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Hi!
Thank you for the tugging video! Mechanics are everything, so take a break from training the other stuff until we’ve got this where we want it (it won’t take long).
The plank stuff is easy, he is happy to get on it, no problem. Try to move more slowly when he turns around so he can work his coordination.
On the backing up – keep him closer to the mat for now with fewer steps backwards, so he can go directly to the mat without curling to the side. You can put the treats just far enough away so that his front feet come off and his back feet maybe come off by one step, so he doesn’t have to back up tooooo far for now 🙂
So let’s put all of that away for now, though, and look at the tugging and arousal regulation. The humping is a self-regulation coping skill, so it is not a bad thing and it is great information about what he needs.
A couple of things to do:
>> I do the pattern games with Yuzu all the time, so he is very familiar with them. Are you saying I should start each session with them?>>
Nope – do them after tugging to help his body learn to regulate his arousal. So for now, the entire session would be high excitement tugging, pattern game, have a rest. Then try again later with the same order of festivities 🙂
A couple of other ideas:
– Since tugging is not a duration behavior, so keep each tug moment to under 10 seconds then move on to the next thing (for now, it will be a pattern game or snuffle mat). Get the pattern game or snuffle mat while he is stimulated but before he gets overstimulated or leaves the game. On the first video, the initial tugging was for about 25 seconds which is a long time, so he ended up self-regulating and leaving to ask for cookies. In the second part of the video, the tug session was over 70 seconds and then he started humping the donut (again, self-regulation).
So tug and count to 10 in your head then get the snuffle mat involved or the pattern games (rather than waiting til he has tried to figure out a different coping strategy, such as leaving/humping/jumping on you.
– these are both good toys to use, but they are both too short. They require you to be sitting down or bending, which puts your flesh in close proximity to his teeth. So, tie them together so they create a 5 or 6 foot long toy – think flyball length toy, not the teeny tiny toys that agility people like to use LOL! That way you can swing the fun part of it around on the ground for him to chase and tug on, and he is not likely to grab your hand while re-gripping the toy (that is what was happening in general, especially when your hands lifted the toy up – when the toy moved up in the air, so did his teeth trying to grab it.
So the entire training session can be 10 seconds of high energy swinging the toy for him to chase/grab/tug, then pattern game or snuffle mat. That will begin to ‘train’ his physiology to self-regulate. And if 10 seconds ends up being too long and he gets overaroused, no worries, go to 5 seconds 🙂
Let me know if this makes sense, and how he does!
Tracy
Hi!
She is doing well with the backing up! I think most of the sideways movement was coming from when you were delivering the reward: she was curling away from the hand to better face the cookie. So you can leave your hand down low the whole time, so you can just flick the cookie into place. I suggest a low chair for this so your back doesn’t get angry if you are bent over the whole time.Also, adding a “destination” can help her back up straight, such as backing up onto a mat. That is in the “Adding Challenge section of the game
Start with her on a mat that is big enough for her to stand on and you can follow the steps outlined there to get her to back up to it!
Have fun! Nice work here!
TracyHi!
He did well sorting out the back and forth game here! I think if you carry the bowls with you until you are ready and then put them down, you will see him get started immediately – that makes the bowls more salient rather than fading into the background because they have been there the whole time.
You can also drop the cookies into the bowl sooner: as soon as he starts going around the barrel, you can plop the cookie in rather than wait til he arrives at the bowl. That will keep him looking at you less. He did well getting himself out of the sit and back into the pattern!!
He was in a bit of a left turn vortex here (going behind you) so try to stand with your back to the couch to encourage him to stay in front of you.
>.BTW, sorry about all the videos. I have been in doggie lockdown as Colbie was Dx with KC last week. This has given me sooooo much time to train Teagan. The downside is that it all has to be done at home. I’m still waiting to see if any of the other 3 dogs come down with it.>>
Poor Colbie! Hope he feels better fast!!! Being at home does give you more time, but you can resist temptation to do extra sessions – in the past week I think you’ve had 20 sessions, which is a bit too much repetition for a baby dog. Try to do maybe one a day, or a couple then skip a day. And you can add in just playing with toys, etc. so his brain has time to process the sessions and cement the learning before the next one.
Nice work here!
TracyHi!
Hi!
Yay for a different room! Field trip!You were moving a bit too much here, so he was not sure what to look at – try to be more stationary so he can think about offering with his feet rather than following you.
>> I think part of the problem may be the plank is slippery. The paint has sand in it, but it may not be enough. We will keep trying or maybe put something on the plank to make it less slippery.>>
I think this is definitely part of it – when he did get all 4 feet on, he was not comfortable and slipping. So maybe tape or glue a yoga mat to it? And if you have 2 boards that you can put side-by-side, that will get him a wider playing field and an easier time getting all his feet on.
Nice work!
TracyHello and welcome!!!
>>Sealey is learning so fast and enjoy seeing that others have fast learners also.>>
Yay! I am glad Sealey is learning fast – it is so fun to watch them all absorb all of the games!
> Question how do you convince pup not to take off with or try to eat the inanimate object they are suppose to touch in your hand or touch their paws on? I finally had to switch to a bucket for his feet because he would put his feet on object and then grab it and take off running with it,>>
He sounds like he enjoys exploring the world with his mouth LOL!! If the pup wants to pick everything up like you describe, I choose objects that are easy to touch but nearly impossible to pick up – large, smooth surface and too big & heavy to grab 🙂 A big heavy bucket is a great idea! Or for a foot target, a low but long heavy box (you can stuff it with something heavy).
And, you can also click/reward for going towards it, for barely touching it – then either toss the treat to the side or hold the treat way up high for him to get (to keep his mouth busy and to keep it far from the object :)) That way he gets a lot of reinforcement and a lot of movement, but is less interested in picking it up.
>> but for the hand I finally had to rid of the object in hand.. He touches my hand but if I have a inanimate object in my hand he touches and bites it. Is there a trick to prevent this?>>
You can use something really big and heavy (I have used my cell phone in the past for this) and you can also reward him for going near it with a closed mouth and not actually touching it. If he is very mouthy, rewarding very early as he looks at it and steps to it will really help.
>>As far as the bowls for the game ( wing wrap game) .. It took me 3 days ,of him grabbing them and tossing them around like a toy, to leave them alone and he starts right in offering to go to one and the other. Go ahead a laugh if you can visualize me having two bowls flying around me and me trying to get them before he did. He had BIG FUN doing that !!lol>>
I admit it, I totally laughed at the visual – it is hilarious and I am sure it was annoying too LOL!!! You got the behavior, though, a big click treat for you! You can really heavy bowls, or tape them down, or anything you have that you can put treats into but are just too big or heavy to be easily lifted.
Let me know what you think and keep me posted!
Tracy
Hi!
>>I also bought a mat so she is not slipping. This only makes her faster Tracy!!>>
Yay for a mat! Also, sorry not sorry about her being faster LOL!!!
Tugging on wobble – she did well here! The next step would be to take the toy, stand still next to the wobble boards, and let her offer getting back n them to get the tugging going again.
The blinds look great, she was making you HUSTLE! Love it!
Toy races were hilarious – she was definitely in the ‘this is easy’ mode until you won that one race… then it was game ON and she smoked you: head down, full stride, won the toy. PERFECT!
Backing up: this going going well too. You can get more steps backwards with one mechanics tweak: keep your cookie hands low, maybe 6 inches above your ankles, he entire time. That way as soon as she backs up, you can toss the next cookie while keeping her head low and in a more neutral position. If your hands move up higher then have to come back down, she will lift her head which will limit the # of steps she takes.
Bowls games are going well too! You can have multiple cookies in your hands, 3 or 4 in each hand, so you don’t have to reach over between reps as that draws her focus up to your hands and away from the bowls.
She did well sorting out the laundry basket with the food! She had some slight delays as she was processing it, but overall did a great job with the new thing to go around 🙂
It was a little harder with the toys (more arousal, toys are very exciting!) so you can be seated for this – that way your back doesn’t get angry from all the bending over to have the toys on the ground.
Goat trick with a disc – also looking great! Do you have a 2nd disc (doesn’t have to be the same, just similar) to put next to the disc here? That can help her get all 4 feet on (without having to scrunch herself up) by giving her a bigger playing field to get on.
>.I am keeping my sessions too long. She is telling me it is too much but kissing me during the session. So bad trainer. Great puppy.>>
She is super fun, so it is probably very easy to go for too long. You can turn on a timer on your cell phone – turn it to 60 seconds as a reminder to finish up. Session length of 90 seconds to 2 minutes is great… but only if you are training one thing and then will take a break. If you want to do multiple games, set the timer for 60 seconds and be done, give her a break, then come back to a different game 10 minutes later. That can help prevent depletion and get better sessions in. I often do training in between household tasks like: 60 seconds of training then do the dishes. Then 60 seconds of training, then toss the laundry in the dryer LOL! Somehow everything gets done and the puppy doesn’t get too tired 🙂
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
Strong session here! Looks like you started off clicking for back feet, then went to waiting to click for front feet. It went really well!When you went to the bigger cushion she got a little sideways: you can start with her having all 4 feet on it and luring her front feet off then click when she steps them back on. That can get her used to the surface and how it moves, so she will then be better able to process the mechanics of backing up. Puppy brains are NOT great at processing new surfaces AND hard motor skills, so you can break it down each time a new surface is added and then you will see her have an easier time with the motor skills.
On the next session, you can start the stool a little further away from the carpet or cushion and see if she is able to add more steps backwards!
>> I also ordered some more tugs from Clean Run (been putting it off for 2 months probably because of my mental block against toys lol).>>
Perfect time of year for it! Should be some good sales!!!
Nice job here!
TracyHi!
>>Wow you guys were working super hard! The magnitude of setting all those courses! >>
Yeah, it was a beast of an event but we have it down to a science 🙂 And planning for next year began today LOL!
She did a great job adjusting to all of the distances here! The bounce distances at the beginning and end looked great. She bounced the 6 foot distance but I am curious to know how she felt about it – she didn’t seem comfy, so it would be interesting to see if she would still bounce it or add a stride.
The 12 foot distance was good – she used lovely striding! Just be sure that you give yourself room to keep dragging the toy forward so she has plenty of room to land and stride to it.
So keep varying the striding so she can be exposed to all sorts of distances 🙂
Looking at the backsides:
You were a little too rotated towards her on the first rep – – on the others you were facing forward more and moving to where the wing and bar met, so she got it. Yay! Her only question on that line was at :36 when you curled away too soon (I call it a banana line because the line of motion was curved like a banana :)) On all the others you kept moving straight forward until she locked onto the backside.When you moved more to the center of the bar, she was not quite reading it so you can angle the jump a bit so the entry wing is pulled towards the wing wrap you started with. That can help her see the entry even as you get further and further over.
>> I am not sure I did the exit line part correctly. Am I missing an obvious nuance? hahaha
You can look at the landing spot (and point back to it with the hand next ot the jump) as you move forward. You were looking at her (understandable because she is so cute!) as you moved forward, so she was not sure if she should take the jump or follow you. Add in letting her see you shift your connection from her eyes to the landing spot (and point to it too) and that should help you be able to move forward even more.
Transition video:
>> Is it ok to use the verbals on these or are we wanting to teach them to tune in to the body cues?>>
Yes, totally ok to add your verbals on this 🙂 And it helps us humans get used to using our verbals too 🙂
The GO reps looked good!
The decels were a little late which is why she was a little wide sometimes (like at :16 where you were starting the decel as she was preparing for takeoff), or if they happened at the same time as you tried to turn your fet: you got a rear cross (like a :36)
But when you added the verbal (:57 and the reps after it) you also did a GREAT transition: earlier decel, good timing on the foot rotation and an excellent wrap! Yay! The timing on the decel was starting when she was a stride or two after the wing wrap, and before she passed you – perfect! The other side was good too but can be a shade sooner (she was hitting the noodle, which means it was a tiny bit late).
>> Do you have any suggestions about how to transition her to the class environment? Maybe I can ask if I can drop in on some of her more advanced classes and bring her crate and do pattern games nearby at first?>>
Yes to bringing the crate and doing pattern games 🙂 You can enroll her in a class that is at least one level below her actual level of training. That way the skills stuff she is asked to do is very easy, because the environment might be more challenging for her. We don’t want both the skills and environment to be challenging.
And also, prepare to be an advocate for her. If there is something you don’t want to do, or she fails too much (2 failure rule!) then you can politely decline to do it: “I am going to skip this one, she is not quite ready for it, I will practice it at home” or something like that.
>>Do you play with your dogs? Like throw the toy, fetch games. >>
Yes, as much as possible, but with a zillion rules so they don’t get hurt. For example, they can each go for a big run with a frisbee already in their mouth, but I rarely throw it for them (I might roll it, because that is easier on their bodies). I don’t do ball fetch because that is where they can slam themselves into the ground. I will do fetch stuff with bigger toys (like a giant hollee roller) or big tug toys. I also let them run together and play and wrestle, but there are strict “no slamming each other and no biting each other” rules. So the younger dogs (whippety dogs!!) are required to have carry a toy while they run around, because that keeps everyone safe LOL!
>>I’ve become so paranoid about saving their bodies that I don’t play with them and I feel like we are either training or they are bored.>
Relatable! You can let them run around with something in their mouth that you hand them, and see how it goes! I also play tug with my dogs regularly and for no reason other than to be silly LOL!! For example, every night before bedtime, I play a silly tug game with Ramen: he tries to put the toy in my hand while I wave my hands near his face, and while I yell “onion chicken filet!” over and over in a French accent. Then I grab the toy, tug, let go, he runs in a circle, then brings it back for more of the Onion Chicken Filet game. No, I have no idea where that came from but it is definitely a game LOL! So you can make up little silly non-training games too 🙂
>> I don’t leave toys in the house for them to play with on their own because Bazinga is an “I’ll eat it” hazard. So they kind of don’t know what to do with themselves when we aren’t training. I feel like I forgot how to just have dogs vs athletes and they are missing out on just pure dog fun.>>
What can Bazinga have that she won’t ingest? The Kong wobbler is really fun, and maybe a giant chew bone? And I don’t leave most of the tug toys around, they are up on a counter or something and easy for me to grab and play with.
>I’m looking forward to the next class. I’m kind of hesitating on trying to tackle weaves on my own, so if you are going to be offering a course on that I’m definitely interested!>>
We might have to wait til spring so there is no snow 🙂 I will keep you posted, I hope to have more classes posted by the end of this week 🙂
Tracy
Hi!
>>Also, I am pretty darn reluctant to us a BC on such a young dog, since he might go anywhere…!
He has been spot on about following your handling, so he is totally ready to do the blinds. The blinds will get you further up lines and can be started/finished sooner, which means he gets the info sooner. And if he ends up somewhere unexpected? It is great feedback that either you were late or not connected enough or on the wrong line. This is all good info to get from the pup 🙂
>>I tried to leave a toy on the ground (not on the line but for after the run) but he had a really hard time ignoring it. We will work on it but for now, I’m sticking with throwing it. At least he brings it back in my barn. Still working on it at Mark’s place (Highest Hope Dog Sports) where I take lessons from Jen Pinder.>>
You can work on it separately for sure on something simple like wrapping a wing to a tunnel (with the toy on the ground past the tunnel), or use a Manners Minder if he finds that easier to ignore. On the bigger sequences, throw it sooner so he is not looking back at you. And you can ask Jen to throw it or place it during your lessons.
>>Interesting thing that I’d like your feedback on: Casper will work well and willingly for about 15 minutes. That includes actual work plus toy fetching and some tugging. >>
That is actually a really long time!
>>BUT, when he is done, he is done. Yesterday, we played a bit and I threw the toy and we played a bit and I had the toy; then when I asked him to line up for another rep, he just didn’t.>>
We have always known that going too long is not great for the dogs, and now the neuroscience types have told us what is happening ‘under the hood’ 🙂 What you are seeing is that he is depleted, physically and mentally. The brain of an adolescent dog burns so much glucose (trying to process the bombardment of sensory information, trying to self-regulate arousal, trying to move properly, and so on) that they reach a point where there is simply not enough energy in the brain to power the brain and body. The behavior people call it ‘expensive’. There are actually some interesting studies about how depletion leads to impulse control errors (including reactivity) which helps explain why dogs cannot do things when cued, if they are depleted.
>> It looked like playing keep away but without a toy involved. Of course, no recall. After a bit of BS, I got a couple more reps on the A-frame and got ready to leave.>>
Yep – depleted. Doing the aframe or anything in that state can actually be more detrimental (building in overarousal/frustration as well as the icky feeling of depletion) so it is far better to do what Bob Bailey says to do when we have pushed the animal too far: bang head here (spot located on the wall LOL!!)
>> He was totally on board with that, no problem with recall or anything: he met me at the door, I put on the leash and we walked up to the house.>>
Yes – that requires no really brain energy.
As a side note, depletion in different dogs/breeds can look different. It can look like Casper’s “I am done!” behavior, or it can look like overaroused, frantic behavior, or slowing down and sniffing. We don’t want to see any of that, of course.
>> But I would like to train (with breaks and so on) for more than 15 minutes. Ideas?
Very very gradually build up to it while simultaneously waiting for him to be adult and not adolescent. And always always be finished before he is showing the depletion signs because all behaviors build neural pathways, and we don’t want those behaviors to become entrenched in his brain. Set a timer and resist the “just one more” rep that we humans all like to do LOL!
Gradually building up to it will allow the “expensive” behaviors to develop neural pathways so they are easier to produce and therefore less expensive/burning less glucose. That can help expand mental endurance. And in between reps, you can give him breaks to walk around and sniff (which resets his system better than chasing toys would)
So you might start at 2 or 3 minutes then give him a break – getting to 15 relatively continuous minutes of activity takes a while. And yes, he can probably run around with Enzo or chase a frisbee for 15 minutes… but those are not ‘expensive’ behaviors for the brain.
I also feed my dogs a lot – before training, during training, etc. Anything to get more glucose to the brain is fine with me! This is especially important with the toy-driven dogs, because it can become all burning energy and not replacing it.
>>(aside: I have not done much with working Enzo and Casper alternately because the non-working dog SCREAMS. My only solution has been to drive the van down to the barn and crate the non-working dog in the van. I suppose I could just plan on that every time.)>>
This is relatable. The van is a great option because they can each get breaks.
Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
This first video was noted as engaged chill, but it was volume dial with remote reinforcement – definitely very active and not chill LOL!!
I recommend adding the leash to this – so he can get used to moving away from the treats with you, and doing the tricks, then going back to the reward station. He definitely had his eyes on the treats so moving away from them was hard.This second video was the engaged chill. Try to get him to stand still more by doing the up and down with the treats (putting them on your shoes) rather than tossing them side to side which causes him to move.
As you do the up and down with delay, try not to look directly at him – he thinks it is a cue to offer stuff 🙂 So, just delay the pattern game treats and look around casually, as if watching the ring or planning your handling.
3rd and 4th videos were the remote reinforcement with tricks – he seemed to be able to move away from the treats at first here, but then found it harder as each session went on. So you can mix in doing just one trick then going back to the treats, then 3 or 4 tricks before going back, or moving far away towards a different jump before going back… I think moving a little further away might be easier because the treats are not so close they are distracting.
And yes, he didn’t want to turn right here – maybe because it is the harder side to turn for him, or maybe because it turns him towards the treats very directly and that was harder. Either way, you can use the left turn spins when you are close to the treats, then add in the right turn spins when you get further from them.
Driving forward video 1 – this is going well!! You be connected on your lead out so he holds the sit (he was up and moving on the first one here and on the stay in the last video too) and also don’t lead out as much – we want him to get ahead of you 🙂 So you can lead out maybe one step ahead of him, but that is all when working on him driving ahead of you.
Was there a placed toy at the end? Try to give him that as a focal point so he drives ahead of you and doesn’t curl back to you on the last jump.
Driving forward video 2 & 3 (same sequence): the sequence went well! I think the backside of jump 3 was very close to the wall so he thought the front side was a better option. You can angle the jump to give him more room there so he doesn’t have to be as close to the wall.
He drove ahead nicely on the ending line – you can see him collecting and curling back to you on the last jump, so having a toy on the line will keep him driving straight through the end. This will be very useful especially as the distances get bigger. To practice bigger distances in the indoor space here, you can take out the middle jump so there is more yardage on the straight line after the tunnel.
On the last video, you did the FC 3-4 and that was your best line to the 4 tunnel! Yay! He read it really well! And as with the others, have that placed reward out past the last jump so he can drive to it. And if there was something there and he was still curling in, you can go to a higher value reward so he can drive to it even more.
Nice work here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi –
This is the double snuffle mat engaged chill – he was unsure of what to do at first, and was offering behavior and movement. So you can start the game by establishing the pattern, then gradually slow it down. That can help him go into the most ‘chill’ behavior. And you can put several treats in the snuffle mat each time you do it, so he spends a few seconds sniffing around (that can really help the chill).
Great job on all of these! Let me know what you think!
TracyThis is delaying the pattern/Engaged chill – this went well. It was hard to see what you were looking at, so hopefully you were looking around as it planning your handling on a course 🙂 The next things to add would be a leash (he will be on leash when you use this game) and also doing it in front of mild distractions (like other dogs walking around). Eventually you can try it while other dogs are running courses!
Great job!
TracyThis one is remote reinforcement with a sequence. I am glad you did this! He seemed very happy to run the sequence with your hands empty and great job for adding in some easy reps of just little tricks for the reward. And, he is not locked onto the reward station: he is ignoring it until you use the marker. YAY!
The only thing I would add to this is the leash – bring him into the area on leash, play at the reward station, go to the start line, take the leash off, toss it to the end, run a little sequence, go to the leash/put it on, then out to the reward station.
You don’t need to do a lot of reps of that, but rehearsing the whole thing will be very helpful for him as you start to build up to doing real trial runs.
Great job!
TracyHi!
This is remote reinforcement in front of the jump – also looking great, no problem at all. His only question on this one (and the previous video) is at the very end, when you walk away to turn off the camera. You can have him come with you as if he just finished the course. Onwards to adding this to sequencing!
T
