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Hi!
>If I give a “chute”, I want him thinking about me. This can mean that it’s anything from a minor turn to a 180. >
Based on what we are seeing in course design evolution in terms of the number of turns required on the tunnel exits, plus the distance required, plus handling cues not always being salient with the dog miles away from the handler 🙂 I think you can differentiate minor turn versus 180 versus 45 degrees. So chute can be a minor turn, gentle arc. 180 (L-shaped turn, for example) can be a soft turn cue (I use left and right for this, about 8-10 feet before the dog enters the tunnel, works like a charm), and my wrap directional (same timing) for the wrap back exits. Tunnel exits are a hot trend right now, so the clearer the directionals, the better for 2025 and beyond.
> I think it’s super hard to get both the speed and accuracy that I want when my dog is blind to me in the tunnel.>
Agree!!! That is why I am using a variety of directionals and saying/showing the cues well before the dog is in the tunnel. Once the dog has entered the tunnel, I can only cross my fingers and hope my timing was decent LOL!
>“Hup” is keep going straight but keep an eye and an ear on my handling. I will use it for jumps where I want him to wind up turning a bit (think like a gentle curving line like you often seen at the end of a speedstakes course), but where there aren’t other reasonable options so I’m fine with him figuring out his own line.>
Perfect – most people don’t have this as a cue and I think it is important! It is a very gentle arc, stay on the same lead, but not flat out extension.
>I’ve been using my “out” as a way to turn away on the flat.>
Turn away as in a rear cross on the flat where you both do a U-turn and head back the other way? Or as a lead change shift away to pick up the line in the same direction? If it is the U turn, and since you do UKI… I recommend adding the lead shift too. It is a UKI life saver!
Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
I think this was all good! Good for you for setting up a class for your girls 🙂 It was a bit of a distracting environment but didn’t seem overwhelming for her. She did great!
> honestly julee massive love for humans I thought maybe just tugging with some hand touches dispersed would be easier. I did break out pattern games to regulate a bit with the tugging bc she tugged wildly since I think it was so hard to focus. Is that reasonable?>
Yes, she seemed to be tugging harder than usual. One thing you can do is to ask her to do something a little more elaborate when she is aroused like that (a barrel wrap for example) so you can see how the added arousal affects her: does it make her struggle? Does it sharpen her focus? Does she bite you? 🤣😂 It might actually end up being the optimal state! So it is worth it to see what happens next after the higher arousal tugging. And the pattern games were easy for and she was great with those.
Since she did so well here, you can add in more games when the people are around and see how she does.
Great job!
TracyGood morning!
He is doing well with the get out here and SUPER well with the focus in a new environment!!
>the 2-towel setup – I think it really helps him drive ahead (maybe so much so that he loses track of the props between?).>
Yes, I think he was tending to target the 2nd towel when he was on your left in particular (moving towards the camera). So you can use 1 towel as the start towel and throw the toy as the reward, then go back to the starting point for the next rep (rather than back and forth).
To get a bit ahead you can also start further from the towel (halfway between the towel and the prop) and toss the cookie back to it (sending him back to it). That can allow you to show the get out cue from a little ahead which can make it clearer too.
He is doing well with his hula hoop too 🙂 This is also a game where you can send him to cookie on the towel so you are ahead as he starts moving forward. Starting next to him is getting you to run, which he likes a lot! But it is also getting him to look up at you. So being ahead will allow you to all up the line past the hula hoop, and mark him going through it and throw the cookie or toy to the next towel before he looks up at you. This is no easy thing with a small fast dog (getting them to look forward) so something we might add is a manners minder so he will look forward because the reward is not coming from you.
Speaking of small and fast 😁🤣 the blind crosses definitely required that head start of sending him to the cookie on the towel away from you. Anything where you started next to him caused him to catch up to you very fast, making the blind late. If he is happy to be picked up, you can hold him while you place a treat on the towel, carry him 10 feet away from it, then send him to it. As he gets the treat from the towel, you can take off and run, starting the blind as soon as he exits the treat towel. That should give you time to make the new connection on the other side.
>Skizzle laid down on the towel after the last rep – which made me think he was pretty tired and we should take it a little easier for the next day…which we did.>
He might have been tired indeed. But if you have been working on downs on a mat, he might have been offering that? It looks like his brain was still really engaged and ready to play, but less is more is always a great approach.
Looking at the hallway rear cross: excellent timing of being visible on the new side! That allowed you to get every single rear cross, on both sides. He was catching on really well so grabbing the treat even faster to make the turn – but you were still very visible on the new side setting up the RC. Nailed it! Super!!!!!
Great job here!
TracyGood morning!
>tried your idea of the 2 Cato Boards; well 1 Cato Board and 1 exercise step and not sure exactly why but if I didn’t stand up she didn’t seem to understand to move away. Sometimes she’d take a step but my timing on throwing the treat “under” her was really inconsistent and it just didn’t seem to be helping her get the idea.>
It is possible that this was a bit of latent learning in action – she might not have appeared to have sorted it out in the session, but then had a better concept of it after sleeping on it.
Plus, combined with having her target her back feet on various things, you now have a really nice backing up going! YAY!! Backing up to a rear foot target is the next step to the game anyway 🙂 so this worked perfectly. The mat you used here was great: big enough for her to target to but as you mentioned – didn’t slide around. Her backing up is looking really strong!
Yes, this is the progression – you can get further away bit by bit to get more stepping back over more distance. As you do this, shorten up the session because backing up is fatiguing (hard on the quads and hamstrings, plus there is a core strength element). When the pups get physically tired, they shorten their steps or they go sideways, which is what was happening here. So you can do 5 cookies/reps then give her a break and do something else that involes moving forward 😁 to let the muscles recover a bit. Then you can do another 5 reps of backing up.
>Concept Transfer with the Strike a Pose Game…..you’re using a none wing jump. Is there a reason for a non-wing and not a wing?>
I start with a wingless so the pups can see me better – strike a pose has a lot of arm/foot/rotation info and a wing jump can hide it. So, a few sessions on the wingless helps get things going by letting the pup see everything clearly.
Great job here!
Tracy
Good morning!
Super strong sessions here!! She was fabulous driving around both stacks and also seemed to be having fun doing it! Fast and tight! Sounds like you had your wrap verbals going too which is great rehearsal for future games and eventual course running too.>I realized on that last session that my position needs to be more visible to her as she comes around and also off of her line more. >
Yes – I think you worked out the line and position beautifully and she had no questions about that, and also no questions about which side of you to be on when exiting the wrap. Nice connection!
>I assume at this stage it’s perfectly fine to just swap hands that you carry the toy in so you aren’t trying to send them with the hand you have the toy in? I feel like ideally we get there, but probably too much for a puppy?>
Yes, but also no 🤣😂. Switching hands can draw her focus to your hands, and also leaving the toy in the dog-side hand gives us a great opportunity to teach the self-control of passing the toy, and the ‘don’t grab the toy til you hear the toy-in-hand marker’. It shifts the value a bit more to the ‘work’ and less on the focusing on the toy. That marker is hard for us humans because we get excited and praise while delivering the toy instead of using the marker before delivering the toy (I am guilty as charged on that what, but I have gotten a lot better about it LOL!!)
With that in mind, she actually had very little trouble ignoring the toy in your dog-side when your leg supported the send until she was arriving at the barrel. Those reps were super successful.
She had a couple of moments where it appeared that she was looking at the toy in your hand, but she was not – she was watching your motion shift back into the FC too early (before she arrived at the barrel, as she was passing you). You can see this at 1:29 when she hesitated and almost pulled off the wrap.
You can see it at 1:47 for sure, when your leg stepping back was too early and she did come back to you.
Those both had the toy in the dog side hand, but at 3:11, the toy was in the opposite hand and you stepped back too early, so she came off the wrap (then went for the toy, possibly anticipating your motion to indicate it was available, or possibly having a small mad that the info was not clear?)
So for now, hold the send leg forward to the stack until she is past you and arriving at the barrel. You can also move the barrels even further apart and add the advanced level – which involves more handler motion (and earlier rotation). Adding more motion will help you be able to step back into the FC sooner because the motion will propel her forward more.
Great job here! Hopefully you are not getting any of that big storm coming through so you can keep working outdoors.
Tracy
Hi!
This was really strong!!! He was great about driving right into the target hand!! And nice job with the reward placement from the other hand. Super!>Strike a pose, my dog is too little and I do not bend well.
>The good news is that since he is doing so well, you don’t have to bend as much 🙂 You can add in a bowl to drop the reward into (on the same side of you as the reward hand, with your toes pointing to the bowl). Then you can start to raise the target hand, so he comes in towards it but doesn’t need to touch it. Instead, he can turn to the reward bowl and that will create the in-then-out line we want for serps.
And then you can do the concept transfer, adding a jump! He is moving along very quickly 🙂
Great job here!
TracyHappy New Year!! Can you send some of your hot weather here? If we take a little of it, you will have less heat and we will have less freezing LOL!
>to the barrel but the latter disappeared or wasn’t filmed after all. >
I can totally relate – usually I have accidentally deleted it. If the barrel sending is going well, you can start adding the rocking horse games!
She was so cute at the very beginning when you went to get treats and she took herself over the jump – then she looked shocked when she didn’t get rewarded LOL! You can have treats in a pocket for a faster transition into the training.
The parallel path went great – he definitely likes her jump! You can switch the clicker out for a verbal marker now: as she is approaching the jump, you can say ‘get it’ and toss the treat. That will keep her looking ahead even more.
She is ready for you to add more motion to this – that might he hard indoors, so you can try it outdoors if it is not too hot (maybe early in the morning). That will require a bit of sorting out how to deliver the reward (tiny treats might be hard to find). So you can try it with a thrown toy. Or you can use a treat holder of some sort like a treat hugger or small lotus ball. That will also help us get her ready for running bigger games in the grass 🙂
Great job here!
TracyGood morning!
The serps went great! He got it from a variety of angles. He had on error (3rd rep) but I think you were too exciting on the release – the ‘break!’ had more energy and your change in movement was bigger. The other reps were more chill and that worked better 🙂
When you try this again, let’s get a toy involved – definitely tugging between reps to keep the excitement high and help him read the cues when he is more stimulated. And then the toy can replace the food bowl on the ground. You can come back to the game in a few days, to let latent learning wire it into his brain (and so he doesn’t get bored with the repetition).
The remote reinforcement is going well. I love the ‘candy’ marker! Walking away from it was so easy for him that he seemed surprised that it was THAT easy LOL!! But surprise is good! And keep mixing things up – you added some sits and he was great. You can add tricks, you can add a line up cue (similar to how you will eventually want to line him up at the start line), you can take the leash off and mark his choice to stay with you, etc. Keep mixing things up and adding more. And, replace the treats with a toy too (can be the same marker because it is a concept of ‘head to reward station’ and the dog has seen the reward station) or a different marker if you want.
Great job here! Stay warm!
Tracy
This sounds like an amazing adventure! And I will keep my eyes open for properties. I don’t know a lot about AL other than the weather can be the opposite of Alaska, and not in a good way LOL! Greasy humidity, heat, tornados, etc. I know lots of folks who have moved to TN and loved it!!!
T
Good morning! Thanks for the info!
To be honest, I think her response to the puppy play event was pretty normal. A big dog came in way too forward, 10 asked the puppy to back off with her body language, the puppy did NOT and got even pushier. Then another puppy came at her? Poor 10! It was all too much. I think all of my dogs would have had a similar response and I really can’t think of any BC puppy that I know who would have enjoyed that style of interaction with other dogs.
I agree with you about NOT letting the puppies work it out especially since 10 already asked the other puppy to back off.
Getting her out of these and NOT putting her back into that situation was the right thing to do. I am glad she was able to eat a bit. The skittishness after that was probably because she was nervous about another puppy jumping on her again.
About the other stuff you describe – some of it might be noise sensitivity? Like the other dogs barking, vacuum, etc. Have you seen noise sensitivity anywhere else, like dogs barking in agility? Or another dog doing the teeter?
I think some of this is OK – like hiding from the vacuum, I hide from it too hahaha but it is weird and loud so she opts out from being near it (normal BC behavior, and the other normal BC behavior around vacuums can be attacking them).
She also might not like change (like when you are packing stuff away, so packing the house up might be a bit stressful for her) or things that are out of her control (BCs like to control things LOL!)
>If the other dogs bark back at the golden next door, 10 backs up almost in a hop and wants nothing to do with it.>
She might not like strife – if the barking is really loud and maybe even angry, she might want out of there instead of joining in (I prefer my dogs don’t join in!)
So you can provide decompression outlets for her so she can guide herself into them when she feels uncomfortable. That can letting her have her quiet spot in the closet, along with chew bones that only she can access (with apologies to the other dogs :)) or you can provide for her by giving them to her. That can give her a way to soothe herself and a really good coping option. (Snuffle mat, bully stick, etc.)
In your household of dogs, does she have a favorite friend who does not get worried about anything? If so, you can pair her with that dog and use social learning too – for example, my whippet is not worried about *anything* at all, so each of the two younger dogs were exposed to new/weird things with him at their side. That way they could see him being confident (and quiet haha) and they totally learned from that. My BC-ish dog was a lot more worried about noises and people when he was really young, so I taught him a lot of coping skills and paired him with the whippet… now he is VERY solid and confident everywhere.
>Last night during scent work class all the ring gates fell when we were walking in for our turn. 10 didn’t seem to care at all about that.>
This is good! So she doesn’t have a generalized noise fear. Yay!
Keep doing pattern games and other coping skills, and taking her feedback about what concerns her so you can help her out. BCs can be different, behaviorally, than other dogs and more emotional in some ways (especially when hormones get involved- has she had a season yet?)
>I have only had one time she would not take sirloin. That was during one of our very first visits to the airport. Our lifestyle demands airport training. So, we start them young. I love that our airport encourages dog training inside. We were sitting on a bench, near all the animal displays. 10 was very concerned about the moose across the way. I just sat with her and finally she came around and asked for her sirloin.>
I love that the airport encourages dog training!!
Reading this… I imagine at least a few of my completely normal dog would be concerned about a giant moose in the airport. It is definitely weird to see that, so I can see why she needed to sit and watch it for a while. My 10 month old puppy would probably bark at it LOL! He is half Malinois and will alert a bit to very weird things (but also gets paired with the whippet who will not alert to anything, so the pup doesn’t alert much at all anymore) But in his defense: from a puppy’s perspective, it is definitely weird!!
>10 was off leash, I thought letting her decide where she wanted to go or not good was for the best. She stayed close to me the entire time. The furthest she ventured was about 4-5 chairs down to meet the little puppy and the person. >
Awwww I love that after a bad experience she still went to meet the other puppy <3 Bear in mind that she doesn’t need to ever be in a big social play group like a doggie day care scenario - if she doesn’t want to play with big dogs wrestling, that is perfectly fine! She just needs to co-exist and be happy nearby and ignore them 🙂 That is pretty normal BC behavior. As you saw in the agility area, she was a happy girl in that environment: being around other dogs but not being pummeled by them, and getting to work! That is a joyous time for a Border Collie 🙂
So we will keep looking at where she needs help and which games/coping skills work best, and help her out. And as she enters the crazy time of adolescence, we will balance all of that with plenty of simple happy times with no pressure because the adolescent brain doesn't do well with pressure.
Tracy
Hi!
She was so cute climbing all over this stuff here!! Would this normally worry her? You can hide treats in it so she has to climb and search them out: excellent brain work!!!>She submits and pee when meeting new dogs and some people.>
This is normal for many, many 7 month old puppies. Ask people to greet her while staying upright and not petting her so she doesn’t pee 🙂 And don’t let dogs rush her where she will want to roll over and pee.
>I took her to a puppy play event to practice MYOB games. That was an utter fail. She went into flight mode even when I backed up over 50’ from the dogs. At first she was curious, but couple of the larger breed puppies pushed her to uncomfortable.>
Was it kind of like a dog park or doggy day care situation? Sounds like she was interested in it, sorta, but then got turned off then the larger dogs were too forward. Sounds like it was overwhelming!
> I immediately walked her out to the door and just asked her to sit with me far from the puppies. I did finally get her playing the up and down game and then interacting with a toy.>
Good for you! It sounds like the environment was just tooooooo much. Let me know more of what it was like and then I can tell you if you should be worried or not. Most Border Collies HATE the wild doggy day care/ dog park situations.
>Then went to the agility arena where they were running dogs. In that environment she was a rock star. Could focus on the game and stay engaged with me. She wasn’t concerned about any of the other dogs or people. She went into work mode.>
Sounds like a far, far better situation. Yay!!!
>We hit the road in February. We will be living in the fifth wheel for a couple months, traveling to nationals and other opportunities.>
FUN!!! Hope to see you on the eastern side of the country?
> So far it’s all, don’t let the other dogs bark when she is around, >
I have 9 dogs in the house right now, I don’t know how to let my puppy lead a normal life without the other dogs barking LOL!!! Question: what is causing a fear response from her, in terms of the other dogs barking?
>keep her separated >
I don’t think this is entirely useful, but let me know what might be happening and we can plan?
>and bc’s fears only escalate as they grow up. >
That is not true for all border collies and we can certainly help her deal with whatever is worrying her.
>I cannot separate her from the pack, I can offer safe space and soothing, but I’ve got to believe she will mature out of this.>
Let me know what is going on and I can send ideas 🙂 And maturity helps – she is entering adolescence and that is a challenging time 🙂 But we can help her out too!
>Maybe this is nothing. I don’t see a huge problem. I just don’t like that she runs and hides when she is concerned. On a side note, if I call her, she comes immediately. So, she knows I’m a safe space.>
I do like that she tells you when she is concerned!!! Will she eat really high value food when she is concerned? We can develop a plan to help her out. Send me a list of what she has been concerned about and we can make a plan 🙂
Tracy
Hi!
Wow, you are having great weather!!! I am jealous!!!!>I’m very excited that he was able to focus and play, despite some distractions>
This was amazing!!!! He had so many options to explore in the environment and lots noise in the background… but he was a barrel wrapping pro. Super!!!! The wrapping looked good like it did at home – that is really nice to see that the different environment didn’t really change the behavior. Yes, you can keep doing some field trips 🙂 and you can bring the other barrel games on the road, like turn and burn and the rocking horses.
Strike a pose is looking great!! Yes, when the cookie toss went awry, he didn’t always go over the jump bar on the way to you – no worries though, that will go away as we put the serp into context more. The next step here is to have a food bowl on the ground, just past the foot where you are rewarding him – that way he can come into your hand then directly to the food bowl (then you drop the food into it :)) He is touching the hand really strongly right now, but as we add the food bowl, he will kind if side-swipe it and that is great (we are going to be fading out the hand target soon).
On the rotated sends: I am loving how well he is going to the barrel on the forward sends! For the rotated sends, you can help him get the idea on the first couple of reps by placing the empty food bowl halfway around as a visual aid… then move it around bit by bit until he is all the way around the barrel. That will smooth out the first couple of reps, which are the ones where he has the question. Once he gets into the groove, he is quite lovely around the barrel and won’t need the bowl.
On the backing up – I agree, I like the lower platform better. You were getting true backing up there! Yay! For the taller one, he was hoisting his hind end up on it more than stepping back onto it, so you can stick with the lower one so he steps backwards. You can start to get more steps backwards by moving yourself gradually further back, but sometimes rewarding fewer steps (ping ponging like you mentioned :))
Looking at the rocking horses:
>I might try replacing the soft barrel with a 2nd hard barrel, to discourage the barrel-bashing.>
Yes, I think this is a great idea! He never tried to smash the hard barrel, he wrapped it every time. On the hard barrel, he did seem to enjoy smacking it especially at the beginning of a session LOL so try it with 2 hard barrels and let’s see how he does.
Most of the reps here were very smooth – the front cross worked best when you made a big connection as he exited the first barrel and before he got to the 2nd barrel. It is a bit slow motion right now to be sure you get connection. If you were too fast to look forward to send to the next barrel (:50, 1:23, 1:51), the connection was breaking – and he would read it as a blind cross and end up going to the other side of you. So make that connection last until he just about arrives at your side, then you can send forward to the next barrel.
Great job here!!
TracyHi!
>Do you have a word for the different tunnel entrances? I cannot upload a pic, you are headed to a curved tunnel, the dog is on your right, the obvious side is to the right, the dog has to come into you to take the left entrance. Two different words or just call the dog in?>
Yes – the obvious line is “tunnel”. And for the non-obvious line where the dog has to come towards me, my verbal is “kisskisskiss” 🙂
Tracy
Good morning!
>The one Cato did move- the tip was on the low setting – he loves to slam that thing – I could raise it. It will be a while before we can move all that outside!>.
You can totally raise it, put a disc under it, add weird things – make it a playground LOL!
On the serp video: The jump angle was good here!!
The first rep and last rep were the best ones in terms of you staying in motion the whole time and releasing as you got closer to the exit wing. The other reps had more stopping and you were a little more in the center, which worked but we want you to be able to move like you did on the first and last reps.So with that in mind… since his miss here (and previous misses) were on the slice, he might be one of the dogs who does better starting from position 3 (the highly angled position) because it might be easier than the slice for him. He would be in the stay in position 3, but your line is the same (walking around and through serp position, parallel to the bar) and release when you are arriving at the exit wing. Let me know how he does with that!
Great job 🙂
Good morning and happy New Year!
He did really well with the tunnel threadle in both directions! Super!! He did look a little tired on the last rep, so a shorter session as you mentioned is great, or even switching to a different toy to keep things spicy 🙂
One suggetsion: say the verbal 2 or 3 times before you let him go, so he is really processing the verbal before moving. By doing this, you can move him a little further back from the last position you had here – that way you can use your threadle verbal to get the other end, or angle him a little differently and use your regular tunnel cue to get the closer end.
For your tunnel threadles, are you planning on using the opposite arm? You can add that here too: dog-side arm holds his collar, and you can be showing the opposite arm while you say the verbal, before you release him.
On the parallel path video:
>He wasn’t having fun at first and then I realized that a setup cookie isn’t a reward. Rewards made quite a difference!>
Yes, the first couple of reps had praise but no reward for the jump, only the re-start cookie so he was not that into it. He definitely preferred the cookie tossed as the reward (starting at :30). You can also throw a toy then trade for a cookie then restart with a cookie. Your timing was generally really good, getting the reward thrown before he arrived at the jump – that kept him looking forward. Yay!
I think you can add more motion to hi – jogging and running! The more you move, the more you will want to connect back to him to support him choosing the line instead of watching you move 🙂
Great job here!
Tracy
