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Good morning!
I agree that your assessment of the extra room with the tunnels adds to the fun of running through the tunnel (toy or no toy). She is really accelerating to the tunnel now and that is also bubbling over to toy play being really fun in this moment too. She is not loving the line up to get to where you want her to be for the next rep (“I’ll be over here, just send me to the tunnel thanks!” – Lift, probably) which makes some of the starts to the reps a bit of a question for her, so a few ideas for you:
– you can tug her back into position next to you and very close, then gently hold her collar (if she doesn’t find it icky)
– you can line up with a cookie – lowest value pocket-lint level cookie when using a toy in a new environment LOL or high value food if that is the reinforcement in the session. If can be something like: line up for a cookie, stick with me (stay close) for another cookie, then send to the tunnel (or gently hold her collar before the send).
– you can work line up stuff at your side or between your feet so that is a comfortable position for starting reps, even when a yummy tunnel is right there.Backsides – these are going really well!! One suggestion:
as you get further and further across the bar, toss the reward back behind you to where the wing and bump meet (try to get it to land on the landing spot as if it was a backside wrap :)) . This is an exaggerated placement to help her come around the wing and look at the bump and not at you – the rewards were near you and a little ahead, so throwing them back away from you to the landing spot near the wing will help her get independence. And even though the reward is where the backside wrap landing spot will be, we won’t accidentally create too much turn there because when we fade that, she will be reading the position/motion and the verbal.>>she took one forwards even with 1 wing.>>
That was a good moment for her to see the difference between the cues. No worries! I think that you might have been moving slowly so she slipped in front of you – you can add more motion so she gets more of an extension cue coming up the line. It seemed a lot easier to start from a sit because it allows you to set the line sooner – she was super confident on those and really driving to the backside! Yay!
Sounds like there were some distractions in the environment during the rocking horses game and she did really well – great exposure to things she will encounter while playing a fast and fun game.
She was REALLY opening up into extension here and I love it! And still turning really well on the wings too. On the first rep or two you can see her processing things (trot for a step or two then run). Putting the wing wrap into a sequence after the tunnel surprised her on the first rep and then doing the wing to the tunnel surprised her. But after seeing the each the first time, she was all about the running and was terrific! Very fun 🙂 You can start adding even more distance between the tunnel and wings, even if it is only once every couple of weeks (depending on when you can get into Fusion and how the weather is to train outside).Great job!
Tracy
Good morning!
>>He didn’t have to pee, wasn’t too full or too hungry AND I didn’t touch his collar.>>
These are all pretty important! I mean, I am not so good at training if I have to pee, or I am stuffed or hangry, or someone is holding my neck LOL!!!
Basically, not using the collar grabs when the toy is involved greatly reduces the pressure and really helped here!
The tunnel-wing rocking horse looked really strong! He was fast through the tunnel and to the wing, and line focused. Super!!! You can add the 2nd wing to the game now (which also means adding more running :))
The decel game went great – he was really strong about finding the jump on the acceleration line. And for the turn, he was great about turning when you were decelerated. Being sideways to the jump was too much turn cue for him and he slowed way down (based on his size, it is likely that you won’t need to use super rotated turn cues because we won’t need a ton of collection from him).
Great job!!
TracyGood morning! It was such a nice weather weekend!
Good spin on the first rep! Then some toy retrieve issues – one thing to work on in a small indoor room at first (then ring it outside) is doing a wrap on a wing, letting go of the toy, then getting him to come back to another toy (or a low value cookie). He doesn’t have to bring the toy 🙂 he gets rewarded for coming back to you rather than long toy victory laps where you have to go get him. The laps with the toy are fine if you cue it, and ideally he comes back pretty quickly (especially if you have; t cued a ‘go for a run’ with the toy).
As you add more speed to the spins, remember to use your eyes more (connection) and arms less 🙂 When you are looking ahead/pointing ahead, he is not as sure of where to go and e ends up looking at the you and the toy (like at 1:43). And when you are more connected and looking at him more? Very smooth and fast!!
Serps – he is getting the idea for sure! Good job to you for keeping your shoulders facing the jump on there serp!
Try not to release him from his stay until you are at the exit wing (which is more like serp position and less like threadle position). What was happening here was he was doing the serp when you released him at the entry wing, because he could come in front of you. When you were closer to the exit wing later in the session, he went around the jump because jumping towards you is much harder – but it is a main element of a serp. So, move very slowly but don’t release until you are at the exit wing so he can learn to serp directly toward you.On the threadle video:
He did well coming to the correct side of the jump (good job mixing in stay rewards here and on the serp video too)>>He comes to the threadle side but goes around the entire jump.>>
It looks like motion is overriding the understanding of finding the bar (then he got a little locked onto the MM), so you can take out the motion for a session or two: stand perfectly still in threadle position so as soon as he gets. To the threadle side, you click the MM. Then when he figures that out, you can stay in threadle position but delay the click ever so slightly until he looks at the bar.
When he is zipping in for the threadle and back out to the bar with no questions (and no additional handling help) then you can start to add back very slow moving through the threadle.
The turn and burn went really well! His value for wings is really blossoming!
When sending, be sure you are connected. So even on the easier turns for him, he would sometimes hesitate if you pointed ahead or didn’t connect fully.A general puppy training thing is if you send to a wing and they look at you instead… you need to connect more and lower your hands (like you did 1:10 – 1:15, which was gorgeous!!!)
Great job here!!
Tracy
Good morning! Good job with these games!! What was happening here was you were mainly doing lap turn cues so when you were showing the info for a lap turn, she got it really well!
The lap turn is a threadley move where we face the dog and use an extended hand (usually one hand, the one closer to the jump) to draw the dog to us (and a connection shift to the hand too :)) but a main part of the lap turn cue is the footwork: as the dog is almost arriving at the hand, the leg next to the jump steps back as the hand draws the dog through – then hand and leg turn the dog away to the jump to get the commitment.
It looks like this (slightly different angle but same arm/footwork):
When you were facing her but backing up on the first video, it was hard to get her past the front side of the jump (motion there made it unclear as to fit she should take the front or come to the back).
On the 2nd video (breaking it down) you were stationary and using the hand more (more shifting connection for sure! Yay!) but your feet stayed together so she didn’t always have the cue or room to get past you to the backside of the jump. (This video was posted twice).
On the 4th video where you were breaking it down too – it was hard for her on the first couple of reps. Then your leg started to step back (:22) and that allowed her to get it. Yay!! On every rep after than on this video and the next 2, she got it if your inside leg stepped back. But if the leg didn’t move or didn’t let her get past you to the backside, she (correctly) ended up on the front side or flipping away
On the 5th video, you had the connection and footwork starting to come together: at the beginning, your turn hand is hidden by being close to you (it should be fully extended towards her, practically locking your elbow straight) and you were looking at her.
But then at :20 you had a clear connection shift, more visible hand, more leg step back – she got it. Yay! The mechanics were good too at :47 but you stepped forward with the other leg before she could pass you, which pushed her to the front of the jump
Last video: good shift at the start and your position gave her more room so she was able to get it on both reps – yay! So that is going to be your most successful way of doing the lap turns. You don’t need to be as far from the jump, as long as you do the exaggerated arm & leg movement.
You might find the threadle wraps where you are moving forward are actually easier and, depending on the sequnece on course, will keep you further ahead. This is where your feet are moving forward on the line the whole time, not facing her at all, so there is no real footwork needed. It is more similar to a tandem turn than to a lap turn, and it looks like this:
You still have the connection shift to your hands but your line of motion is forward the whole time.
Nice work here! Let me know what you think!
Tracy
Good morning!
I am glad he is doing well with the rocking horses!
>>When you say spin do you mean what some call a reverse spin?>>
Yes – the FC-then-BC combo. You turn towards him to start the spin, and away from him to start the blind.
He was really good about coming in. For the serps! And his confusion about threadles was a positional cue question. Think of it as entry wing versus exit ing (the one closer to the MM here). The positional cue for the serp is being nearer to the exit wing. And the positional cue for the threadle is before you get to the entry wing.
For serps, you would want to be visible across between the bars & closer to the wing before you release him. You were releasing when you were in threadle position and he was getting the serp reward, which is why you had to stand still on the threadles.
Ideally for the serp, you would walk 2 more steps or so, so you don’t release him for the serp until you are closer to the exit wing.
You were really good about having the serp position visible as you started moving, then releasing, so the arm movement or foot movement was not at the same time as the release! Yay! He needs some more rewards tossed back to him so he doesn’t anticipate the serp and break the stay.
Then for the threadles – release from threadle position and move very slowly so he still sees you in threadle position at this stage (it will get easier as he gets more experienced with moving threadles).
You can do one session like that and if he is mostly correct, you can add the threadle slice verbal. That will help too!
He had a little struggle going over the bar for the threadle – you can move the MM so it is very visible of the bar and click it as soon as he gets to the correct side of the jump (the side between you and the jump :)) That will get him into the habit of looking for the bar after coming to the threadle side.
Great job here!!
TracyHi!
This session went well! She is doing a good job with those backsides and finding the bar even when you running forward without connection (as you are supposed to do LOL!!) She might need a ‘get it’ marker for when you throw the toy back even when you are running ahead, so she knows she has permission to ignore your running line 🙂When you are timing the backside cues, you can start them sooner with her. She has a big stride so you can tell her about the backside no later than takeoff of the first jump after the wing wrap. So as you see her feet getting ready to lift up for jump 1, you should already be connected and starting the a-la-la cue. That way she has already processed it when she lands and can go directly to the backside.
She was seeing the cue start just as she was landing at :03 (first video) and :04 (2nd video) so she had a little bit of a zig zag to go back out to the backside.>>I also took my eyes off Mira when I was going to do the regular line and she just went around the jump.
That was at :33 o the first video – yes, there was not a lot of regular connection but also she was probably just in ‘backside mode’ and anticipating that it would be a backside. Oopsie! That is definitely something I have seen dogs do 🙂 I didn’t see anything in the handling you did to push her to the backside by accident and then she was perfect after that, so it was one of those rare moments where the dog actually had the blooper, probably because you had been working on backsides so she was expecting it 🙂 Of all the videos and games she has done in this class, I don’t think she has made a single error til this one, so no worries 🙂 I will watch the video again later to make sure I still don’t see anything that accidentally cued the backside LOL!
Great job here!
TracyHi! You have had a stretch of bad weather and now it is crazy to see outdoors on grass in February! But it is good to be able to practice outdoors 🙂
Looking at the turn aways: I think it will feel easier if your feet are moving forward to the jump the whole time, which would mean not sending to the start wing from as far away because then you were at the turn jump with no place to move to. That meant your feet were facing her so it made the turn away a little harder for timing. And if you turned your feet too early (like at :13 on video 1) you end up pushing her off the jump because it looks like a backside cue.
The ideal line of motion would look like the line of motion you did on th e3rd video, when you started with a straight line to the jump and the little speed circle around the wings – then you were able to move forward more into the connection shift/turn away and it went well!
On the last video on the other side, you also had more motion and that made it easier 🙂
Good job shifting your connection (and catching yourself when you were looking at her the whole time LOL!) You can now start to do the connection shift sooner, which means the turn away can be sooner:
The last video gives us a great view of the line and the timing. You can start the connection shift as soon as she exits the wing before the turn jump, and then you can start the turn away cues before she arrives at the halfway point between the wing and the jump. You were doing the connection shift when she was maybe a stride from the jump, so she did get the turn but it was happening mostly on landing rather than on takeoff.Another reason to start the cues sooner is that on a bigger course it will be easier for you to cue the turn away and run the new direction, keeping you ahead of her more (which is a good thing with a speedy dog!!)
Great job here! I am looking forward to the other videos!
Tracy
Hi!
She did really well with the Minny Pinny!>>Holding her collar seemed to confuse her, but she clearly seemed to get the concept after sleeping on it.>>
I have found whippets to be the BEST at sleeping on things then coming back totally knowing them 🙂 For the next session, you can add the verbal before any cue to start moving:
line her up on your right side, so she is facing the Minny Pinny directly. Gently hold her collar and start saying your left verbal 3 or 4 times (she will be turning to her left when starting on your right side) Then let go of the collar and you can cue her to start moving (if she doesn’t already start moving when you let go). Then after the reward, repeat the process on the other side by lining her up on your left side facing the MP, holding her collar, saying your right verbal, etc.
The goal is that she hears the verbal before moving to strengthen it as a cue, and that she is facing the MP rather than turning away to start it.>> I hate that this flooring seems more slippery than I had anticipated.
It is a little slippery when she tries to go fast! I bought cheap turf rolls on Amazon that cover the floor, and that gives good grip! That is something to consider so she has a little more grip as she moves through the games.
Great job here 🙂
Tracy>> I feel like go on is a pretty strong skill. I’m thinking the collected turn exercise should be the first one to try. >>
Yes, that is a good one to start with and the “go” lines can (and should) be mixed in as balance reps.
>> I’m still unsure how the line you run for the backside with the off arm differs from the line you run to get the out with the off arm. You had us running a straight line up from the wing for both the way I understand it.
Yes, the line of motion is not all that different – it is the other cues that make it different (timing, physical cue, verbal cue). So the timing would be slightly different:
For the get out, you can start it before the dog exits the wing wrap (ideally exiting the wing wrap heading to the get out jump)
For the backside, I would start it after the dog has completed the wing wrap and is now parallel to get out bar.The physical cue with the outside arm is slightly different, to indicate the different lines because it would rotate the upper body slightly differently:
For the get out, my outside arm points to the exit wing of the get out jump. For the backside, my outside arm points to the entry wing of the backside jump.And the verbals are different too of course 🙂
>>If you have video highlighting the differences that would be great.>>
I will grab some when our weather clears – it has been a wet few days.
>>Also, on the collected turns….do you still shift your connection to the landing side after you stare them down on the incoming freight train to the jump?>>
It will depend on the dog. But the dogs that need the extreme connection for collection often do not also need the connection shift to the landing spot.
Tracy
Hi! I am happy to hear the pattern game and Find My Face game are going well!
Nice job with the tunnel session 🙂
Coming towards you was easy for him to figure out. It took him a moment to sort out moving away from you through the tunnel, but then he was able to offer it really easily and also do it on cue with the verbal. You can keep adding different angles of entry now, so he can find the tunnel from all sorts of angles.He found the threadle side (turning away) very easy when he had to turn right at the end of the session. When he had to turn to his left – that was a lot harder for him, so you can have him a lot closer to the entry when he has to turn left to get into it.
Minny Pinny is looking good! Since we think he is a righty, try to start these coordination games with him turning to his right for the first few steps so he gets the idea. Then it will be easier to get the left turns too.
You can move to the next step here, of holding his collar with him on your left, saying the right verbal 3 or 4 times then letting go so he goes around to his right. The after a few reps to the right, switch him to your right (so he is turning left) and repeat the process of adding the verbal.
Great job here!! Fingers crossed for more good weather ahead!
Tracy
Good morning!
>>I will try tossing a treat and running away with the toy today to see if I get some enthusiasm.>>
Perfect! You could even do a treat toss (might need to be a low value treat if he would have trouble going to the toy after a treat) then chase you for the big long toy, then let him have the toy and you do a FC and run the other way and toss a treat (he doesn’t have to bring the toy back, just toss the next treat as part of the game :))
>> two toy game with a 2 minute timer.
I don’t think it was a length of session issue on the previous video, it was more about the collar grabs. So a 2 minute timer is great but skip the collar grab when it comes to toy play.
>> We do collar grabs when we practice recalls. Then I either just praise & let him go or have really good treats while I hold the collar, >>
I’m sure that’s a big part of why he is soooo much better with it! So keep going with the amazing food with the collar grabbing but don’t bring the collar grab into toy play yet.
Keep me posted!!
TracyThis all sounds good – you and Paul have a house full of agility whippets! So fun! I am excited to see more whippets in the agility ring because they are terrific!!
Hi!
Yes, wing and bump for the backside so she doesn’t see it as a full jump yet – the front of the jump might have too much value, so leaving it as a semi-jump will make it easier for her to find the backside wing.T
Hi!
>>MassChaos Deborah Taylor Holt
Perfect! Great team!!!! Too bad you live so far away or we would snag you for our team!
>>Their board is a little wider – I wasn’t moving but maybe I was further back than I have been before Location was the same but definitely West was more distracted>>
Might be subtle differences? When video taping for flyball, if possible, get 2 videos: one right on the box/wall turn only, and one of the bigger picture to see your handling.
>Ah, I see, I need to think about my handling with the turn more>>
Sometimes we move too early? Or put too much pressure on? So video will tell us that.
>>He has only had the ball on the wall two sessions and he has just sniffed at it or nose touched it, no grabbing yet –
We definitely want the grabbing! Assuming he is picking it up off the ground as part of a retrieve – Before putting it on the board, put it at the base of the board, on the floor, and send him to retrieve it. And if that is fine for one or two reps – put it in on the board but also lower the board, making it as low/flat as possible so he can get on the board and grab the ball. That can help with the ‘aha!’ moment needed to transfer the understanding of grabbing the ball to the board. I will be doing that tonight in team practice so I will get some video (along with other video – it is a new board in a new location so I will probably start with an easier step in the progression)
>>Thank you! A lot of people I know focus on either flyball or agility>>
There are not a lot who do both, except down here in Region 9 where I would say at least 25% of the people who do flyball also do agility. On my team, it is closer to 40 or 50% of us do both.
Looking at the video:
>> noticed a lot of extra turns when I set him up?I’d say he enjoys the Minny Pinny game LOL!! And great job with the reward placement! He was starting without you a bit but no worries, that will go away in the next steps (see below).
You can switch sides after every rep or two – it looked like he was getting dizzy turning to the left (or looking in a mirror/reflection on the right turns LOL!!)
>>(My tight turn words are counter (I have been trying to consistently say it in a short choppy way) and right so for soft turns I am say LA and Rue both more drawn out?>>
I like the way your LA and Rue sounded! You can repeat them a bit in the next step, so it is more like Laaa Laaaaa Laaaa instead of a single La.For the next steps:
Hold his collar (or a harness is fine) so you can say the verbal 2 or 3 times… then let him go to start the MP. That will really help attach the verbal.And I think he is ready for the advanced level where there are bumps as jump bars for him to go over too!
>>Lastly, I have been struggling some with the serp/threadle exercises and (I know this is obvious now that I think about it but it didn’t click at first) I realized with both my older dogs I still do lots of arm changes with both serps and threadles, I have been debating if I should try with West the open shoulder no arm change approach – I think I can teach him the arm changes later if its not working??>>
Excellent point!!! For serps, definitely try it with just the dog-side arm back (no cross arm) because you will be able to move faster. For threadles – there is a lot of debate about threadle arms so my answer is to show him both styles. What I have seen is that the one-arm threadle works GREAT when we are in good position and doing one of those lovely, intuitive European style-threadles. However, the cross arm threadle is VERY useful for when we are doing those American threadles (like the really hard ones in AKC Premier) and/or when we are NOT in great position or behind the dog. The cross arm REALLY helps and is very easy for the dog to see especially on the harder threadles. So, he can learn both – it is pretty easy to show him the arms in different contexts and the dogs learn it really quickly 🙂
Great job here!
Tracy
