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Happy New Year!!
>>But more distractions and smells also was on dirt where they do barn hunt.
I would imagine that is *significantly* more challenging that Sarah’s turf, so it sounds like she still did really well!
>>I got some help with stay. When we practiced using catch, she got real good at catching the treat, not so good at staying even a few seconds. >>
Get some video! Sounds like you might need to delay gradually more and more before the ‘catch’ toss? Or you can teach the stay with a platform – check out Taq’s thread (Taq & Dannika) to see how quickly she learned it with a platform.
>>Video or perch work, second attempt. We first tried a clay saucer that my others had used. I was too small. Then I switched to bucket lid…too big.. going to get it just right soon. Felt like the 3 bears.>>
Totally relatable! I think the lid might be fine, actually! She was getting the idea of pivoting around it but we want to now get her to do it without you also moving. So for the next session, you can add in you standing or sitting (for lower reward placement without bending over). Start her facing you on the center of the lid, then throw the reward off to the side – then reward her for coming back and pivoting back to center. That might get her to pivot without you moving more easily.
I love her tugging and retrieving at the end! YAY!!
Great job :)
TracyHappy New Year!
Wow, sounds like you had a great weekend! Fun!! I am excited she did so well with the travel and all different ages of family, human and canine 🙂
She did well with her backside slices here using the cooler and towel. Just as I was about to type “you an add your verbal”, you added the verbal LOL!
When you get home and try the barrel for this, you can add a pool noodle (maybe sliced in half lengthwise so it doesn’t roll around) to start to fade the towel and simulate a jump bar 🙂 And when you have more room, you can move faster up the line and also add positions 2 (closer to center of the bar) and 3 (almost where the exit wing would be).
>>That jump up at the beginning was her only one the whole time and then she settled down to actually tugging.>>
Yes, just that one leap. Could be any number of reasons why but she went right into tugging especially at the end! Yay!
Great job!
TracyHi!
>>I’ll be here at home, still in my PJs,>>
Same, same. Currently getting ready for dinner here and in my pajamas hahaha!!!
She did great with her cone wrapping – no questions at all and she was nice and tight to the cones. Your mechanics were very precise which is exactly what we want for this early stage.
Since it went so perfectly, you can add more excitement 🙂 Spread the cones out so they are more like 10 feet apart and add speeeeeed 🙂 FUN! It will be challenging for you to maintain connection after each FC and before each send, so if she ends up on the wrong side of you, no worries: keep going or reward because it was probably caused by broken connection.
And she was awesome with her tunneling and cone-to-tunnel 🙂 So feel free to add the tunnel to the rocking horses: you can do cone – FC – cone – FC – tunnel tunnel tunnel! Wheeeee! Then throw the toy so she can blast out of it. And if that all goes well – add your wrap verbals. Things get really exciting once we start adding seed to the rocking horses 🙂
Great job here! Have a fantastic New Years Eve and see ya in the New Year!
Tracy
Hi!
>>OK, trying this again!>>
Yay! The internet is behaving itself today (for now haha)
>>Yes! I’m still not totally comfortable with toys haha. She’s also been very into food in all other situations, so it was really throwing me. On her off-leash walks, in stores, at the familiar agility location, etc. She’s always liked a variety of treats.>>
You might also be seeing the transition into adolescence as well as a value shift to toys now that you are using them more.
>>When I’m using toys at home with her, I am also using food. For example, I may reward her “out” with food, or use a cookie to lure her into position, or to toss a treat for a cookie reset. So if she won’t eat, I feel like I can’t use toys as effectively either. At least with where we are currently at with her training.>>
You are making an excellent point here, that is it more ideal for effective, clean training to be able to use both food and toys. I also find it a zillion times easier to use food for certain things, so not really being able to use it can throw off our mechanics. But I have full confidence that it will all balance out and you will be able to use both. And it will happen pretty soon because you are spending quality time bringing her to new places with super high quality food motivators too!
>>Ah, okay, I totally see that now! Definitely helped to rewatch the video with your commentary in mind.>>
In the moment, it is really hard to see everything that is happening. It was really cool to see it all on video!
>>“I don’t think she loved the play without the toy… yes, she was jumping up at you but then she moved away. The jumping up might have been frustration behavior.”
We play like this a lot at home. She jumps up, I push her off, she jumps right back up. But it may not have been what she was after in that moment and in that location. So definitely something to keep in mind for me.>>Exactly! When the arousal state changes (which is a good thing), behaviors that were fine in a lower arousal state (like being touched) might not be as fine in the higher state when her brain is processing soooo many things. It might be fine in the future but in that moment, it was too much.
>> Question: Since chasing and tugging is more physically taxing than eating food, will this tire her out before it’s her turn in the ring?>>
GREAT question! It might tire her muscles more than eating food, but it might actually be less expensive for her brain and less tiring than the effort it takes to eat. The only way to really know is to experiment with it and see how she does. All of her training is done in age-appropriate, short sessions so I don’t see any possible damage if she is mentally tired. Plus you are really good at breaking things down (and the instructor in the video was very supportive) so Vesper is going to have a great time even if she is a little tired.
>>The food pattern games seem to weave in acclimation so nicely. >>
For real!!! That is one reason that I love it! But it only works with food if the dog wants the food 🙂 It works just as well with toys, but using toys is harder for us humans for sure.
>>Does toy play offer her a chance to take in the environment as well?>>
Yes! I need to find the 2-frisbee pattern game I did with Contraband when he was a youngster and couldn’t really eat outside the agility/flyball ring. It was a similar pattern: tug a frizzy, out the frizz, opportunity to re-engage, get the next frizzy, and so on. And because it helped him acclimate, it also helped him be able to eat in that situation. Now he is adult and he is a total PIG for his food in that environment LOL!
>>I feel much better after reading your response and rewatching the videos. It’s not a cause for panic LOL.>>
TOTALLY NO PANIC! I thought it was great in sooooo many ways and I think she had a fantastic experience while also having the agency to communicate her opinions to you. So cool!!!
Great job and happy New Year :)
TracyHi!
She did a great job with these – accurate and fast! Adding the verbal was easy too. Yay!
>>It feels weird to just stand still for a slice
You can keep moving through the slice, parallel to the bump, as you drop the reward in – that might feel less weird. And towards the end, I think you might have gotten too far ahead and there was no place to go, which ended up in standing still a little. So you can go closer to the cookie toss to start it, as long as you are a step or two ahead of her. Starting further from the barrel might actually require you to also jog forward to stay ahead, which she is ready for and I think she will like it a lot 🙂
Also, going to position 2 and position 3 (in the advanced level) will make it feel less like standing still.
>>We did another ring rental at our regular facility today and she was great! Able to eat right away, tugged really well too. >>
Awesome! Where there other people/dogs or was it pretty quiet there? Sounds like she was very comfy, either way.
>>I noticed she had a harder time eating food after playing with her bunny fur toy. She could easily eat between playing with her other toys. >>
It makes sense that real bunny fur might kick in some higher arousal that also shuts down the eating desire – after all, in full bunny chase mode she probably won’t stop for snacks 🙂
>>We did a little parallel path with a real jump bump, a couple reps of rocking horse and a couple tunnels. She was very enthusiastic!>>
Super! Sounds like a fun time!!!
Great job 🙂
TracyHi! All sorts of fabulous stuff on your videos here!
He was able to turn around on the narrow plank but using a wider plank was soooo much easier for him 🙂 You can re-visit both: doing the wider plank in both directions with more speed, and doing the narrow plank very slowly.
He did really well transferring the concept to the new hamper and in a new place with new distractions. Good boy! I really like how he is using his head to turn really tightly around the hamper. Yay! It was smart to NOT add turn and burn in this session because there were other things happening. So for the next session, start like you need here then if he zips around it like he did here: move into turn and burn (and add a toy :))
The toy races with Auntie Sarah were great! Yo can try to legit win but I think he will continue to leave you in the dust LOL! I was perfect to get him really driving ahead and getting more confidently leaving you – it is nice to have a momma’s boy but it will be nicer for him to drive ahead 🙂 You can try to cheat to win by tossing a cookie behind you for him to get and then you take off running while Sarah drags the toy 🙂
He was great with the pattern game – this is where it helps that he is a momma’s boy! Since he did so well in a neutral location, you can try it in new places (and eventually we can apply it to thing in the environment that concern him.
I hope he had a great time meeting rats today! Happy New Year!!
Tracy
Hi!
Nice sessions here! On the first video, it took her minute to realize that yes, it was the backing up thing 🙂 But on the 2nd session, she had it! You were also feeding her a little lower on the 2nd video, so that really helped – on the first video her head was a little high which makes it harder to back up. I think you might have been a shade too far from the wobble board so she sometimes turned around then backed up – so you can split the behavior a tiny bit more for the next session by staying closer to it.
She didn’t seem to mind the wobble at all so you can start fading out the pillows to add even more movement 🙂
Great job!Tracy
Hi!
>>So my position on the serp would be closer to the exit wing and on the threadle it would be closer to the entrance wing?>>
Yes – I think of it where I line up my belly button 🙂 With the reward target being in the same place each time, your belly button on a serp is right where the bar meets the exit wing. And on a threadle, your belly button is on the outer edge of the entry wing. You can see the visuals in the video here, starting at about 6:00 –
Strike A Pose Part 3: Concept Transfer For Threadles (Slices)
Have fun!
TracyHi!
>> I finally responded to all your insights on the in-person class experience, but the internet seems to have eaten it, argh! I’ll have to re-do it when I have time.>>
SO FRUSTRATING! The internet has been on bad behavior all week. YouTube has eaten 4 of my video uploads this week. Ugh.
>>I just watched the video for the head turn exercise. For the advanced version, can you help me understand how it’s different from just a regular wrap, apart from the reward placement? Just want to be sure I’m not missing something!>>
For the advanced version, it is a matter of timing of the marker: rather than our general marker of “yay thanks for going to the wing” or “thanks for finishing the wrap”, we are looking to mark the instant the dog turns her head to do the wrap. So it is ultra-precise (which is why it is one of the few games where a clicker is useful :)) Let me know if that makes sense!
TracyGood morning!
She is doing well with the threadles!
>At first she didn’t seem to understand to go over the bar. >
It was the reward placement that made the difference for her here. The reward target was originally placed so it was more visible on the takeoff side than on the landing side of the bar. Then after the chase game (at :20 and beyond) the reward target was more on the landing side so it was an easier read for her and she got it really nicely. You can make the reward target even more obvious on the landing side (it doesn’t need to be tucked into the wing as much).
One thing that will help is moving your position more to the start wing and less on the enter of the bar. Ideally, you would line up your stomach with the start wing at least half of your body (threadle arm and torso) is visible outside the entry wing. You were located more on the center of the bar here so she was able to read the threadles on the position 1 (easier) start angles but not as well on the harder angles.
So if something goes wrong, no need to mark with an uh oh or nice try if she doesn’t read the cue – it is entirely possible that the cue was not salient enough in time for her to read it, so it is better to just reset with a start cookie rather than mark her as wrong. At :49, most of you was visible between the uprights which is a serp cue, so th threadle cue was not all that visible to her especially on that angle… so she was not necessarily incorrect.
At :54 you made your cue more salient and 1:12 was even better in terms of you being closer to the entry wing and less on the center of the bar. So she got it perfectly on both of those 🙂 So if something goes a little sideways, you can just throw a start cookie and as she is getting it, check your position to make sure you are showing her the line clearly. Marking her as incorrect if there is a chance that she was correct can be confusing(this is my general philosophy for handling: the dog’s response is really always a reflection of the cues they see).
>>I think I’m moving too much though and not staying totally frozen in the pose.>>
Maybe the tiniest bit of extra movement? But overall really good! You can stay totally frozen until she arrives at the reward 🙂 And you can also start to add your threadle verbal (I think you were saying an interim cue here?). When she can threadle in both directions and you’ve got the verbal added, move to the advanced level where we show her the serp and the threadle slice in the same session, by changing your position and your verbal.
Great job here!!
TracyGood morning!
>>We are going to a trial tomorrow so I will try some of the pattern game in the warmup area, away from the craziness to start.>>
Have fun at the trial! If he has not yet done the pattern games at home to develop the framework, don’t start them at the trial. It might be too hard. So do stuff he has already seen at home, like tugging or hitting his hat with his cute little feet 🙂
He did really well with wrapping the bucket! Having the klimb behind you was the only hard part of when you were standing up – so next time you can start by standing so the klimb isn’t there. You can totally start the turn and burn game 🙂 And also, since he is getting taller, you can transfer this game to something taller like a barrel or big cone so he cannot lift his head over it (like he can with the bucket here).
For the backing up – this is a hard skill especially for pups who are still learning how to use all of their various body parts LOL! The reason he wants to sit is because you are standing up after the start cookie, so he is looking way up to your hands and that produces the weight shift back into the sit. Ideally, your cookie hands would stay at his nose level the whole time so he can use the hands as a focal point to move away from – and the neutral head position should help eliminate the sit.
The easiest way to do this is to have you sit on something so your back doesn’t get angry from being bent over 🙂 So try it sitting on the klimb and see if that helps him!
>>I think I should try something behind him that feels different for him to target with his back feet?>>
Yes, I really like using a destination for this. Here is more about it
For the destination, you will still want to be low and sitting on something. And start him with all 4 feet on it, then lure his front feet off with the start cookie so he only has to put his front feet back on 🙂 Then when he can do that, you can lure all 4 feet off with the start cookie and reward for putting his back feet on the destination.
On the retrieving video – the first rep was pretty perfect! He brought it close enough that you could reach it easily. On the 2nd rep, you were on the ground rather than standing – so maybe standing up has been built into the retrieve cue? Definitely something to experiment with. And also if he was tired, it was good to end the session and try it again another time.
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning!
It is really cool that he has had so many life experiences!!!
>>Yes, I had the food in my hoodie pocket. There is a bowl of kibble on the mantel for easy grabbing. So he was looking at that to see if he could help himself. LOL>>
Poor, starving puppy hahahah! So you can keep the food and toy play more separate for now – it is possible that even kibble is very high value! And, you can try training him after meals when (theoretically) he will prioritize food a little less.
>> Which he’s been up there many times. He’s such a goat. He’s been on every surface in this house. Walks across xpens with covers and wire crates no problem. If it wobbles and falls no big deal. Teeter should be easy. >>
Ha! His confidence is excellent! Keep letting him (safely) goat around on things to maintain that confidence through adolescence.
>>He’s got great prey drive and he’s good at tugging.
You can also increase the excitement of the toy presentation by having a toy tied to a longer toy so you can swing it and drag it for him to chase. That can be more exciting (prey drive!) and can help him ignore food 🙂
I think the backing up started off really well – my suggestion to that would be to have you sitting in a chair or on the couch, so it is easier for you to remain bent over to deliver the start cookie and reward cookie faster. Standing up then leaning over then standing up was changing his head position a lot (up and down) so that was probably distracting from him processing what his hind end was doing. Then when you knelt, the picture was very different and he was not sure of what to do.
>>I think I should use ‘get it’ instead of ‘yes’ and that might help him not be mugging my hand. And maybe bigger treats?>>.
Yes to the ‘get it’ and also yes to bigger treats. And I think having your hands stationary more (rather than moving up and down) will help him stop mugging you because he can use your hands as a stationary focal point to move away from, rather than be distracted by the movement.
So try sitting on something (with another room for placing the start cookie) and also yes – use a destination for him to back up to. Use something nice and big so he can start with all 4 feet on it. Lure his front feet off with the start cookie then let him step his front feet back onto it. Then you can work up to luring all 4 feet off with the start cookie (move the destination mat a little further back so you can remain seated) and then reward him for his back feet stepping back on.
Great job here!! Let me know what you think!
Tracy
Not normal, in the best way 🙂 Keep revisiting these behaviors in new places so she doesn’t lose that skill during adolescence. It sounds like she gets to go to classes in different places, and that is GREAT!!!
T
Good morning!
>>Two rainy days. We took yesterday off, but did a few short exercises today. He is a little energizer puppy, so I thought we could do a few exercises today. >>
Yes, the weather has been GROSS!!! He did well with his sessions here and if still had energy to burn, you can do hide-and-seek games in the house (where you distract him with some cream cheese on the floor, then you sneak away and hide and start to call him). Or you can do searches in the house – hide something really smelly and delicious and have him search for it (maybe even wearing his harness!). These games can burn off energy without burning his brain up the way the training sessions would.
>>He is wearing a harness in these videos as I am trying to desensitize the harness, as he has made an association between the harness and the car. He gets car sick and fights me to go in the car. If he saw me with the harness, he would hide in his crate. I am trying to work through the motion sickness problem.>
Poor little guy!!! Yes, using the harness is other contexts is smart!
Strike a pose looked great – I agree, he totally remembered what to do. Yay!
You can use a ‘get it’ instead of a yes for the cookie toss, so he looks towards the landing spot more and at your hand less.
You can add this to a jump now: using 2 uprights and a bump or rolled up towel as a bar, you can put yourself into serp position and have him come in over the bar. You can see it here:He did really well with the backing up – we are starting to see one independent back foot movement, and that is great! Yay!
>>had to resort to the Wobble Board, which was just an incline, not a step up>>Yes, the wobble board was on a good incline for him and it worked really well.
To jump start the backing up session, start him on the wobble board (you can put stuff under it so it moves less if he is not sure about getting all 4 feet on it) then lure him off so he can offer backing up to it right away. That will streamline the start of the session where he was not quite sure what to do, plus it will eliminate the need for you to move his hind end into position.
And then you can gradually draw him further and further off, so he has more distance on the backing up 🙂
He definitely liked the squeaky toy here!!! And he was also happy to play with it on his own LOL! So the answer might be in having 2 of these squeaky toys 🙂 Throw one, he gets it, then you can start moving the opposite direction with the 2nd squeaky toy. He will get into the groove of going to get it then coming back towards you – and then we can get him bringing the original squeaky back towards you by gradually delaying the presentation of the 2nd squeaky toy 🙂
Even though I totally like trading toys for treats, using food was a no-go for this because as soon as the for came out, he started offering behaviors to get the food and the toy was forgotten LOL!!! So try it with 2 squeaky toys and let me know how it goes!!! His retrieving instinct will kick in soon 🙂
Great job here!
TracyGood morning!
He is doing well with his perch work! When using the hand cue to keep him moving into your side, keep your hand lower so he doesn’t reach up for it – that shifts too much weight into his rear which makes fluid movement harder (you can see him lose his balance a couple of times). The hand can be at nose level (with his jaw line parallel to the ground) to help him balance his stance.
The next step for him is more independence and less help from you (fading your hand cue and your movement :)) Because he already has such nice value for moving to your side, you can approach the added-independence so he pivots to your side as the end goal. Think of it as a clock: you are at 6 o’clock. Toss a cookie to 3 o’clock, and stand still – let him get the cookie and see if he can pivot to your side by getting on the perch from that angle. If so, you can change the angle of the cookie toss, to 2 the n1 the 12 then 11 and so on, all the way around the clock so he pivots more and more. And then changes sides so he does it in both directions like he did here 🙂
If he struggles without your movement or hand cue, you can add a hand cue but try not to move. The goal is that he eventually does all the pivoting without needing the hep 🙂
When he can do that, we add in one bump or bar (taped to the ground) for him to step over. The build up to 2 then 3.
This can all take multiple sessions spread out over a few weeks, so no rush 🙂 Or it might be the easiest thing ever and he gets it all in one session LOL!! He will let us know.
>>Do I need to add a verbal at this point?>>
Good question! I never add a verbal to this, because the perch is the cue (and one less word to worry about is happy-making haha) You can add a verbal to it, but I would wait until he is pivoting without your movement/hand cue – right now the movement and hand cue are driving the behavior so it makes the verbal harder to attach.
His threadle slices are looking great! And he was able. To do the harder angles too – most adult dogs can’t do that LOL!! Good boy!!!
One suggestion is to stay perfectly still and don’t praise until he gets to the PetTutor – that is the true end of behavior (committing to the jump as part of the threadle slice) so the early praise or early movement can end up cluttering the cue.
And since he did so well, two next-step ideas for you:
(Ok, 3 next steps – use a wing on the entry side because he will only see these on wings and I think these were wingless)– balance the threadle slice with the serp by changing your position every couple of reps to sometimes cue the threadle, and sometimes cue the serp. The PT can be placed in a spot kind of on the line where it can reward both (almost on the same line as the exit upright) so you don’t have to move it between reps.
– you can start to fade out actually touching your hand on these by clicking the PT as he is approaching your hand but before he hits it. So at first, it is an earlier click. Then, when he gets into the groove, you can click later: he will come in and start to turn to the bar, and you can click the PT when he turns to the bar. That is the desired end result behavior.
As with everything, these added steps might take multiple sessions over a few week (that is normal) or he might produce the behavior instantly (NOT normal LOL!!! ) and that is great 🙂
>>I believe training the pattern is the easy part (at least based on my own experience training Robie who got the box turn, ball carrying, jumping the jumps, etc. down very quickly but for the life of me can’t pass.) >>
For an adult, experienced, agility dog who understands his body – the pattern and box turn is not that hard. That is why Robie picked it up so well (and so did Nacho, for example). It will be different with a puppy 🙂 and I have been waiting for my youngsters to have more adult bodies before starting the box turn stuff (Ramen is 15 months old and just starting now).
As for the other stuff… I believe we all trained it backwards: we worked the box turn and pattern stuff and then we were like “btw, there is going to be a lot of passing and arousal and reward strategies and all this other stuff” So trying to add it in after the pattern was learned was REALLY hard. (We need to also do this in agility, but yet agility seems to be trying to sterilize the environment more and more LOL!!)
My goal now is to add in the passing games and arousal regulation and all the other stuff before the pattern is started, then show it to the dogs at every stage of training. So for example, while Ramen is just beginning his box turn work, so many other pieces are in place that he will carry into the full pattern.
>>What I am really interested in working on is dealing with the environment and learning to work in high arousal around other highly aroused dogs.>>
Small slices built into every step 🙂 and being able to function in that environment (pattern games and volume dial) before adding in fancy skills like box turns. The Skidz seminar really helped solidify this and I hope to get folks together to work these skills too. And, same with agility training. It all works together quite nicely.
>>In other news, we attended a seminar with Sheyla and Annette yesterday. He was quite brilliant, and I am pleased to say he worked for the tug the whole day!>>
SUPER!!!! So fun!!! And in a new environment too – happy dance!!!
>> As you might imagine, both Sheyla and Annette broke things down for us substantially to ensure success. >>
They are both terrific <3
>> He took the opportunity to LEAP across the 4 foot (or more) barrier to check out what was happening in the other ring.>>
Zoinks! Well, I guess 20” or 24” will not be a problem LOL!!!! And he was probably just having a grand time with no bad intentions but definitely watch him LOL!!!!
Great job here!
Tracy
