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Hi!
He is hitting the serp hand beautifully! And you are holding the hand in the ext right position for him to hit it without having to jump up at all.Adding the jump went really well! No problem at all!!
The reward placement when you had the jump in was perfect – you rewarded from the other hand while drawing him into the turn in front of you, and then tossed another treat away to start the next rep. I think he is ready for you to add an empty food bowl on the ground as a reward target, and then you can drop a treat into after he touches the serp hand.
The only other thing to add in is pointing your feet to the reward hand (because that is the direction you will be moving when we add motion).
Great job here!!
TracyHi!
>>just a short trail walk because it was COLD and WINDY AF. She had a grand old time. Me, not so much lol.>>
Totally same here! I like to hide in the house in this weather LOL!
>>So, how can I differentiate between independent play behavior (not sure of a better way to phrase it) and decompression? >>
There is probably no black and whit away to do it – the play and the decompression are all linked.
>>how can I know that she’s playing vs needs a decompression moment? >>
Could be both! Play like that can be decompression, or just having a grand time. Either way is great, imo 🙂 The more practice she gets with playing and bringing the toy back when she is ready, the more you will see her bring it back when she wants to do more (or not bring it back when things are hard and she needs a moment to decompress).
>>it seems murky deciphering what is self-elected decompression and what is her playing or not understanding the game.>>
Murky is a great word, because there are no hard and fast lines that can separate one from the other – all of the behavioral functions swirl together. You can keep track of things to get better insight: when in the session does she take the toy away to play? Early, when she is very stimulated? Later, maybe fatigued? After a failure or two? Or after a few reps of a new skill, even though there is no failure? Tracking it will help you see what the patterns are, which will give you better insight into why she takes the toy sometimes and sometimes brings it back.
And no worries if you don’t totally know yet. As long as decompression and agency is built into your training, she is going to do really well.
Strike a pose with the cookies is looking great! And she is also doing really well with the toy too 🙂 Your shoulder position looked great! And she is doing the in-then-out perfectly 🙂 Yay!
>>She seems to be waiting for me to animate the toy before grabbing it. Makes sense that whippet would find a dead toy less interesting than a moving one.>>
Yes, I totally see what you mean. She is doing the in-then-out behavior and she really responds to your energetic marker. So as long as she turns to the toy before you move, you can then move the toy to get her more engaged. You can also have the toy placed further away on the line so she runs to it more (she might like that too!)
>>So I totally understand the importance of taking breaks and latent learning. BUT I also feel like if I take a day off every couple of days and only do one session a day, I will become buried in class material. Plus, she seems to like to really like to do the things and she does need mental stimulation. >>
Trying to balance training time for puppies is SO HARD!!! Totally relatable.
>>Would you say that one session a day and taking a day off every couple days should be my default training schedule or should I base it on what she shows me?>>
A little of both, perhaps? If your daily schedule permits it, maybe a morning session then an evening session. And every couple of days, a day no training (especially if she has had a busy day, the following day can be a no-training day).
>>Is it enough to just not repeat games/exercises every day, or should I aim to only do one session per day? >>
You can alternate days: hard new stuff and then the next day, easy fun stuff like running through tunnels LOL! Then give that skill (the hard or easy one) a day off and do something else the next day.
You all see that the games really build up on themselves a lot, and you don’t need them to be perfect before going to the next game 🙂
>>Of course, I don’t want to push her into depletion, and then take a break. But I also feel like if I don’t train, she might get bored.>>
Timing the sessions will definitely avoid depletion. And if you don’t do a formal training session, you can do something else to prevent boredom. I play silly random games with the pups like hide and seek in the house, group sit competitions with all the dogs (whichever dog sits fastest wins the cookie :))and similar silliness which is goofy but also useful for training in general. And then there is the “here is a chew bone please chill out” behavior that theoretically whippets should be good at LOL!!!
>>So I guess I’m not sure if I should get Vesper in a trial environment while she’s young, or if it’s something I should work up to?>>
Great question!!! Yes, get her into the environment after giving her the tools to cope with it. The most important tool will be the pattern game (back and forth game from the resilience track). And when she enters the environment, get that game going with REALLY high value food. And let her give you feedback about how she feels about the environment.
>> I’m worried about it being potentially overwhelming, but also worried if I don’t expose her, it will backfire later? I know it all depends on the puppy, but I’m not sure what to do.>>
We want to expose her so she can play her games and use her tools. She seems very stable so nothing bad will happen by exposing her to it. Best case scenario? She has a great time, eats all the treats, chases a toy, and you get info on how to help her engage in the new environment (she should also learn all of Lazlo’s MYOB games :)) Worst case scenario is she says THIS IS HARD and you move further away to find the threshold of where she can eat or play.
Ideally you can start this in the class environment, bringing her in while the class is going so she can see what’s happening. A good exposure is all she needs, having a good time eating/playing/meeting people. I recommend flyball foundation classes before you start agility group classes with her – the flyball foundation is far better for future agility engagement. I can see if there are any good ones in your area!
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
Yes, keep playing the games and experimenting! The best strategies for her will reveal themselves with more practice in the trial setting 🙂Tracy
Hi!
>>Well I wasn’t nervous because I was considering it just a training run, lol.>>
Perfect! I love this mindset 🙂
He is off to a great start! I am excited to see how he does!!
Tracy
Good morning!
>>I’m thinking a lot about the start line and what to try. Away from agility he’s great.>>
You can add more arousal to everyday stay games, with toy play and more motion from you. And when he can do that in higher arousal – then add back a jump but in a different location (not in the usual agility ring). Build it up slowly and consistently, and he will get it 🙂
>> 2 trips and I was out of sight briefly while I put the stuff in the shed. He didn’t move an inch the whole time. >>
Super! There might be some wired genetics helping out there too – we will take it! That is why it is worthwhile to explore the down stay in agility too, as maybe it will transfer over from herding more easily than the other positions.
>> I’ll think about this more but maybe some short outings to the agility arena and do a lead out, release to an obstacle and done. Maybe the reward is back at the start line.>>
Get it stronger in really high arousal (volume dial game!) away from agility first, to the point where you can get a stay while you run away. Then you can bring it back into agility, where you would do shorter lead outs and less running away, because there is a bit of history of movement in front of the first jump.
And I like to reward back at the start line by throwing the reward back to the dog, or having it behind the dog and cuing him to turn back to it:
Let me know what you think!
TracyWow!!! Was she running OVER her toy at the beginning to go wrap the cone? Impressive 🙂 Good Mingo!! And then it was really easy when you had it in your hand!
My only suggestion is at the start of each rep, you can say ready but don’t say ‘go’ – just say your wrap verbal. Go will eventually mean to run in full extension as fast as possible, and the cone indicates turn so we don’t want her to get confused. You can also gently hold her collar, start saying the verbal a few times, and then let her go to the cone. That will help build up the verbal even more, and get explosiveness to the cone when you do let her go.
The Car-Chasing-Boot-Camp was a great training detour and I am really glad you did it. I think it is more important than agility games! (and it is a great dog sports foundation in that she is learning to NOT chase motion of other things).
>>My mom needs to figure out where she left off on class homework >>
You were doing the handling games with the barrel and she was doing GREAT! Take a look at the rocking horse game (2 barrels, or a barrel & cone) – she is ready for that game (and it is super fun :))
Great job here!!
TracyGood morning!
>>I am trying to improve our tugging, but I just don’t feel we are making much progress.>>
You are! Developing play style with a puppy is not easy but the tugging is looking really good. I have some suggestions for you!
>>He always wants to grab it by the handle, close to my hand, which makes me jerk my hand up which then makes it worse.>>
Have a SUPER long toy with the big part at the end and the part by your hand less exciting – so the big part can be dragged along the ground for him to chase. It will be harder to hold it, so you will want to scrunch it up into your fist so you can unveil it when it is time to reward him.
And if he does touch your hand – ouch! You can let out a yelp and tell him it hurts because he will appreciate the feedback and will still want to play tug. Just be neutral about it: a quick yelp then back to playing.
>>He tried to grab it from my hand a couple of times. >>
See below for more on that (there was only one on the video but that was a handling error). But also – he needs a marker for when the toy in your hand is available. I say “bite” for when the dog can grab the toy. That way he learns to ignore it in my hand until I say the word. Try not to use “yes” for everything because that can be confusing about when the reward is available or not, and where the reward is located.
I also work toy play and toy transitions a lot in isolation, here are some ideas:
Looking at the video:
He is doing well here!!! Strong commitment and very tight around the barrel and FAST! YAY!!It is tempting to do a whole bunch of wraps in a row, but try to only do 2 barrels in a row (like one cone to one barrel then reward) for two reasons:
– It allows you to keep your handling mechanics very clean and clear
– It adds arousal but not toooooo much arousal all at once 🙂Also that will help keep things spicy and not repetitive 🙂
I love that you were adding your wrap verbals! Keep using them… but don’t give him a “yes” for each barrel. Two reasons for that:
– the “yes” delays the next info. The next info coming earlier is quite reinforcing for him!
– The “yes” can be confusing if sometimes it means keep going and sometimes it means rewards. So when you want to reward, give a reward marker (like ‘bite’) and reward.At :20 he got frustrated and bark/jumped up and knocked over the cone: it was the 4th wrap in a row, and on that cue you were disconnected (looking forward too much with your arms forward) and more importantly: your left leg did not come forward to indicate the cone. Conflicting indicators (upper body saying wrap, lower body saying don’t wrap) are frustrating so he let you know 🙂
Compare to :43 and :48 when your leg stepped forward: very clear! And he drove directly to the barrel. You were using 2 arms on the cue and you probably don’t need to do that – the leg step is more important for him at this stage.
So if something happens and he presents a frustration behavior: that is great feedback from the dog! You can just reward (handler errors still get rewarded :)) rather than cue a sit or do a treat scatter – his feedback is good! So rewarding will thank him for it. And a sit or treat scatter can be a bit frustrating too, because it stops the action 🙂
Nice line up at :38!
>>>>He tried to grab it from my hand a couple of times.>>
There was one here on the video – it was handler error 🙂 I know that when stuff like that happens, it feels like an impulse control error from the dog but when we slow down the video, it is always a break in connection so the only info the dog has is the visual of the toy (or the connection break looks like a blind cross cue, so they are correct to change sides to the toy side).
He went directly to the toy at 1:07 – it was a disconnection moment where your dog-side shoulder was closed forward (blocks his video of connection) and your hand was forward so even though you were peripherally looking back at him, he couldn’t see the connection and was not clear which side to be on so he went to the side with the toy because the toy is an obvious visual. Then you whipped it away from him and stopped (both negative punishers) which can increase frustration and make him more grabby for the toy.
So if he ends up on the wrong side, let him have the toy. And then on the next rep, make a big exaggerated connection with eye contact (Hallmark moment!) so that he is very clear about where to be. I bet he ignores the toy!
More about tugging – he had good tugging at the end!! Look at 1:26 were it was really good – let him win when he pulls back like that.
At 1:31 he wanted to stalk the toy when it went dead so keep it moving (BCs and their stalking LOL!). He is not a fan of a ‘dead’ toy right now, and that is fine – driving to a dead toy will get built up with more experience.Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyThanks for the reminder! You and I are birds of a feather – I also remember I was supposed to post video but I cannot remember what it was LOL!! I will go back through the recording and find it 🙂
Good morning!
>>than posing with the Grinch in the photo booth yesterday>>
That must be so adorable!!! Did you post it on Facebook?
She seemed really comfy at Fusion in the rocking horses video – good job getting her happy with the environment!
Her commitment to the barrels is looking good – she commits better to Mr. Fox than she does to Mr. Hedgehog, but that might be that she is more used to Mr. Fox 🙂 And she definitely liked chasing you for the 360s 🙂
Note that when you ran away from the barrels, her tugging was great! When you were tugging in between the barrels, she was a bit like: are we tugging, or are we DOING THE THING (she is a big fan of doing the THING :)). She didn’t get frustrated, but she was not as fully engaged with the toy because the barrels were right there. So for this game, run out of the setup to tug so it is clear what is happening at each point – you can do a 360 exit, or you can reward a FC in the middle of the barrels by running away.As you get moving faster, remember to hold your connection longer – you picked up the tempo at 1:40 and looked forward too early, so she was less certain of which side to be on. On the reps where connection was super clear til she was past you, she had no questions 🙂
On the 2nd video: cheese for tunneling sounds delightful! The longer tunnel here was hard when you were moving (it seemed dark and looked likes she was going into a cave LOL!) but with cheese comes bravery to run into caves LOL!! So she figured it out really well. In this scenario, you can jump start the session with a lure: you can hold her, throw the cheese through the tunnel so she sees it land, then send her through. That will take all of one rep to get her rolling then you can extend the tunnel and add more motion. You can add the tunnel verbal on the next session if she dives right into it (you were a smart trainer to NOT add it here because she was still figuring it out).
Great job here!
TracyWow!! You didn’t mention that his first real run was perfect!!! He seemed like the same dog as he is in training and the FEO runs: happy, fast, engaged, executing beautifully. YAY! And you were lovely with your connection and showing him each part of the line and supporting each obstacle. SUPER!!!! Really great!!!! I don’t know if you were nervous or not, but you looked calm and cool, and that really helped him.
The only hard part was trying to get the cross after the weaves – it is hard to be on time when there are only 6 weaves so it will be much easier in Open with 12 weaves LOL!!!Great job here – keep mixing in FEO and some real runs. You can test the contacts a bit more in T2B and FAST doing FEO to see if he can do 2 in a row before the reward or let you keep moving past them. If he looks ready, you can try a regular run for real 🙂
Tracy
Hi!
The FAST run looked really good! Nice job being connected on your lead out and rewarding the contacts! Yes, you got caught short on time at the end when trying for the weaves (he was facing the wrong way so didn’t get the entry) but to put a positive spin on it: he got to practice feeling a little bit of frustration and remaining engaged and in a balanced state of arousal. Yay! He was resilient to the uncertainty and that is a big win!
Great job 🙂
TracyHi!
>> Is it ok to use a u shaped tunnel with the contact facing one opening? That’ll give me more room to be lateral, ahead or behind. >>
Yes, yo usan totally use the curved tunnel.
>>Also, I have better food markers for staying in place versus with a toy. I do have toy markers, but they aren’t that fluent with Sprite. One is a pitch the toy back and the other is I’ll walk back and place the toy in your mouth. Should I stick either the toys for arousal?>>
Yes, the toys will be better for this high arousal game 🙂 She does not have to stay in place though – when she has stopped in position, you can praise then use a marker to throw the toy back – my throw back marker also releases the dog to get the toy or treat I have thrown. We don’t want you to walk back to her because we want to reward the picture of you being any except next to her 🙂 so the thrown rewards will do that plus they are more efficient to get to her (rather than walking back).
Keep me posted!
TracyHi!
These are looking really good! I think overall that you are getting more comfortable handling your little speedster! And her commitment is looking good too, which makes it easier for you. Your connection was really strong!! This setup had really big distances, so make sure you practice these at compressed distances too for when she sees 7 meters on course (this looked more like 8 or 9 or 10 meters LOL!)
Most of my ideas are basically all about trusting her, showing the line, and getting outta there without facing the other direction at all.
One other thing – the high energy tugging reward is awesome! Give her and you more time between the tugging reward and the next line up – tug then trade for a cookie, let her breathe/catch her breath and think, and also you can take a moment to plan for the next rep. Going right into it doesn’t give either of you time to catch your breath or thinking about what is happening next, and you can see it went sideways on the first video when the transition was just too fast and you had an error.
Sequence 1: Super strong!!
Try not to decel on the threadle to let her get ahead of you (:09) – try to cue it and keep moving through it. Your opposite arm threadle cue is a bit hidden here (meaning she might not have been able to see it from behind you), so rotate more at the waist and show it to her fully (and that will also have your dog-side arm move back and away to show the threadle).The release from the start line with the tunnel verbal was clearer to her than the “ok” (which pulled her in) followed by the tunnel (so she went back out).
The BC at the end looked great! Yay!
2nd video – Also looking good!!! Super nice layering in the opening 🙂
You are going to need to send to 5 from closer to 6 in order to get past it on time for a good blind 🙂 Ideally, you will want to serp it very close to the exit wing, so you are passing the exit wing of 6 and heading to 7 before she takes off for 6.
At :36 the blind position indicated the tunnel line which is why she was a bit wide there.The FC between 5 and 6 can also be closer to 6 and also earlier (she had already made a takeoff decision at 1:10 when you start it) – when she lands from 4, you can cue 5 and start the FC. The exit of 6 needs a stronger turn cue: spin or big decel to get collection (probably a spin is the better choice, so you can keep moving). The post turn at 1:12 pointed her directly to the tunnel so she was wide there too (but didn’t take it, good girl!)
3rd video – super nice send to 2!!!
Rather than do a FC on the landing of 3 (which faces you directly to the tunnel) you can do a serp to blind there too, to get a tighter turn. I think the extra rotation of the FC, for example, is more support than she needs – you were doing a great job of looking at the landing spot in places where you needed countermotion and she read them really well!You don’t need to do a decel as much to get the turn on 5 at :19 and :47 where the decel pulled her off (and on the 4th video too)- use a brake arm and run for your life 🙂 With the big decel, you ended up walking and I don’t think you have time for that, especially with her speed on the big lines. The brake arm should allow you to get the soft turns AND keep running 🙂
Same idea of not need to help her as much on jump 9 (after the tunnel) – You can use the verbal and show motion the new direction to get the turn to 9 (:24 and :52) so you can get past the jump there too with a serp to blind, sliding past the exit wing.
4th video – leading out to the throwback worked really well 1-2-3!! Nice turn on 3! The rotation really tightens that right up without bleeding off speed.
Yo did a FC on 9 at :24 and ended up facing the tunnel – the serp to blind will be the winner move there 🙂 She did a great job of not taking any off course tunnels, but we can tighten the lines by having you slide right past the exit wing before she even takes off for 9. That will also make the next line a lot easier too because you will be ahead of her and facing the correct direction.Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
>>I don’t know what to do about the start line. Nothing? No pressure?>>
I would do two things:
– teach her a start line in a position where she doesn’t move (probably a sit or stand) and reward reward reward reward 🙂
– teach her a behind the back slingshot start, for fun easy starts where you don’t need a stay
>> I practice with my Toppl and will randomly through it back to her..and then release her to it off of a jump.>>
This is good! Do super short lead outs so you can get the reward in before she moves at all.
>>I’m not sure I understand what you’re saying about her moving forward when I leave her. I’m reinforcing that it’s okay? It’s reinforcing for her to do that? Im creating a pattern I don’t want?>>
All of the above, perhaps? There were conflicting indicators about what it was – sometimes you would stop the game and reset her if she moved or stayed at the start line longer to make sure she didn’t move, and sometimes you would release when she was moving or had moved from a sit to stand. So it is possible she is not entirely sure of what you want on the start line.
>>It is common for her to turn towards me when I do a lateral lead out. Ideas to help with that? Just one jump with my Toppl?>>
You can lead out a little less far laterally, and take a big step to the jump you want her to take laterally – then throw the reward (or have it placed in advanced to help her out. You can save the Toppl for the harder environments and use lower value rewards at home, so the Toppl maintains it super high value 🙂
>>Could I have patterned her not to do a start line when we are just out playing doing agility spontaneously?>>
Probably not, if you didn’t ask for the behavior. If you haven’t cued it, she doesn’t need to do it 🙂 But if you do cue it, we want her to fully understand the criteria so I think short lead outs with lots of reinforcement (thrown back or releasing her forward) will be a good route
>>Threadle stuff – I should keep my feet moving in the direction I want to go and just use my inside arm to “open” the door?>>
Yes- foot rotation towards her will possibly pull her off the correct line, plus it stops your motion then she will leave you in the dust 🙂
>>Also, should I be running with her more rather than sending her?>>
You can use sends when you think it best fits the course, and run with her when you think it best fits the course. That way, you can balance all the skills!
Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
Ah, that would explain why Blu didn’t take a turn on the equipment 🙂 Hopefully you can borrow Red as a distraction dog at some point!Looking at the contact video: yes, that is what I had in mind 🙂
This was a great session because she was able to work her contacts in really high arousal (yay!) and also because it shows you what she needs on the contacts to be successful: she needs you to be near to the contact zone when she is stopping – that I when you got the best stops.
When you were behind or way ahead – you got a nice running contact LOL!! And almost-running contacts (very stretched forward or last minute weight shifts) on the 2nd or 3rd rep of that challenge. This is what happened at the beginning when the board was closer to the tunnel (you were behind her and moving forward).
So you will want to dial back your motion but not be anywhere near the end of the board when she is arriving at the end of it: be behind, be way ahead, be running away laterally. And then throw the reward back to her, so you aren’t always releasing forward (which will pull her forward too!)
Great job here!
Tracy
