too far past the wing so you opened up your arm too much, it looked like a fancy threadle and that is what he did LOL! The rest were awesome – great commitment! Nice job with your connection too!
>>I noticed that I released too early once I watched my videos.
I thought you were fine, actually – because you kept moving. So he heard the release right as you were passing the exit of the wing and then you were clearly on takeoff side when he approached it (allowing him to commit AND set up a nice exit turn).
I am super happy with this and think your timing was good! To put it in perspective, Voodoo didn’t get good at this commitment until he was 4. Years, not months. LOL! Stark is doing beautifully!
You might have done this, but be sure to run all the way around on some reps but don’t release – instead, go back and reward him for that awesome stay.
Using the tunnel is great fun! You can also drop the toy and drag it for a good chase on the exit too.Great job!!!
TracyGood morning!
He did really well on the 3 wings! They are not too big 🙂 And trooting is what to expect at the stage – he is thinking about bending his body and that is much better at a trot for now than at a gallop. Before adding the verbal, add in the jump bumps or low bars – the verbal is attached to the act of going over the bump/bar, so we want to be sure he is fine with those and then you can add the verbal. I think he will be fine with it, so you can probably add the verbal in pretty quickly! Fun!The rocking horses are going really nicely too!
>>Sometimes he can get a little sticky with committing to go around the wing, but he did well here>>
Did you see anything sticky in this session? I think of sticky as him stopping near the wing and not continuing around it, and I don’t think that happened here. He was slowing down a tiny bit to make the turn, but that is a good thing 🙂 If you are seeing him stop in front of the wing, you can keep the balance of value by throwing reinforcement out past the wing on a few reps. The reinforcement here was generally near you, so he might be wanting to stick closer to you. The spin look good! And the connection is looking good too. Yay! A couple of different ‘next steps’ to keep building this: if the weather is good, add more distance outside so he can feel the wind rushing by and get more speed going 🙂 That can allow you to turn and leave sooner too!
And, without more speed and indoors… keep working to bring the toy play into this (without food present at first). You might start with one or two wraps, but then you can gradually build it up to a toy-only game (eventually, no rush on that :))Speaking of toy play – I typed the above stuff before I read your next paragraph LOL!
>>He is doing great from going to training with treats to toy play! >>
Yes! Happy dance!
The toy play definitely looks like play, he is doing really well with playing and handling the arousal of it all.
Yes, you were a tiny bit twitchy on that first rep but it was actually a great opportunity to see how he does after a small error – and he didn’t get chompy or frustrated! It looks like he sniffed your hand for a treat and then did a good wrap. Yay! That is great! The 2nd wrap also looked really good- you can slowly move away sooner so that he doesn’t hit the wing when you give the ‘chase’ cue – but I love how he was able to play, be explosive AND be accurate all with the toy. Very exciting!!!!>>Also, I see there is another class after this one, yay! Would you say it’s okay to take that class even if we haven’t done the advanced version of all the exercises in this class yet? I have followed this class pretty well, but I know there are a couple games I didn’t do at all. Just want to make sure I won’t be behind for the next class…>>
Yes, you are totally good to go for the next class! We have a few weeks before it starts and then you can always hit the advanced games as that class goes along. There will be games in there (the jumping foundation and the proofing games) that are completely unrelated to the games here – new and different 🙂 And I can also give folks reminders of which games ot brush up, in advance of anything new we add.
Great job on these, he is doing really well!
Tracy
Good morning!
>> I have just signed up for the next Max pup session – very excited about continuing.
Yay! It will be so fun!
>>Could you let me know when the current session finishes?
September 15th is last day for videos 🙂
>>– I am taking a trip back to New York for a couple of weeks, so probably won’t be able to do much training – so might be too late when I get back 🙁 – but we’ll try to catch up before the next session starts…..>>
Hopefully you will get some time in, if not – no worries! You can catch up later on and the next session has stuff that is totally different too 🙂
Have a great trip back to NY!!
Tracy
Awww thanks! It was so fun to see Demi develop into a big time agility BEAST this summer! Go back and look at your first videos and compare to the recent ones…. wowza!!!! So much progress – she is a really fun teammate 🙂
Hope to see you soon in person or online!
TracyYay! This worked, thank you 🙂
She is still so little! I love it!This was a REALLY nice session: she is showing really excellent commitment to her ‘job’ of going to the wing and wrapping all the way around, even on hard angles and as you were moving forward with a ton of countermotion: excellent!!!!! Have you thought about verbal wraps cues for her? I suggest a cue that means wrap-left and a different cue that means wrap-right. She is ready for you to start adding them. I also think you can start the rocking horse games: the wing wraps are really looking good!
(Apologies if you were using a verbal, the sound on my computer is bad and I couldn’t hear it 🙂 )>>There is time she want to offer to do it without me asking her. Is there a way to make sure she works with me instead of doing it without my verbal ?>>
I see what you mean, like at 1:24 when she went behind you to restart or at 2:00 when she wanted to be sent to the wing and you wanted her to come to you. Two ideas for you:
you can reward her for coming back to you. It is easier & faster to reward with a quick cookie (if she likes them :)) and then go back to the toy to reward the wraps. Now, if she doesn’t love cookies OR if the cookie might cause her to lose interest in the toy, you can reward with the toy for both coming to you and for wrapping the wing. That is a lot of reward but she will love every minute of it 🙂
Also, on the last rep at 2:24, you did a short, gentle restraint before you sent her to the wing – she seemed to like it and did a great job on the wing. You can add that in on each rep: reward her for coming to you, then gently restrain her, then send her.
Let me know what you think! This is looking great 🙂
Tracy
Ha! I understand about the shoe. With Elektra, I used an old sun hat that I never wore. It can even be a random box, anything that is easy to carry.
Good morning!
>> I have often used the off side arm on a Serp, but only when I’m ahead of the dog and want to be sure they know to come in over the jump.>>
Yes, in the rare moments when I am way ahead 🙂 I might put up the off side arm to help guarantee it because it adds that extra bit of chest rotation. The dogs just roll their eyes at me because they understand their job LOL!
>>>On the Rocking Horse set, I realized I was pushing her and giving all the “go on” signals that I shouldn’t have. Yes, not only is she honest, she’s keeping me honest. 😊. I still may try a switch of barrel location to see if the equipment makes any difference to her. So interesting to see what does and does not click for different pups.>>
Perfect! Sounds good!!!
>>On the pinwheel, I wondered if narrowing the gaps would help her bounce, so we’ll give that a go.
Keep me posted on how she does with that!
T
Hi there!
These were fun to analyze, so much good stuff!Lit’l Bit:
I like the way you executed rep 1 and rep 2, but I think the blind cross 3-4 at :25 really drove her! On the first rep 4-5, I think you can get more speed if you run into the tunnel so you are almost behind and out of position, I think she likes chasing you like that. When I timed that section, the wrap to the inside was about 3/10ths faster. That can be a product of more speed because of the blind, plus the shorter distance. It is possible that the slice line can end up faster if you push her harder but it was cool to see the wrap and shorter distance be so fast!!! She wraps really well so the wrap to shorter distance is something to look for on her courses for sure.Seq 3:
On the first rep, it as a good blind at :42 but it looks like you were maybe one step off the line so she read it as a backside. I think the blind is a great option there, so one step further over should get it. The rear cross looked good but probably not as fast as the blind would be. When I compared the RC to the outside line to the wrap to the inside line… as with the first sequence, wrap to the inside (shorter) line was about 3/10ths faster – at least she is consistent LOL!! That is good to know, because in this scenario, it was probably easier handling too! It doesn’t always work out that the easier handling is also the fastest line, but it is certainly great when it does work out like that 🙂Wilder’s turn: Seq 1:
On the slice reps, I liked how you drove him 3-4 on the first rep, it was really nice! You helped more on the 2nd rep and it caused him to look at you. But, speaking of helping: on the first rep you got ahead on the way to the tunnel and he pulled the bar. You waited for him as he rounded the wing of 4 and had more connection on the way back to the tunnel on the 2nd rep – and nice jumping, no bar. So that definitely goes in the plan: wait for him on those big lines so you are 10 feet ahead or less and can show connection strongly.
When I compared the timing of the slice to the outside versus the wrap to the inside – the slice to the outside was faster (opposite of Bit!). When you wrapped to the inside, you held onto him longer – is that a post where he might back jump if you left early like you did with Bit? That was where the time was lost, the wrap might be as faster or faster than the slice if you can leave and not hold onto him. But… if he needs the help to NOT back jump, it is better to slice 🙂 I think I heard you say something about getting out of there on the video, maybe that is what you meant 🙂 He turned really nicely on the jump so it is worth it to see if he will continue around if you move out of it sooner.Seq 3 : looking at the #5 bar, the time he dropped it on the video was when you sent to 4 and left, so he went into chase-da-momma mode. On the next rep (FC) and the rep after it (RC), you waited longer til he was around the wing of 5 and he had no trouble jumping it (and lots of speed). So that is a biggie for him – waiting for a heartbeat before moving up the next line.
Comparing the handling choices – the FC was in a good spot and he did not look at the backside of 4 at all 🙂 You can probably also try a blind there with him, it might be easier/faster than the FC? Or the FC might be the most connected, which he might find helpful with the bar on 3. Definitely worth playing with it because the FC was the fastest option – but not by much 🙂 the wrap to the inside was the 2nd fastest – and can be faster if you can leave sooner and trust him not to back jump (if you think he will back jump so you can’t leave sooner, the choice would be the FC to the slice :)) The RC to the slice to the outside looked really good, but was the slowest of the 3 options. Now, they were all within a couple of ticks (maybe 3/10ths total) so they were almost all as fast as each other – it becomes a matter of choosing the one that helps support the jumping without slowing him down.Great job on these! The hardest part for you is that Lit’l Bit and Wilder are pretty different – for example, on these, Bit is wrap to the inside and run run run. Wilder is slice to the outside, wait for a heartbeat, then go. I keep lists of each dogs’ needs when I am running more than one dog – it is too much of a brain fog for me to keep it all straight without writing it down. I review the lists before training and trialing (the lists are on my phone :))
Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
>>I like the let’s balance the ball on the back while we spin truck, going to have to see if I can train that.>
I was confused by this til I saw the video – holy cow! Hysterical!!! Totally train it then onwards to America’s Got Talent LOL!!!
Cody did well here, both on the ‘regular’ reps and the ones that started with the backsides. I am impressed by his ability to execute this because it is probably one of the hardest jumping exercises that I know of – and he is a big dude! He is double tapping his front feet on some of the intervals, which means he is still trying to figure out how to get organized and use his hind end. So an idea – The next time you play with this, start with the angles a couple of inches ‘open’ so he can bounce each interval. Then on each rep, make the interval one inch tighter (ideally he continues to bounce and not double tap). The goal is that he can bounce even when the grid is straight, and started with a rep that is open can help remind him and then each rep will be slightly harder. If he starts to double tap, you can open up that interval by an inch, as it might take more than one session to get the grid back to flat.
And bonus points if he can balance the ball on his back while doing it LOL!!!
Great job!!!! Hope you enjoy the holiday weekend!!
Tracy
