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Hi!
>>Funny story – I was trying this last night at class, and we had beverages at class which was not helping my word choices, so I kept saying the wrong thing while pointing at the jump and he eventually got so confused that he lifted his little foot to point at the jump (to wave, really) and we all died from the cuteness.>>
OMG! So cute!!! I wish it was on video!!!!
>> And I honestly only had part of 1 drink, so I can’t blame that.
Ha! But a good time was had by all, and that is the important part 🙂
>>I’m excited about the focus forward stuff, because I seem to have taught him that we have to make sustained eye contact while he’s in his sit stay, and while it’s adorable, it doesn’t really set either one of us up for success. So we’ll be working on that. 😐>>
His Border Collie genetics work in your favor on this one, it won’t take him long to figure it out and it is a great one for indoors too if the weather is bad.
>>So I’ve started to pay attention to how often I do this and, um, it’s a lot. I say ‘yay’ and clap like a weirdo. Need to reprogram to give a marker or the next cue – I will work on it!>>
THIS IS TOTALLY RELATABLE LOL!!!! I have trained myself to use markers by rewarding myself with saying “yay!” and clapping. You might notice in my NFC videos my on-course marker to come get the toy is “YES SIR!” as a “yay” replacement. But the “yes sir!” is a lot more consistent as a marker than Yay! LOL!
>>Here’s a little bit of volume dial + decompression while we were waiting to work on our 2×2 thingy (still working on just the 2 poles). He came into class super hot, and I liked the change that I saw after the tricks + decomp. Not sure if it shows up here all that well, but I noticed a less frenetic arousal – he still wanted to work, but wasn’t off his rocker.>>
That is awesome! He was definitely excited about the friends and fun in the environment but I can see how he was much more able to engage and respond to cues, tuning out the distractions behind him, and relax with the snuffle mat. He was really great about ignoring the dogs and person talking to you! How did his 2×2 session go after this mental warm up?
Find my face also looks great! His default is to line up, so good job to you for keeping your feet together. You might get a line up on course in a true find my face moment, so be prepared for that LOL!!! This went really well so you can add it to a simple sequence: start an easy sequence, then deliberaly screw up and disconnect. Big rewards for finding your face!! He doesn’t have to take any of the obstacles on the way to you, but it would be a great bonus if he did!
Nice work here!
TracyHi!
>>But I’m usually a bit later/early or need to take just another moment/step to support him. Or I’m early on a blind and he comes directly to me. Or I think he has the line and I start to move to my next spot and he pulls off. Would timing help with things like that?>>
Absolutely! Part of timing is when to change the connection – in both of your examples, your connection changes are too early and it pulls him to the next line too soon 🙂
He did well with both of these runs!
For the pattern games, on both runs… when there is a lot of energy and excitement as he approaches the ring, you will want to let him move more. This can come in the form of the back and forth pattern game, where you are tossing big chunks of cheese so he goes back and forth to get it. It can be further from the ring at a trial, but movement as part of the mental warm up is very useful! Then you can get closer and have him stationary for the up and down game – he was able to do that here for a few reps, but he would check out easily.
>> did I wait too long on the pattern games or was it just that the food was boring the second time as you’ll hear me say?>>
Probably a combination of not enough movement and boring food 🙂
That brings me to my next question – what type of treats were you using? You will probably need more interesting treats 🙂
He was very happy to play the volume dial game with the toy, and also very happy to enter the ring, line up, and run the sequence without the toy. YAY!!!!
Will he tug on his leash? You can use that at the end of the run – send him to his leash and play tug!
>>One remote reinforcement question. If I use “let’s go” to go to remote reinforcement inside the ring and “let’s go” for remote reinforcement outside the ring (either at practice or a show). What do you do at trials if it’s “Let’s go” to run back to his leash and tug and the “Let’s go” again to exit the ring and go to his snake (which is higher value)? Just use it twice?>>
The ‘let’s go’ marker is only for immediately going to the reward station (which is outside the ring here). So if the leash comes first, I say something like “where is your leash” and then when it is on, I add “let’s go”. Using it for the leash and for the reward station can be confusing, so you can keep using your leash markers for him and that will help direct him to the leash (I don’t use the leash markers in UKI or USDAA where leashing is not required – I just grab the leash and head to the reward, because there is often no ring gate either LOL!!)
Great job here!! I am excited for your next trial!
Tracy
Hi!
>> She also has a habit of taking the first jump after I take her leash off before she comes to line up.>>
Stay tuned for the Leash Off Engagement On coming in the next package – I agree we don’t want her to rehearse taking that first jump!
>>I felt zero pressure (other than the clock, lol), and Nox has helped me learn to not be embarrassed by whatever crazy antics they do in the ring, haha!>>
That is fabulous!!!!!
>> It was helpful that she doesn’t know the weaves, so I couldn’t even attempt to run the whole course. Maybe that’s a strategy, lol.>>
It is TOTALLY a strategy! Running at the lower height and ‘wrong’ division helps prevent us handlers from making poor choices about going for Qs 🙂
>She will do it on grass as well. She hasn’t done it as much in the videos you’ve watched since we are just starting to do bigger sequences with more space and speed. It seems to be tied very much to speed and arousal. I don’t know if she doesn’t have enough value or understanding for jumps yet since so much of her foundation training was done on wings, or if perhaps she can’t figure out how to sort out her jumping while maintaining speed (and she really values speed, lol) and finds it easier to go past the jumps. After she gets some of the crazies out and gets more tired, she is less likely to go past them.>>All of the above! What height are you seeing it at, mostly? Processing is HARD for young dogs, and add in that when it happens, there is a strong likelihood that handling cues were late and/or unclear – which further delays processing. It is pretty normal for young dogs, which is why lower bars for a while and the handler prioritizing connection over running fast is really important.
>> (The email notification that you responded went to my “promotions” tab in my gmail (not even sure why that’s a thing)>>
OMG Gmail with all those fancy tabs…. SO ANNOYING LOL!!!!!
>> I do not have a valid defense for not following the two failure rule. 😂😂😂>>
It is a lifestyle!!! And it is important everywhere – I took a young dog to a seminar recently and he had two failures so I told the instructor that I didn’t want him to keep failing and I was going to break it down. It doesn’t matter if it was my fault or his fault (spoiler alert: totally MY fault LOL!) but either way, 2 was enough.
On the video:
The hard part on Seq 3 was the send to 3. What was happening was that as you sent, if you ran a ‘banana line’ (meaning your arm/shoulder/feet/motion) went in a curved arc like a banana, she thought you were cuing 4.
If you ran a ‘split step’ where you were connected as you sent, and your left leg (dog side leg) took a big step towards the jump (arm moving with leg) – that step helped commit her and then you stepped to 4 with your right leg. That way you were taking more of an angled step to the jump rather than running in a curved arc – which also holds the cue longer because it shifts your weight a bit onto the send leg.
:38 and 1:50 were good example of the split step! Remember to keep going/keep rewarding if it goes wrong – at 1:14 you made her take the jump and she was like, “ok….” but it didn’t correlate to the cue you needed her to do and it can frustrate the dogs when they read us correctly.
One other detail on the send: the right verbal should be done with the send. You did ‘jump’ on the send, and the right verbals were after that so they were were late and she turned after landing. Ideally, you would use the right verbal and a brake arm with the send to get the info in nice and early.
Once she got the 3 jump, the rest looked great!
You were connected and not sprinting on the end line! Nice! And she didn’t go around any jumps.
Seq 4 – doing a blind 3-4 worked really well. Trust your timing – you started it on time 2:42 but then hesitated a bit, which delayed it so it was a little late. As you exit the blind, remember to use exit line connection there to tighten up the line – she didn’t know which side to be on til the jump came into view.
Seq 5 – home run! Nailed it on that first run. Everything was connected and on time
Opening line – lovely! Layering – lovely! Nice connection and parallel line! Timing of the turn cues for the FC on the exit of the tunnel? Nailed it! Then the left cues (verbal and brake arms) on the 6 jump? Perfect! Connection and motion on the ending line? Great! Well done!!Great job!
TracyHi!
>>I’m still feeling excited that we had success as defined by Reacher having such a good time!>>
I am excited too! As a dog trainer, I am supposed to remind you to expect an up-and-down road to the finished product, and that it won’t always be smooth sailing. But, in my experience – that only happens when we skip steps 🙂 So if you keep slicing things into small fun pieces like you did there, you should have pretty smooth sailing and a grand time! Yes, the holes will find us 🙂 but they won’t be major.
>> I had to laugh at the part about depletion and how it can make itself known in different ways, because when Reacher was a puppy it would get to a point in the evening just like a child where he’d get too tired and enter what hubs and I called “tantrum mode”. He would just turn completely feral and instead of settling himself down to nap he would get overtired and go kind of crazy like have a little tantrum on all the toys, his brother, whatever was near. That still happens sometimes. 🙂 We always knew then it was time to force him to bed!>>
Ha! YES! In my house, I call it The Whippeting because the young pointy dog(s) just go feral at about 9pm and run run run run run run (ideally outside but not always). All of the adult dogs just sit in a corner and wait for it to be over LOL!
The first Find My Face video was a good refresher, he got right into it. Super! I didn’t see any distractions pop up or frustration from him at all, and that is perfect.
Adding the wing was great, he started offering it and was even more excited – but also happy to find your face when you disconnected.
Since this went so well – onwards to adding it to a sequence! You can use one of the sequences from this week, taking a simple part of it and deliberately messing it up. Reward him for finding your face 🙂 taking the obstacle near you is a bonus but not required 🙂
Great job here!
TracyHi! I am definitely seeing improvement in his engagement here!!! And with that, I have some ideas on how to get even more by doing less 🙂
>>right now his ‘turnip’ (which is a ball shaped like a turnip) and cheese seem to be his favorite. He also likes his fuzzy tug toy but right now in situations where he is likely to sniff, he really only responds well to food. I have been using ‘people’ food – mainly cooked steak. I will try some other high value people food like you’ve suggested to see if any of those interest him.>>
Awesome! One effective approach is often to keep switching up the reinforcement. Steak is incredibly high value, but it can lose some of that value if it is a regular thing. So you can have more of a buffet available: steak, cheese, baby food, whipped cream, salmon, squeeze cheese, liver brownies, etc LOL!! And dogs seem to love it when we grab food from other people by going around and asking everyone for a couple of their treat – I call it ‘trick or treating’, which seems appropriate for today 🙂 And they might give you a piece of steak which might be insanely motivating… even though you have been using steak as well. Dogs like the variety LOL!
On the first video:
>> At home he like to ‘find’ the little dinosaur toy – aka Dino – so I was seeing if he was interested in that. It was a no go!>>
It was totally worth a try! There might have been too many other things in the environment in that moment, making it hard to process the Dino.
Speaking of the environment – when the snuffle mat is in the picture, you can put several treats on it for full snuffling. That way, it continues to indicate directed sniffing/decompression for him and he won’t need to look up at you for the up and down game (then have it up on the table/out of the picture when you are doing ticks and crate games, so there is one less thing for him to have to process/ignore.
The tricks went well here, and he likes the crate games!!
That section of the video went from 1:41 to 4:33. Ideally, you would slice that into smaller bursts of 30 seconds – then a decompression, walk in the grass, break in the car. Then a few minutes later, another 30 seconds approx. That will actually pump him up a lot in terms of engagement and motivation. Even if he re-engages and does more stuff, going for 3 minutes can deplete him more than engage him, and also you tend to get sniffing/leaving at the end of the long sessions. With the short burst sessions, the sessions are finished before he sniffs or disengages, so there is no rehearsal of that happening: only rehearsal of engagement and the good feeling of being pumped up (not the feeling of being depleted, which is not as good).
At about 3:00, he got distracted by the sound of cars? Then people coming in. That was a lot plus he was already 2 minutes into the session, so you lost the engagement. Starting with the super short bursts of engagement, you will see engagement really start to transfer in two ways: you’ll get it more easily and immediately as he enters the training environment, and you’ll get more duration on it so eventually the sessions can be longer.
On the 2nd video – coming in to get on the Klimb helped a lot! There was a LOT happening right there by the ring gate, so starting the Klimb further from all of that pressure can really help!
You can also spice up the class sessions by splitting your turn in half: for example, the first turn was the tunnel. You got good engagement, he did a tunnel, you can give him a big reward and be done with the turn. The next dog can have a turn, then Sieger can run back in for another tunnel. Wheeeee! That keeps it exciting and also keeps the sessions short. If you ask for the same behavior multiple times in a row, you start to get more checking out and sniffing from him.
That holds true for the weaves too – he came out and did a good set of weaves then said ‘no thanks’ to doing more.
>> I literally had to put the cheese right on his nose to get him away from whatever he was smelling over there. >>
There is a LOT of pressure there (instructor, people, dogs) I mean the person in the red shirt was loud! LOL! And the weaves are super hard. That one rep for the turnip is a good place to stop and not ask for more weaving. Doing more weaving, even if he does it, might actually work against the intended goal of engagement and motivation because it is really hard and can lead to feelings of depletion rather than feelings of YEAH THAT WAS AWESOME (which is what we want :)) and the food or toys might not override that.
Doing the sequence starting at the back of the building definitely was great because there was less pressure from the crowd, and he did really well on his first run! YAY! That is a spot where you can split your turn as well – jackpot for that first run, then out for a snuffle mat while the next dog goes… then back in for another run, maybe (or not, it is GREAT to leave him wanting more :)) You did 2 in a row and he did them, but when you were heading back to the Klimb he started sniffing. You might have been going back to get his leash, but he didn’t know that so you got some avoidance happening there. That could be an indicator of depletion rather than him feeling pumped up by it, that is where the one-hit-wonder runs can be super effective.
Nice work here! Splitting up the turns and using some short training blasts will require a bit of creativity in the class setting (and a timer when training on your own :)) but you’ll see his engage continue to blossom! Let me know what you think!
Tracy
Hi!
She did well with her turns here!
On the first turn:
>> I do like how she stays facing me to see what is next when I do take the leash off. >>
Yes, I love when the dogs engage like that when the leash comes off!!!
>> I think that contributed to her saying no to her orange fur tug at the beginning.>>
Possibly – or it could have been that the leash was still on, or the presentation of the toy was towards her, or both… or neither LOL!! I think it was about the context of leash being on and toy moving towards her, but more experimenting will tell us more. She was super focused and engaged, just didn’t want the toy in that moment.
>> First rep I have a great camera angle for my right arm going up for the layer and her starting to pull in and then I realized it was up there and brought it down & back and she turned back onto the line for her jump. >>
Yes! That was a great job adjusting in the moment by dropping your arm to show the connection and get the layer. Click/treat for you both!
She had some good legit questions about the line after the tunnel. The cue for ‘go straight’ before she entered the tunnel at 1:00 looked and sounded the same for when you wanted the turn before she entered the tunnel at 1:28, so she couldn’t quite adjust to the new line and missed the jump. Be sure that she sees and hears the turn cues before entering the tunnel, so in this case it might have been letting her see a brake arm and hearing her name when she was still about 4 or 5 feet away from entering the tunnel.
On the exit line where you were working to get the wrap, remember that connection is more important than position on the hierarchy of cues – you were driving hard to get to the wrap position, which caused some disconnection and slamming of the brakes (so she didn’t take the jump at 3:03 and 3:53). And at 3:52, the acceleration and convergence to get there pushed her past the jump and onto the backside line. She looked at you but based on the info, she went out to the backside of the jump after hte tunnel. So running more slowly so you can amplify the connection will smooth out those moments.
>>She is hanging onto the lotus fur tug on our way out.>>
Yay! She was definitely feeling good and pumped up!! You kept things happy and even in the disconnection oopsies with countermotion on the wrap, she did not jump up or bark. Super!!!
The 2nd run went really well too. I like that they have the timing lights on the jumps, so she can get used to the visual and the sound they make.
Can you ask people to come sit in the ring as ring crew? The ring there is very much like a library LOL so it will benefit her if she sees a person in a chair or a judge moving around.
I notice that every now and then she freezes on the start line and doesn’t release. She did it here once, and I remember her doing it here and there in other sessions. There is no lack of clarity there, meaning your cues and connection are clear. It is more likely a “this is hard” frozen moment – so you can mix in a lot of release forward and reward immediately for the first jump. She gets a lot of ‘catch’ rewards (which is great, keep moxing those in) but the ‘break’ releases to move forward are not rewarded as much with her current primary reinforcers (FOOD! Or the crazy toys!) Building in immediate rewards for the release forward will be a nice balance for the ‘catch’ rewards and for the rewards that come later in the sequence.
>>What is in the works for the youngsters when Max Pup 4 ends?>>
Possibly some type of young dog winter camp to carry on with the NFC adventures.
>> Lift will not be doing any kind of NFC debut this year partly because I don’t think she’ll be ready and also because I want her to debut on her “home turf” at Fusion and the next trials there are mid Jan, mid Feb, and April. Also because she’s getting spayed in early December so we’ll have a built in break for a few weeks there.>>
All of this makes sense – and if you are doing a traditional spay, you’ll want to have at least 6 week break from jumping/agility because of how much healing needs to happen, followed by re-conditioning. I know, I know, the vets will let you come back to agility sooner but the traditional spay is a big surgery and we definitely don’t want any pain or stiffness or restriction to be associated with agility. I did a lap spay with my 2 girls and the total time was 30 days – 10 days of restrictions then 20 days of re-conditioning. And the sports vets say the re-conditioning should take 2 to 3 times longer than the rest period. So if the rest period after surgery is 2 weeks after a spay, then an additional 4 to 6 weeks should be spend building back up and letting heal be very thorough. (It is a pain having girl dogs sometimes!!!) So mid-January might be a feasible NFC debut of just tricks and maybe tunnels? February is probably the target month for jumps and stuff.
>>Chaia pointed out that Master Class to me which looks cool, but I was wondering if there would be something else that might be more appropriate for Ms Lifty.
But the master class stuff does look cool (even though I can get myself into trouble when it’s a bit less structured and has a year to get feedback!). Are the working spots filling up fast?>>MasterClass will be cool! We do trial video evaluation but from the perspective of looking at timing. So looking at behavior and NFC stuff will probably be a better winter camp. I will be continuing to build up Ramen and Larry as well as debuting Jitterbug (yes I am deranged) so I think a winter camp for the youngsters might be the way to go 🙂 MasterClass will have unlimited working spots unless we get a zillion right away – but then it can be re-opened at any point and alums can always get a spot 🙂
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
Tracy
Good morning!
I don’t think your volume dial is broken at all! We are still tuning it in 🙂
>>Her volume dial is very dependent on what toy I’m using. I really can’t use a hollee roller in training anymore. It’s by far her favorite but she goes into stalking mode, especially as a placed toy.>>
The HR might not be useful for a placed toy, but it will be very useful for volume dial! It might send her into a higher arousal state which is absolutely useful for training (especially training at home). You can use the HR for volume dial if she will tug on it – you can get her to hopefiully tug on it by attaching it to another toy to make one big long tug toy. And then, using simple behaviors like tricks or simple agility behaviors, you can ramp up the arousal and do a bit of training. That will be GREAT for arousal regulation!
On the video:
Since she is happy to alternate between treats and toys (YAY!!), you can use them both in this game to optimize arousal.One place to use both is to add treats more is when you want to get the toy back after tugging. You can tug, stop the tugging, cue the out, and trade for a treat. This starts as a lure (showing the treat) before she drops it) but then we can quickly fade the lure and give her the treat after she releases the toy.
The treat here can help center her arousal and you can toss it away for her to get: which adds movement for this game and gives you a heartbeat to reset for the next cue 🙂And you can also experiment with using treats-only sometimes and see how she does. If the environment is very stimulating (like outside the ring at a trial) – food might be better. Or a toy plus food might be better – she will let you know based on how she responds.
A couple of other suggestions:
She did better when you were standing- the cue responses were not as good when you were kneeling. That’s fine, we don’t need kneeling here 🙂 so stay upright.And if the response is a little less than perfect or over the top, like that hand touch where she threw everything into it 😆 Reward anyway – take the extra “oomph” or responses that are not great as an indication of arousal level and ask for something else on the next rep.
If you ask for a cue and she can’t do it or offers an incorrect response, ask for something else. It is just an indication of she doesn’t quite undersand the cue in that context – the context can be the higher arousal, or different location, etc. This was happening when you asked for her paw (she thought it was a hand touch cue, they do look kind of similar) or when you were kneeling and you cued a sit, but she went into the down. This is all useful info about her arousal state – you can ask for something else and switch to the other reward and see how she does when you ask again for the behavior she was ‘wrong’ about.
>> she is VERY chill outside the ring. I’ll video some sessions this coming weekend in WI>>
Awesome! She might be chill for a few different reasons: maybe she is just naturally chill in that environment and always will be? Or maybe she is chill because she doesn’t really know that she is going to be doing THE AGILITY in that ring? Or maybe she only looks chill but underneath her stoic appearance is a lot of arousal? Hard to know, but no worries – the games help for all of it 🙂 Have fun at the trial and keep me posted!!
Tracy
Good morning! He was fantastic here! And he was even faster and more excited about playing this new game. Super!!!
If you have a handler blooper in class where you can’t keep going… you can totally play this game and have a big party when he finds your face 🙂
I think he is also ready for the next step, where you add this to a really simple sequence: start running it then deliberately mess up and stop and disconnect. When he finds your face: big rewards! Yay! He doesn’t have to take obstacles on his way to find your face, but it is perfectly fine if he does.
Great job here!
TracyGood morning!
>>UKI is limited nearby, but I’ve been keeping an eye open for it. Colorado is starting to ramp up, but driving there can be dicey in winter- depends on weather. 🙂>>
Yes, the winter weather gets in the way. Any USDAA nearby? They have very similar FEO rules to UKI, and the courses are a little more straightforward than UKI for baby dogs. And the trials will be very small, which is also good for youngsters.
??Thanks for the emphasis. 🙂 I purposely signed up for preferred, lower height and plan to run NFC to keep focus on figuring out what he needs and having fun. I still get nervous with my young boy. 🙂>>
Yes! It cracks me up that we have all run other dogs for all of these years… but bringing out the youngster is nerve-wracking hahahahaha
>>I think starting with empty hands makes sense as we usually practice either with the toy in my pocket or back at a location. The late summer trial went well, I think my main mistake there was not entering at a lower jump height.>>
You can tug on the way into the ring, the stick the toy in your pocket. Be sure to have spots planned where you will reward him and stick to that – it is very easy for us humans to NOT reward during the NFC/FEO runs, but that defeats the purpose of them at this stage 🙂 Getting a good sequence then having a party is super important 🙂
>>I’m looking forward to reworking remote reinforcement with you again as well as working going through the gates. His love of the game is still changing and I can feel him ramping up 🙂>>
Sounds good – I imagine it will not be hard for him. I think that the main thing now is sorting out what he needs before runs and after runs.
>>Question: Facebook sent me your link to this master class timing https://agilitymasterclass.com/>>
Facebook is very smart hahahahahahahaha
>>How do these classes work versus this class or your summer camp? Is this something we would be ready for or is it beyond our current skills? >>
MasterClass is a 4-module giant single topic thing (50 games/sequences or more, I think?). In this case, it is timing (huge topic, right?) and all of the games/sequences/courses are focused on getting great timing. It starts with foundation stuff (geared towards finding the timing), then goes into skills drills, then builds to course work across the levels: Novice, Advanced, Masters, International.
It has lifetime access and the working participants have a year to submit their video (the year begins on the date of the first video submission).
So it is probably twice as extensive as CAMP and also more singularly focused on what it takes to get great timing. CAMP leans more towards tackling current course challenges and handling “moves”, training skills, etc. The MasterClass is more about tackling a huge variety of challenges, with timing as the main focus. Plus MasterClass has trial video review, from the perspective of looking at the handler’s timing.
It is something that all young dogs can start and over the course of the year, build up to the hard stuff. Let me know what you think!
Tracy
That is fantastic!! He is a teeter maniac LOL!!! And it is hilarious that he will do it for kibble. I am glad to hear he is getting so much exposure to all of those different teeters. Super!!!
Hi!
>>“He had two moments at the back of the ring where he was not with you (1:32 and 2:04) – was he finding a line because cues were late, or distracted by the other ring or ring crew?” – probably a bit of both I did not show him the decel he needed to get the turn into the weaves which launched him towards the distraction of the other ring. You can hear Karen telling me it’s all on me.>>
When that happens, keep handling as if it didn’t happen – use verbals and keep going (even if you make it up for a moment) then reward. Stopping, even if he gets a cookie, can cause a drop in motivation and focus – movement is key and that will help avoid him thinking anything has gone wrong.
>>“I think jut tossing it away as fast as you can will be better” — what’s your thought, the faster I can get him started after the temperature games the better?>>
Yes – the more you stay connected and lead out with connection and release, the more engagement you will have. When you leave him in his stay to hand the leash to the person, you have disconnected and he starts to look around (which indicates a shift in arousal). We don’t want that, so if you put him in the sit as soon as you are taking the leash off, just toss the leash away so you can be super connected and quick to lead out and release him.
Another option to play with is getting the leash off sooner, before he is in his sit. I like to bring the dogs in, take the leash off and get rid of it (sometimes handing it to the leash runner as I go past them) then play with the dog to the line (volume dial!), set up the lead out, etc. Taking the leash out of the picture sooner really lets me know where the dog is, in terms of arousal & engagement, and helps me stay a lot more connected 🙂
On the video – you can see him looking around as you walk away without connection here. He reconnects when you reconnect or when you reach into your pocket for cookies, but in those moments of looking around his arousal state and engagement are shifting, so distractions in the environment become more obvious. Now, it is ok if the dog looks away for a heartbeat then looks back at us, but ideally handler and dog have connection on the lead out before the release.
Looking for his leash at the end of the run can be a super useful end of run ritual! You can add in having the leash-on-chair set up there and he continues past it to do a sequence, then you can add in the marker to go find the leash.
>>We go place the target together close to the crate orI place it somewhere obvious by the exit gate.>>
I’m also thinking that I can use the target to get the lotus ball out of my hand – leave it on the target and send him to it>>Perfect! Both of these will be very useful as you build up the remote reinforcement games!!
>>I’m out now till mid November – off to Italy this afternoon – yay for us>>
Safe travels! Have a blast! I am sure it will be amazing!
Tracy
Hi!
>>When is the last day we can post for this class?
The current last date is December 30th, but we might run over into the new year depending on weather and stuff 🙂
>>I’d consider USDAA too but there’s nothing local any time soon.>>
I just ran a local USDAA – I had 3 dogs entered who had never done USDAA but since they were all running FEO, I didn’t get them measured 🙂 And I ran my 19″ tall rental whippet at 12″ and no one batted and eye lash 🙂 So don’t worry 🙂 And I think I ran UKI NFC without getting measurements the first few times. They don’t really care as long as you are doing NFC.
T
I’d prefer not to have to focus on getting a measurement yet since that will probably be a project in itself and I think I’d be able to just run NFC without a measurement for the weekend in UKI. There’s a lot of CPE in the area but I’ve never competed in that venue so I think I’d be a little nervous myself about rules etc. I’d rather just focus on her than worrying about myself lol.
Hi!
>>I actually think I did this for the FEO run, lol. 🙂
Perfect!!! Some dogs need the patterns after the volume dial, but most fit nicely into the pattern game then volume dial ritual.
🤣🤣🤣 I think I’m going to struggle with that in the beginning with Kat. She is so fast that I know my brain is going to be thinking about getting to the next thing and not want to wait for her to commit.>> That is a normal struggle with young dogs – it doesn’t matter how long any of us have been doing agility, we all get twitchy with the young dogs LOL!! That is part of why the Find My Face game was invented. In the demo video with baby Contraband, I was SO TWITCHY. In his masters run at a trial last weekend? Smooth and calm and confident. But I was twitchy with the young dogs LOL!
> True, she might have been mentally tired with those as indicators. Or frustrated or aroused. But either way it is good to finish early before the dog gets tired.
> OK, that is weird. LOL!!!
>>This is our debut FEO video. We ran Nov. JWW. My goals were for her to hold her start line and stay engaged the whole time in the ring, which she did fantastically!! One of her best doggie friends was in line behind us, and she was able to ignore her.>>
She did great! And having a friend on line behind her does make it extra challenging! Remember that you can play with her and talk to her on the way to the line and after you take the leash off – that will relax both of you (but mainly you, it will relax you more LOL!)
>>I did not plan to stop to fix anything, but I ended up doing that twice. 🙈 The first time, I didn’t think she was going to take the jump after the one she missed>>
Yep – no stopping allowed! The course was a tiny tight little AKC course and add in footing that is harder to grip… so you were late on the info, she went past the jump. If that happens, don’t have a change of energy, don’t stop or fix… take it as a cue to you to connect more and show the line more. Then when she gets the next jump? Reward! Keep her confidence high! And remember that you are not there to run the course the judge set – you are there to show a few lines and reward and have fun.
>>I cannot remember if I gave her a turn cue, and I know (after watching the video) that I was too close to the jump and didn’t turn my shoulders early enough.>>
Correct, the physical cue was late (should have started at landing of 1) and the send to 2 actually looked like you stepped to the backside line of 3 (which is where she went – good girl!!!!)
>> Should I just ignore when she misses a jump and assume it was always me? She tends to go around jumps a lot, so I worry about reinforcing that too many times.>>
Yes – if she goes past a jump, it is handler error of late/unclear info. She didn’t find it reinforcing to run past 3 or the jumps on the ending line, she knew something was not quite right.
For going around jumps, is she tending to do it more on these short distances, and on turf/mats? She really doesn’t go around jumps in her training videos, which are bigger distances and on really great grass footing. Turf (and mats) require more processing to be able to turn because she has to move differently, so the cues have to come sooner (especially on those itty bitty AKC distances LOL!!)
>>For the second half, I know that it was a late blind that made her miss the jump>>
Timing was a little late at :54 there but mainly, you were running towards sper posiiton without connection, so she was (correctly) staying on the parallel line line a layer or setting up a backside threadle. Good girl! Then as soon as you started the blind, she was like “oh crap, gotta turn!” but she was alreayd too far past the jump and the turf is not grippy enough that she could have gotten it last minute.
She did get back on the line immediately and took the red jump – that is super rewardable!!
>> I was worried about possibly sending her over the double and triple at a bad angle (assuming I could have gotten her to keep going forward), particularly since she’s never seen those two jumps before. I just put her back on the line to give her a better approach rather than actually fixing it.>>
Ideally, rewarding her for the red jump would be first, then setting up for the ending line (it is a lot for our human brains in the moment LOL!)
The AKC rule of not being able to throw the reward makes the big ending lines tricky, espeically with the triple as the last jump (really, judge? for baby dogs where the handler is guaranteed to be behind from the previous line? Sigh).
We really don’t want to reward those from hand. So if you see that in a run, do one jump (the first one on the line), then reward. Then set her up in a sit stay (this is legal, you did it really well at :49), lead out, get another jump or two from ahead, then reward – that way she can see the line and be supported, without having to drive ahead on the spreads.To solidify those big long lines, UKI NFC is the absolute best bet: You can bring a helper into the ring and the helper can throw the toy on the line for you. Makes it so much easier!
Great job here!!
Tracy
Hi!
>>Sorry we have been at the nationals – a good way to make it ran hard.
I hope it was fun and that the weather was not too bad!
>>In Synch did great with pattern games, waits and trick work around the ring>>
That is fantastic! And it will set a good foundation for when things get even more exciting.
>>I didnt try when it was raining hard as neither of us would have been impressed.>>
That is relatable! I wouldn’t want to do it either 🙂
>> At the moment she is highly focused outside the ring. am Thinking I might try to do a couple of jumps at ribbon trial in dec between courses will see how she goes . Might change things when she realises she can actually run in the ring.>>
That would be great!
>>Yes definitely need to tidy my handling and verbals- the blood rushes to my head and ever thought in my head disappears- her and fusion a bit the same silent is a struggle. I also havent taught her alot of verbals at the moment buyt then fall back on needng to talk.. my problem not hers lol>>
More planning needed before each run, then 🙂 Plan 4 things: the handling, the connection, the verbals, and the reward. With young dogs, it takes a lot longer to plan things than it takes to run things 🙂
>>I suppose my thought was that she worked really well in the seminar on food and that kept her arousal down a little.>>
Because she is doing well with food and toy right now, you can and should use both during the rewarding to help balance the arousal. We want her to learn to self-regulate, so rewarding with a tug then giving treats to get the tug back, then a quick decompression with food (treats tossed in the grass, or a snuffle mat). Avoiding the arousal won’t help 🙂 So we should definitely approach the arousal using food and toys.
>>I tend to be too slow to pull out and throw the toy or drop it onto the ground.>>
You can also work very short easy sequences with the toy in your hand (or a lotus ball with food) – this has a dual purpose of getting the placement of reward out very fast, and teaching arousal regulation because she has to actively ignore the toys to find the jumps. Very short, simple sequences are important, though, so she can be successful.
>>which is true but I tend to get a charge and a bite .
We definitely don’t want the charge and bite! Having the toy in your hand and being able to throw it on the line will help (then working on being able to get the toy back, so you are not worried about throwing it). For example, you can throw a treat toy like the lotus ball or treat hugger so she gets the treat on the line but is not likely to run around with the lotus or hugger. Then you can reward her with the tug for coming back.
And the find my face game helps with charging/biting too 🙂
Sorting the reward use/placement and getting rid of the charge/bite are high priorities, more important than hard sequencing at this point.
>>I think I need to work on a finish behaviour of go get toy rather than grab it off me.>>
For sequence work and training – using your reward markers will make all the difference. Running with a toy in your hand is a great way to start this: rather than praise or stop a sequence, use a ‘get it’ marker for a thrown reward and a ‘take’ marker for a toy from your hand. Be super consistent with short easy sequences to both help her understand and to let you practice using the markers. If she is unclear about how to earn the toy, she is likely to bite you 🙂
>> I dont know but thinking when get to ring need a behaviour that is not bite the momma as soon as do last jump. probably a sit wasnt the right thing>>
Yes, that gets built off the remote reinforcement (we start that plus end of run behavior this week). In NZ, are they allowed to tug on their leash? You can send her to her leash. Or, you can teach her to jump in your arms on cue. Lots of options!
Tracy
Hi!
>>She got the weekend off from training and hung out at the agility trial this weekend. And because I’m exhausted, we went on walks the last two nights instead of training. This weekend she’ll be tagging along to WI to Canine Sorts Zone while Emmie competes at an ISC trial.>>Perfect! She can practice all her games near the ring at the ISC trial! And since you were exhausted, it was better to go for walks and not train – we humans are better when are rested too 🙂
> One of the things I notice about training young dogs is OUR humans brains have a lot of processing to do too!!! Masters dogs are so much easier LOL!!! In our excitement, we lose precision behaviors like connection or reward placement. or correct verbals, etc LOL!!! Just like the dogs do LOL!!! But if you focus on the reward placement, your brain will be able to do it 🙂 And since she loves to chase toys, you can create a little reinforcement loop: If she takes the line you want, you can reward with the placed toy in the good spot, then as she brings it back to you, throw another toy long distance for her to chase. A double whammy of fun!
>>I try the water on the next round of sequences. I’m sure there’s plenty of places it’ll be applicable there too.>>
Yes, it is applicable everywhere 🙂 We have 80 degree weather coming today, so I will be out there without the dogs but with a water bottle to get my arms under control again LOL!
>>You posted your Master class on timing in one of the groups. Do you think that would be a good next step from Lu? Or too advanced for her?>>
Good question! It starts with foundation work and then skills work then novice through masters course work (the last module is international course work) – so yes, it would be good because it doesn’t begin with insanely hard stuff 🙂 And working participants have a year to do it, so you have plenty of time to get the hard stuff done too 🙂
>> Julie and I were discussing some NFC options and I don’t think we would have one until December (and I’m not certain if I should enter Lu in it yet/if she’s ready for it yet).Is that something that could be posted in that class?>>
Yes and no – MasterClass doesn’t do view review for NFC stuff in particular. The trial video review is more about looking at timing, which is still applicable to young dogs (their timing needs can be wildly different from run to run, and different from our adult dogs).
Lu is ready to experience NFC/FEO in UKI, USDAA, AKC, or even CPE 🙂 You can get in there and play and do tunnels or one jump games – no need to run sequences at first. We are just getting her into the environment to have a grand time, see how she feels, let her practice some arousal regulation, some pre- and post- run rituals, line ups, etc. Zero pressure to run sequences. I think UKI is the most friendly for that, but if there is any USDAA that is great too – very small trials and similar NFC rules as UKI has. I just did a day of USDAA locally and it was GREAT for my young dogs in particular! 2 days of NFC so far (and no interest in trying to get a Q) have been fantastic for Ramen (the baby whippet) in particular, he is suddenly a very engaged, confident teammate who is looking really ready for more. Maybe I should teach him contacts and weaves LOL!!! And Lu will do the same thing – you will see her begin to blossom in that environment – it is really cool!
Tracy
