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Perfect! And it gets Lu into the mode of “we get in the car and go to the agility place” to help her body acclimate to the travel. It might not seem like a lot, but it really can be for adolescent dogs. Are there any Lu-Level classes coming up? Or seminars? I always put my youngsters into classes or seminars that are one or two steps below what they can actually do, so I can make it a great time for them without stressing any of us LOL!
>>16 select Speedstakes for the Dec trial for NFC>>
Yay! This is on turf? If she is not turf-experienced, can you get her into a class or ring rental there? We don’t want her to have to think about a new surface when asking her to also think about all the other things at a trial.
Tracy
Good morning! Congrats on a great debut!!!!!!
She did great in a busy outdoor environment! Where is this? It is a lovely facility! Nice job with the patterns and playing outside the ring, walking past other dogs, then playing at the start line to get her engaged, her line up and stayed looked just like home and you even asked her to focus on the first hoop! Nice! She also did well ignoring the walk through in the other ring even though it was clearly visible.
>For a dog who, as you put it, has been essentially āhome schooled,ā she ignored SOOOO many distractions that could easily have drawn her away from working with me>
Yes! I was so proud of her and of you too, for helping her!!!!
Grounders
>>She was telling me that having the toy in my hand might have been causing her to jump up and bite at me. Iām not entirely sure what she meant since I didnāt think she did that (and donāt see it in the video eitherā¦), but I felt like it was not so much training advice as much as it was a warning that it could be considered problematic.>>
Katniss was not jumping up and biting! But she did curl into you on the last line because the āgoā is not yet a strong skillā¦ Maybe that is what the judge thought was biting? It looks like you were politely listening and thanked her, which is great. And on the 2nd run, you just needed ore exit line connection to be able to show the next line – you got some curling in and barking.
>>I sure wish I had remembered that I could have thrown the toy at the end of the run instead of having it in my hand.>>
Yes! As you build that GO skill either throw the toy or if you are in a no-throw venue (AKC), donāt ask for a Go. Ideally, you get to UKI and have someone else throw it š I tell people to throw it as soon as they hear me start saying GO GO GO š
>>There is a decent chance she may have done a lap with the toy before coming back, though, and if there was a dog on the line already, that could have been problematic.>
Bring 2 toys š One stays in the pocket. Throw toy #1. Then as soon as she gets to it, whip out toy 2 to have her come right back to you. She might leave Toy 1 somewhere, but that is fine, someone will get it for you.
>>I was worried that it would be frustrating for her to have to stop after just a couple of things since she LOVES to move her body and GO FAST!!! >
For simple lines, keep going. For things she might not know that well yet (RCs and GO lines), or longer sequences – break things up and reward, then reset and keep going.
Jumpers:
Lineups and stays looked good here! I think the running past jumps will go away when she has less to process in the environment. She got all the jumps on the 2nd run AND did a rear cross!!!!!Chance 1 – fun to see her be able to function so nicely outside the ring here. Very mature for a baby dog!
Yo can see the tugging was not as easy for her here, so you can ask for tricks and also change toys to something new and interesting.
She was looking around a little more at the line too, so playing with her definitely helped.>>There was a 180 degree turn over two jumps; it seemed to be a disconnection issue there. Instead of stopping, I did a circle and brought her back. I thought Iād trip over her if I didnāt swing her back around to be able to get the front cross in after that 2nd jump. Iām hoping this was ok to do!>
I think she was reading your decel into a stationary position as a turn cue, so she exited the tunnel coming towards you. Leading out less and accelerating with more connection will totally help her out (and throwing the toy :))
The rest was smooth and connected and worked great!!!! It falls into the ākeep goingā category because you kept moving and got success.
Chances 2 – wait, did a run even happen? LOL! It took 3 seconds? I think it looked really good!
>>you can tie your toy onto your leash for the dog to grab, so it wasnāt very long after the run that she got the toy.>
Very cool that NADAC lets you do this! UKI and NADAC are the only ones. While I am thinking of it:
Will she tug on her leash? That is a toy that can come into the ring for AKC as well, so getting a nice tug leash will be a good thing to have!
On the tunnelers videos:
>The only thing I noticed in terms of focus was a delay in sitting at the startline. Iām not sure if that was due to distractions or just being mentally tired. >
On the first tunnelers run, you can see outside the ring and at the line she was less engaged – was it because you only used food outside the ring? Or end of weekend depletion, or all of the above? Either way – if she is not engaged, ask for her tricks and get her engaged rather than pull her up by the collarā¦ the tricks will optimize her arousal and engagement more than pulling her collar will.
Looks like there was some of that too on the 2nd run – even if it is a real run, you can still play with her at the start line, do tricks, etc – then let her respond to the line up cues like she did in the earlier runs.
That 2nd run was gorgeous!
>>(although I think I started my brake arms and verbal way too late!).>>
A little late but she was still able to process them and found the correct tunnel. Super!!!
>>You canāt see it in the video unfortunately, but that definitely happened, lol. I again did a big swoopy circle to get her back on track. I really needed her to go into tunnel #2 so that I could get ahead for a blind after #3, which is why it was worth it to me to āfixā it.>>
Yes, on the first run, I couldnāt see you but I could see her response and her anger LOL!!!
For me, a āfixā is when the handler stops and walks back towards where the error was to fix that one spot. Dogs really get frustrated/stressed by that. Staying in motion and creating a circle back around to where you need her to be (like you did in the Chances run) makes it feel like you were continuing the course PLUS it set up success for the rest of it (no chaos!) so she was very happy with it š
At the end of both tunnelers runs, she curled into you and barked – high arousal and not knowing what to do. So definitely prioritize getting your remote reinforcement skills going, so you can say the marker and she can run towards the leash/toy combo (in NADAC she will have to let the person hand it to you, but that is better than barking at you LOL!! In AKC, it will be a leash marker before the reward marker (unless it is a tug leash!!). The barking at you at the end of the course can easily become jumping up or biting, so we want to let her know what to do instead š
>YouTube told me I had reached my limit for uploads and needed to verify my account or wait 24 hours to post anything else>
Youtube is so weird!!!
Congrats again!!!!!! Team Katniss had a super weekend!!!!
Tracy
Good morning! It sounds like he did really well this weekend!
>I was purposefully putting on the podium to warm up to keep him out of so the distraction not knowing the point was to have him practice working with distractions!>>
Exactly! The pattern games are designed for his brain to process the distractions, and his success on the podiums told us he is ready to do them on the ground, moving through crowds, etc š
>> First it was just weaves-reward-leave then jump-weaves-reward then jump-weaves-jump reward. I guess it was at that point that I started working up to the weaves rewarding and leaving. So again, great observation that I basically started rewarding only at the end of the course.>>
I think you might be putting too much emphasis on the weaves, too š The weaves are the 2nd hardest thing in the ring (moving to the start line and then doing the stay is the hardest for the dogs!) so it is possible that if there is too much pressure on weaves, even with a toy being produced: that creates pressure in the ring as a whole, which can make it harder to do the weavesā¦ so there is cycle that makes it harder for the dogs.
>I tried to be more strategic this weekend and reward mid-course. After that I took the time to reset and reengage and it made quite a difference.>
Perfect! One of the big goals of NFC/FEO is simply to make the ring a super fun, easy place to be. A grand time, a big happy party, no pressure, easy, fast, and fun š Then when that is established with the easy stuff like tunnels and jumps, we can gradually slide in the hard stuff – stays, weaves, etc. and doing it all with the reward less and less āinsideā the ring. The dogs let us know when to move to the next step: I am getting 2 whippets started and they are basically the same age: one gave me the big go ahead to add a harder behavior at the last trial (based on his engagement and relaxed but focused ring entry) and they other said nope, keep it easy (he was looking around more, not quite as engaged, so I kept it easier).
>As far a vet checksā¦. Heās been to three different vets (two are also chiro) for physical exams and no one has seen anything of concern. That said it would be my preference to get him to a sports ortho but there are none locally and appointments have a long wait time. Iāll start with seeing if I can get a local ortho surgeon to do the X-rays and go from there. š>>
I am glad no one saw anything of concern! I take my dogs to a soft tissue specialist in NC but it might not be too far from you: Dr. Marie Ballengee at Pawsitive Steps
https://www.pawsitivestepspetrehab.comShe is AMAZING and works with a lot of sport dogs!
And getting trigger point massage people to have their hands on him is good too – Beverly Adams works on my dogs locally, and Donna Devanney when we are in NC. They āknowā the dogs so can tell me if something is different or tight or hurting.
Keep me posted on how he is doing!
Tracy
>>We donāt have any here in Oklahoma.>>
Thankfully, AKC has made good changes to their FEO program! And is there any USDAA around?
T
Hi!
Bummer about all the rain but you still got some excellent training in!
He did well with the end of run work and also the tricks – and we got some good info!
Two things I noticed:
When he is in work mode, he doesnāt really want to be touched or played with using your hands. You can see it after he did a few tricks then when you reached for him or tried to pet him or gently tap his ribs, he backed away every time. You can see it when you reached for him at the beginning to get the leash on, and also after the hand touches at 1:06 and 4:10 – great hand touches then when you praised and reached towards him, he backed away.This is entirely normal when dogs are in āwork modeā and a higher arousal state – most are all business and donāt want to be touched. The ones that like to be touched will move into your hands, the rest move away. And that is fine! (I can relate – when I am very focused and in work mode, I find it icky if someone wants to touch me or hug me LOL!!!!)
This is good to know, because he is perfectly happy to follow you and do the next thing, so you can have him do that instead of reaching toward him.
That will also help for getting the leash back on – he can slip his head through it nicely but moves back when you move towards him. So you can hold the leash open like you did on a lot of the reps, and even lure his head into it the first few times – that can quickly shift into him moving his head towards it then through it before he gets the cookie š
He was responsive with his tricks too, no problem moving away from the cookies. The hand touches and sit were easy peasy for him. The spins were good except for when you cued the 2nd one too quickly, so you can slow down the cues there to give him a little more processing time. The only one he couldnāt do was the down – but that makes sense because a down in a higher state of arousal is a lot harder (unless you are a Border Collie where the down is the easiest in the higher state of arousal LOL!)
Really good recovery from the stuff almost falling on him at approximately 2:00! He was startled and recovered beautifully.
He as very engaged for the find my face game and did great!!! When it stops raining š you can bring this into a sequence and deliberately mess up once or twice (disconnection) and have a huge reward for him finding your face. If you are near a jump or tunnel and he takes it? Bonus!!! That is not require but it is nice if they do it š
>We have a trial this weekend & I will take Indy along & will work the Find My Face game & will try getting him to engage in play some more.>
Fun!!
The top priorities can be the regular pattern game (not find my face) so he can get engaged with you even in the harder environment, and the volume dial game (tricks for treats!) Start in a comfy quiet area, and if those go well, you can get closer to the ring. And if all that goes perfectly, you can add a little Find My Face or even a small bit of the remote reinforcement game!
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
Tracy
Good morning!
>YUP!! Very timely reminder that I had just a so-so class on Monday (excitement-wise) and a downright abysmal one on Friday during rented ring time. Of course, it was all my fault for not setting things up well- rushed for time, too many reps of unfun things, a jump accidentally set too high was taken unexpectedly and not successfully. >>
That is all good to learn from! Making of list of things to NOT do again is as important as the things you will want to do again š
>Good news was that we had a GREAT class today also several were absent so it was almost too quiet! Iām starting to think Reacher might like a little environmental excitement as long as he feels safe.>
Yes – exciting busy environments can actually be helpful because then the brain cannot process any single small distraction. If things are too quiet, the small distractions will seem really big to a brain, especially an adolescent brain š
>Yes, I am so used to that sound I donāt really hear it! But what it actually is is that just off camera to the right is a building on our property that my husband runs his business out of>>
Your adult brain is habituated to it, and your adult brain doesnāt need to process it out in favor of focusing on the agility (agility is something your neurons know how to do :)) His adolescent brain seemed to be having trouble processing the information – noise plus agility plus iceā¦. So much! Maybe if it was just noise plus agility, or agility plus ice (like at the beginning) – no problem. But all 3 at once? His brain was like āNOPE!ā LOL Especially since agility is hard & unpredictable, and ice is DELICIOUS lol
But learning is still happening – as crazy as it sounds, there is still learning happening and latent learning takes over (this is HARD for us humans LOL!)
On the video – he was very pumped up! This session went well!!!
>I found the furry lotus ball so thatās what I was using as a reward in this one. He likes it! But I did also have food in it so that helps!>
It a start with food and sometimes you can just let him chase it attached to the long toy, and food can come after he grabs it.
>>he was doing a lot of tugging on my sleeve and biting it, which he loves and really gets him jazzed>
I think UKI would be fine with that but I think AKC might have a heart attack LOL!!!!
Looking at the handling:
For the āclose closeā to the tunnel, it worked best when you did not to decel as much because it pulls him in too much, almost off the line entirely (first run). It worked great when you cued a turn on the jump before the tunnel threadle (you were using his name which is probably all he needs n that context) and then keep running to the correct end of the tunnel like you did at 2:14 – that was great!!!At 1:32 and 3:10 – yes, there was a little disconnect so he didnāt take the jump. It was a moment of shoulders closing forward and you seeing him peripherally rather than being perfectly connected.
It would be cool for him to take the jump anyway (you were pretty close to both of them) so you can play a bit of running lazy game so as you move close to a jump and say jump – donāt be quite as connected but reward him for taking the jump (throw early is needed to help him out :)) That should help reduce the need to be perfect. I know you saw him miss those jumps which means there was some connection, but it is hard to be perfect so we can pay him a lot for taking the jump anyway when you are not perfect šOne thought on verbals:
At 3:24 – you can replace his name as the turn cue with the left verbal on the 7 jump. His name is more of a general āpay attentionā thing which works great for getting ready for the tunnel threadle in this context, and the left verbal is super specific so should be even easier to get the turn there (and take the tunnel out of the picture).
One other thing to add is to shorten the distances a little, so he gets used to running tighter sequences like he might encounter in AKC, USDAA, and sometimes in UKI. He is taking 7 strides or so between the exit of the tunnel and the jump, for example, but he will see a lot of sequences with 4 or 5 strides distances. That will be good to get him used to and also good for you to be able to plan handling when there is less room.
>>Also, Iād like your opinion on whether it would be a good idea to do another NFC day (just one!) at UKI up at On the Run mid-December. It might be good practice if have a good/fun plan but I donāt feel strongly one way or the other.>>
Iād say yes! Do speedstakes! You can check out who the judge is and then decide, but I think Julie brings in the judges and she has excellent taste š
Great job here!
Tracy
Good morning!
>>I do think her tendency is just naturally be chill ring side. I fast forwarded a lot of the snuffling but she is just content to hang out listening to all the dogs going through the tunnels, etc. >>
This is great to build in the power of being relaxed and not over-aroused ringside!!! The more powerfully you build this up before she realizes that she will also get a turn in the ring, the easier it will be maintain it as things get more exciting
>>So it only makes sense the universe gave me Lu who is the sweetest chill dog in all life events but really hard for me agility wise š. But sheās my level up dog š>>āØ
Ha! Ye, the universe always provides balance. Think of her as different in terms of the agility training/handling, not hard. Yes, different can be harder at first but then when things click into place, it will be AMAZING šLooking at the video: yes, Lu loves her patterns and snuffle mat!!!
She was great with the pattern games when you were in the chair and also ringside. When you were ringside, you can keep the snuffle mat out of the picture so she doesnāt ignore it and also so there is no āworkā built in around it (even patterns are work).
For the pattern game, two things to add whenever you are at the next trial or class: walk around by the ring doing that back and forth treat tossing (more movement adds arousal that she can self-regulate plus it will simulate you getting ready to run a course). And you can go near the gating and play the up and down game (cookies on the ground or your shoes, with her in front of you).
Snuffle mat was awesome!!!
The other thing you can add is the volume dial game (tricks for treats or tugging). This is how I would do it for her:
– enter the environment and start with the pattern game (back and forth so she can move). This helps bridge her up to a higher arousal state, as if getting ready to run
– do a bit of volume dial. Maybe 3 or 4 tricks for rewards. This helps her body learn to come to a higher level of arousal to ge ready to run, while still responding to cues. And it helps you learn how she is when asked to āworkā around the ring.
– then go back to the pattern game to help bridge her back down to a more relaxed state
– Then end on the snuffle matIt is like a physiological workout for her š It will take maybe 60 seconds or so, and will be super useful as she begins to do more and more sequencing in more exciting environments.
Great job here!
Tracy
Hi! He is doing well here!
Video 1:
The before and after run stuff looks good here (and on the other videos too!)>>I was having the hardest time getting him to take the #4 jump on this with the blind. >
Part of it was how the sequence was built – having 3 angled up against the pole was blocking his ability to turn tight and see you. The other part was your line of motion: when he could see you again after the pole, your line of motion takes you parallel to the bar of 4 and not forward to 5, which cued him to go past it at :35, 1:30 and 3:27.
You had much better turn cues at 2:07 for 3 (you can use a directional there too, but his name was pretty powerful) and you had exit line connection – and you stopped moving which we donāt want, necessarily, but it prevented you from running parallel across 4 so he took the jump.
Ideally you would send to 3 and run away directly to 5, calling him and doing the blind. Donāt handle 4, donāt get near it š Your motion should present it and handling it or being parallel to it changes his line.
Good job working the Forward focus on 1! At 1:24 – be sure that he is facing the jump you want (his feet were parallel to the bar so he had to almost look over his should to see it) and also that he doesnāt move til after you release.
2:03 and 3:05 were very nice reps of the forward focus!!!
And also, great job continuing and rewarding even if it went wrong.
Seq 5:
He was being a super good dog on the opening š The opening 1-2 line is a serp so when you released at :13, you were close to the first wing of 1 and not showing serp (open shoulders back to him and moving towards 2) he was correct to not consider flipping away to 2.
At :15, your arm was pointing sideways to 2 but your feet and shoulders were pointing to 3, so he took 3.
The 2nd rep at :45 had a better serp on 1, but then pointed forward to 2 – which turned shoulders and feet away from it and towards the backside so that is where he went. He was correct there too, you owe him a cookie. Then you shoved him to the backside at :53 – he was correct again, you owe him a cookie š
He is reading you perfectly – so if he goes somewhere unexpected, look at the video before the next rep, and freeze it at the moment he decides to go to the unexpected place – you will see the handling that is causing it. So keep rewarding everything because he is correct!
So to get 1 to the front side of 2? Keep moving to the exit wing of 2 while holding the serp position (arm back, shoulders rotated, good connection) until you see him turn away and look at 2 – then you can relax the position and move to 3. Because he is young, you might have to hold it a little longer, until takeoff. What was happening here was that you were closing your shoulders too early which pulled him away from the jump if you were further from it, or pushed him to the backside when you tried to get close to the jump.
>>This showed up in class with backsides at speed this past week.>>
Slices in general are hard and need to be handled with young dogs (they are not likely to hop into a slice on their own). The backside question is probably a slightly different but similar issue – I will bet you were closing your shoulders forward and not maintaining the serp. In theory, taking the jump on the backside should be a default behavior, but he is young so is still likely to follow handling. So keep your shoulders open and look at the landing spot (and throw a reward to the landing spot as you run through, to help develop the default behavior).
3rd video:
He was great with his find my face game! But you an also see it is HARD because he jumped up at you at :25. If this session happened after the previous sequence where there was a lot of failure, he might be carrying frustration over. (BTW at :41 – :43 you had nice serp handling so he took the 2 jump :))You can also surprise him and whip out a toy for this game – the cookie is nice but I think the toy will be much more motivating and will help him work out any frustration.
Last video:
Sequence 1 looks good! The only questions he had were about going through the box 5-6-7.
When you say run at :26 to cue the line to 7, look at him not ahead – looking ahead turned your shoulders off the line and that is where he went
At 1:28 you had connection on the exit of 5 but then looked forward which looked like the beginning of a blind so he changed sides
Last run had great connection exiting 5 and great connection over 6 at 2:29 then at the last minute, you pointed forward (which turned your shoulders) and reached for the toy and he didnāt take the last jump. On tat line, try to run like there is one more jump after it, showing huge connection. He is learning how to run through the box and ignore the jumps you are running past, so the extra connection will help (and it will get easier when he gets more experienced with this challenge :))
Great job here!
Tracy
Good morning!
I like that she could do her tricks! The barking did not take long to become the easiest trick ever :))
>>Did not get sticky on lead outs (even with me using the obstacle name) and had faster, happier line ups.>
Yes – the arousal in the environment is her friend, not a struggle at all. That is fantastic!
And she was great on the practice jump! She seemed to have perfect response to every cue for almost the first 2 minutes with people and dog walking by – at a little past the 2 minute mark you can see her attention wandering. It was good to end it right after that, but you can also go in with a goal of 3 reps on the jump then be done (which should keep you well within the āoptimal arousalā range).
There was not a lot of room to extend based on handing cues (no place to run to for you LOL!) so you can throw a treat or toy pat the jump to let her fly to it (think of it as Toy Races, Practice Jump Edition š
>>So weāll take the pattern games/volume dial etc on the road.>>
Sounds good – she is likely going to be a bit depleted (travel, trial, travel, flight, new location, etc) so build in a TON of decompression in there for her adolescent self š
>In other news, Kaladin decided that Camille Cargol was OK in his book after he had to roll his eyes at her for a bit when she worked on the tightness in his neck.>
I am glad she worked it out! No tightness allowed heading into the Open!!
Great job here š
āØTracyI love the big outdoor trials! I wish we still had them here on the east coast. I am jealous!
Great job with these videos – a lot of this is simply exposing her brain to the environment using a framework that helps the brain process the info it is being bombarded with (and creating positive outcomes :))
>>Decompression is a priority for me. >>
Yay!!! It is so important (and for us humans too!)
>We do flexi leash walks (lots of them) where the girls can sniff and lead the way >
I also do Flexi walks – flexi leashes get a lot of hate but honestly, they provide a way for dogs to have some freedom to sniff and decide where to go, in a way that I can more easily control (if needed) than a regular long line or being off leash for youngsters.
>> They always get chews in the RV
Perfect! I also use some lickimats because even the dogs who donāt like sniffing enjoy those š
>and I did some one on one Chuck it with Taq so she could move fast. I am not crazy about Chuck it but without it at this venue she could not stretch out and run. This seems to be a daily requirement for Taq. She gets 2-3 opps a day at home.>
Yes, it is hard to get that blast of movement that the teenagers require! I have been using disc rollers lately, because the dogs can run but they donāt slam themselves like they did with balls or a thrown disc.
Looking at the videos:
>>I did two sets of patterns and volume dial. First pattern she got distracted by distractions very close by- other dogs. >>
These went well!!!
Pattern 1 – good work, you can see her really processing the environment. And that is exactly why we do it š Her latency was much lower in the 2nd video of the pattern games. So I donāt worry at all if the responses are a little slower at firstā¦ it is just the brain saying āprocessing, processing, processingā. The environment is HARD.
Volume dial 1 – her tricks looked good and she started with great engagement. Lots of things were happening in the environment that her brain is processing besides the cues: judge, beeps from the ring, dogs walking by, dogs barking etc. She did great!!
>>I picked a toy that she was not do crazy about >
I think the struggle here was that she had a little trouble grabbing the toy, then started to give up (this is when she was disengaging a bit). That toy was interesting at first! To get more engagement on it, you can move it more slowly so she can grab it or tie it to a longer toy. It was a little too small and that would mean trying to grab it close to your hands, which is a lot of pressure in that environment especially when you were leaning over and moving it away from her before she could grab it. You can also toss it to let her chase it a bit š
Pivoting to treats worked well – you read the situation and helped her out, which is great! She was very engaged even with distractions all around.
The second round went super well! The pattern games had low latency (chewing was the only delay LOL!) You can walk around while you do this, bringing the back and forth game closer to the ring (be sure to use big obvious chunks of food).
On the last video: note how this toy was longer and she had an easier time grabbing it, so she was super engaged. Plus it looks like fur which is often a winner š Remember to keep it long while playing, donāt accidentally shorten it up – you hold the end of the handle with the rest of the toy down low, and donāt let your hands get too close to her mouth š
Tricks looked good here, lots of distractions nearby and she was very responsive!! It was a good choice to go to the practice jump in that moment – she was great!! Her leash was off and she had easy access to dogs and people walking byā¦ and she was perfection!! Totally engaged and responsive – fantastic rehearsal!!
Great job here! After getting some rest, what else is on the horizon in terms of FEO runs?
Tracy
Hi!
>>parts actually felt like we were flying>
She is definitely figuring out her lines and doing better with the start lines too! And the teamwork was at its best when you had your hands low and kept moving. The high hands and sudden stops were where she had questions like at :34 and :47. In those momentsā¦ keep moving, donāt freeze up or stop – she is doing better about not jumping at you but the more you keep going, the better she will stay on the line and not get overaroused.
You were clearer at the beginning with the stays in terms of trying to turn to face the jump before releasing her, so maintain that clarity for the whole session. It will be worthwhile to take the extra time to turn to the jump as you build up to a lead out.
And when rewarding – remember to use the toy marker to indicate the toy, rather than praise or hand position or a sit cue.
>will get more distance at end of week but quite like that she is comfortable these distances and staying at high arousal with less boiling over. when go to bigger distances will make easier too.>
Perfect! I donāt think you need to make things easier with the added distance – the key to maintaining an optimal arousal state will be to keep moving and not stop to fix errors. Distance is not over-stimulatingā¦ is the the start & stop when we handlers mess up that cause arousal shifts due to frustration. So no matter what happens – keep moving š
>shouldI train In synch first as her behaviours are still green and not opolished. and then train Fusion with behaviours like weaves she can d in training. If I train fusion first then scentlikely to be attacjed to the chaos that still happening for In synch or am I oer thinking or perhaps use a cloth like they do for scents and put in a sealed bag. sorry my mind is going down rabbit holes working out how to try and utilise.>>
Because scent is linked to memory, I think using it in situations where you can guarantee great success and very happy feelings will be most important. We are looking for an easy way to carry a happy conditioned response into a new environment. So it is not really about using a scent to attach to a skill, especially when the skill is new and being trained as that might involve frustration which we definitely do not want to attach.
>>2. this thing about unexpected rewards to maximum dopamine ie one armed banditsāØI understand how this works in isolation but how do we fit this in with frequent rewards and reinforcing behaviours or is it that once a behaviour is understood use intermittent training which I find hard as fall back into habit of patterns or the level of rewarding drops off because it gets forgotten. Or do you plan when you are going to intermittently reinforce or do you use changing the value of the food treat >>
There are two things that are happening here – learning and rehearsal. Most of what we do in dog sports is rehearsal, not learning. So we donāt need to worry about dopamine coding for learning in rehearsal. Sure, there are dopamine shifts but mainly in rehearsal, we are looking at developing neuronal memory to make the behaviors faster, more fluent, more automatic.
This is not the same as learning and in rehearsal, toys and treats are motivators and not reinforcement. Yes, we use toys and treats to keep the motivation going (which does involve dopamine but in a different way) and also to maintain optimal arousal but not allowing frustration or boredom to creep in.
For intermittent reinforcement and changing values – yes, those can both be powerful learning tool but mainly what we are doing is using them as motivators and not reinforcement š
So after the initial training, and understanding is underway, I donāt worry so much about the surprise factor of reward prediction errors as much as I do about keeping the dog motivated. And also, the surprise factor or reward prediction errors can work against us when we do NOT produce an expected reinforcement or when we punish the dog (the same thing, really). That shows a dopamine drop out which is damaging to arousal levels and motivation for the sport.
>or do you change how you present the reward I have been trying to animayte food moe with In synch to increase food value. I do try and bring out higher value toys when we playing games- agility I use a low value so she doesnt lose her mind but ften bring out at the end of a session or if she does something hard.>
Yes, I do but that is not always learning – usually we are rehearsing so the changes in value or presentation are all about maintaining motivation in a way that I like it.
There is no black and white line as to when learning (reward prediction errors) becomes rehearsal – we donāt have electrodes in their brains LOL so we just do our best to use motivators a LOT and not allow frustration or punishment to creep in. This is especially true because they are not actually ālearningā the behavior in that moment – that doesnāt happen til learning is encoded in sleep!
So if we keep motivators as valuable as needed and are as clear as possible with using them and training, then it does not matter as much if it is learning or rehearsal because it all turns out well in the end.
>>I suppose my dilemma ie what I havent clear in my head how do you keep up reward frequency vs the value of the surprse.>>
Keep the reward frequency high – and that includes delivery of a motivator like a toy or treat, or continuing the sequence for dogs who like to sequence. You canāt always make it a surprise, plus reward prediction error tells us that a toy at the end of a sequence for a dog that has done sequences before is probably *not* a surprise – so no dopamine coding in that respect because there is no prediction error. But it is a valuable rehearsal (neuronal memory, automaticity, etc) and it is key that we continue to use motivators and not withhold or punish or frustrate the dog.
The science of learning versus rehearsal is fascinating and in dog sports, largely misunderstood. And all, we donāt need to worry about it that much as long as we make sure we are using valuable motivators.
Tracy
Good morning!
>>Our treats were on the DW right behind the camera. Should I move them out of the field altogether like I at a trial?>>
You can set up a reward station, like on a folding chair that you might take to trials. And let the reward station be right outside the course, then sometimes out of the field. I use that station with my young dogs because they recognize it and it makes the reward more predictable.
>> We donāt have a DW yet.>>
You can totally start NFC/FEO stuff before the contacts are finished š
>When we go to other locations, he runs around sniffing everything so Iām pretty sure he wonāt stay with me yet. >>
So before doing NFC/FEO, letās sort this out! Can you get him to different agility places, and see if he will play pattern games, do tricks, play with a toy, do recalls, etc? One thing I am doing it taking my youngsters to all sorts of novice-level seminars to be able to get them on course and playing on simple sequences, in all sorts of new places. I do Novice level stuff because I really donāt want to focus on crazy backside-threadle-layer-cartwheels etc when I mainly want to focus on getting them focused and engaged in the environment š
And at the local trial in December – rather than enter him, can you bring him to the environment to play games outside the ring and in the environment, mainly to see how he feels about it and what he finds motivating.
Any UKI in your area? I ask because it is VERY young-dog-friendly and you can have helpers in the ring to make it more fun and successful.
>I say Yes all the time when he does something good. Itās such a bad habit and he totally thinks itās the marker word.>
SAME!!!! I had to train myself to NOT say YAY or YES all the time with the adult dogs, so I have gotten much better. And in my NFC runs with the younger dogs now, I have somehow developed a āYES SIRā that is the come-get-your-toy marker. LOL!!!
Using your stool as the reward station worked great!! He was able to ignore a new person (dog dad? LOL!) and he was perfect! You can be more connected to him as you walk away and add the leash as well (because the leash will be on when you move away from the treats and into the ring). You can also add a trick or two: move away from the reward station, ask for a trick, and then when he does it (even if it is not perfect :)) you use your marker and run back to the treats.
He looked kinda interested in the toy, and it looks like the toy is a good furry crazy toy – but with the possibility of food there, he was not interested. You can see if he is interested in the toy if you throw it a lot or drag it away like a deranged squirrel for him to chase. I have had a lot of success with my food driven dogs by attaching a furry lotus ball to a long toy – they love chasing it! At first there is food in it, then it becomes a toy by itself.
>>He loves tugging with his brother. Heās not that much into it with me unless brother is right there.>
When they aet tugging, watch to see what gets Indy going: is his brother moving it away? Hoarding it? What instigates the play and keeps it going? You can then try to simulate that with him and the toy š
Great job here!!
Tracy
Good morning!
>>My dw was in the way but I was too lazy to move it which forced a slice on 8>
This is entirely relatable, I hate moving the DW and I havenāt yet won the lottery to buy one that I can move with one hand LOL!
>>I edited and gave some nice long toy rewards but West said Yay! No start lines!!>
Yay for both!!!!
The sequencing is going really well š There are some small details that will make it even smooth – pictures might be more helpful here, so I grabbed some screenshots to illustrate the points, you can find them here:
https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1eiqQq6E5Cl3XU0QLMuz_wfH_KE5070ytORfJfOoSLaw/edit?usp=sharing
On the opening line, I think you were feeling the pressure to send to the tunnel and get up the line, but you were pulling away a little too soon at :07 which caused a question. You were much clearer at :20!
And as you were planning the blind, you might have been feeling the pressure of getting there and left the tunnel send too early at :14. :25 was better but he still had a small question š :41 was even better !
So be sure to be connected and maintain the parallel line til you see him lock onto the tunnel, then you can move to your next spot.
(You can stay on the line by 4 more so you are more laterally away from 5 more like where you were at 1:02 and even further over, which gets you to the BC even sooner)
Being further over at 1:02 actually helped you get the blind on landing of 7 at 1:07!! He found that to be pretty clear (bar up!) even though you might have felt like he was going to run over you LOL
It will be even easier if you are further over to your destination on 7 by staying closer to the 3 jump as you send to 4, 5,6. At 1;21, you ran close to 3 and that is ideal – stay on that line as you send 4-5-6 and the landing side blind will be super easy (so will the takeoff side blind)
Going back to the blinds on takeoff side – you got there nicely and your line was good, so now easily now add more connection back to him on the exit of the blind, and stay connected to help him keep the bar up (he looks at you when you were disconnected, especially over the bar at :29 and :44, so the bars came down) You can also add a jump verbal which should direct his focus to the jump and not at you.
You did the RC at 1:27 and it worked well, you can go in a little closer to the tunnel to set it up so you donāt end up behind – he dropped the bar here on the last jump but that was mainly because you both had to pull up in order to not run into the dog walk.
On the last rep, you did a serp on landing side of 7 – really great connection!! You can stay more lateral on that one too (it almost looked like you were going to the RC line because you got in close to 5).
And as you serp, open up your dog side arm back more so both of your shoulders face the 7 jump – he knew to take 7 but because your shoulders were forward, he took it straight at 1:43. At 1:44 he saw motion to 8 and tried to adjust midair (and ticked the bar). Open serp shoulders will tell him to turn to his right, so he can do that before takeoff for 7.
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
Tracy
Good morning!
Sequence 2 is looking good too!
Even though you are still on walking restrictions, you can add in decel to get the FC wrap on 5 – that will tighten it here, get you into better course positions because you can decel to hang back in places where that is helpful, and it will all get your brain trained to decelerate when you are back to running š
You are doing what I call ābig walkingā with nice long strides. As she lands from 4 (the middle pinwheel jump) you can keep moving forward like you did, and go to small walking (short strides).
The timing of your rotation for the FC at :14 was good! But since there was no transition into decel, she didnāt know it was coming and didnāt collect til after landing. It was like changing lanes on the interstate without a blinker š¤£
Your rotation was earlier at :46 and she had a better turn – the decel will help that even more too.
The rear cross at :31 was TERRIFIC! Especially after the wrap on the previous sequence, you had to be spot on with the infoā¦ and you were. VERY NICE!
Wow, look at you getting the blind while walking!!!! Your tunnel send really helped that and in fact, you were a tiny bit too far past 4 there – too far ahead! But that is great because you didnāt have to run to get there. So you can actually plan to stick a little closer to the line 3-4 so when she lands from 3, you can start the blind being approx at the wing of 4 (and passing it)
The way the end of the sequence was built, it seems like the line from 6 to 7 causes the 7 jump to be on the backside line (position and angle of the jump). That is why you got a lot of backsides – that was the natural line when you gave forward cues. And that independent backside line is definitely a skill we want!
She got it a few times when you pulled your shoulders more or were further away from the line or behind her – but the best and clearest rep there was at 2:45 where you had your opposite arm up for a threadle along with calling her name – she totally got it. So when you are walking the course, look for those natural backside lines so you can handle her to the front side where needed (with the threadle arm and threadle verbal).
When you revisited seq 1:
She was hilarious at 3:11 and on the last rep – you cued the tunnel and she looked at you like āARE YOU SUREā because she had just turned on the 5 jump a bunch of times LOL! Good girl!
Revisiting the Serp at 3:14and 3:38 went well, you were staying on your line and serping it nicely!!! She was not quite as speedy on the big tunnel send (probably because it was the end of he session and also she was double checking to be sure you definitely wanted the tunnel) so it will be even easier to get to the position for the serp when she is feeling spicy at the beginning of a session because you wonāt have to handle the tunnel send for as long as you did here.
Great job!!
Tracy
Hi!
The sequence looked great – really nice connection throughout it, which showed him the lines clearly. Really nice tight turn out of the tunnel!!!You can spread things out for him a bit too, so he can see trial-spacing š
He worked really well without the treats in the ring, and then you praised – then the video ended (of that section) so remember you can use your marker worker to go get the rewards outside the ring.
Do you have any NFC plans or fun matches coming up? He looks ready to take things on the road š
He is doing well on the teeter! It is hard for a small dog to do it from one jump without a lot of momentum, but he is doing really well driving to the end of the board. He does that best when you are at or near the end of the board, so you can keep that going for now (and continuing past, like you did here).
Adding it into bigger sequences will make it even easier to get him always driving to the end of the board. And continue being super consistent with your motion (not toooooo much speed running past the board for now :)) and verbals (he totally thinks that āyesā is a release to come get the cookies, so the release and reward markers will work a lot better to help him hold position).
Great job here!
Tracy
