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Hi!
The handling on the jumping/tunnel sections is looking really good, so to practice that, a couple of behavior things to help her out:
>>Reaction time when things got hot on the start is still a challenge for me. Atleast the first time. I was able to atleast have a plan the second time.>>
I think for now – just take out any start behavior and begin someplace in the opening where you can send and run.We are woking the start line separately, no need to put it on course right now. On this course, you can just slingshot her at 4 and run run run. There is just too much failure on the start lines and you are getting frustration behavior. We don’t want it to become a source of tension so for now, just remove it from the equation for now.
With the contacts – also too much failure here. For course work runs, use targets when you are running courses so that she does not fail and is not told she is wrong (and so you don’t have the dilemma to what to do if she is not correct). That way she can be correct and fast.
For the handling – try to break this down to 3 or 4 obstacle sessions on your first time through it, so you can run with connection and add more reinforcement into the jump sections. You were running for your life (relatable LOL!) so while you were great about staying in motion, she didn’t get a lot of connection or reinforcement (then ended up on a contact that when slightly awry too)
Then after you get the 3 or 4 obstacles, turn it into maybe 10 obstacles (without the stay and with targets on the contacts, or whatever aid you used to train them). And reward reward reward before it goes wrong 🙂 That will allow you to work the connection and lines! And then you’ll see that it is relatively easy to put the whole thing together (starting without a stay in a place where it makes sense to send and go, and with targets on the contacts).
I don’t mind having targets in for now, because as you mentioned – it is really hard to set up the flow if the contacts go awry! And I don’t want to tell her she is wrong, but I also don’t want to tell her she is right to not do the contact behavior 🙂 So the easy answer is to help her out and get success with the targets 🙂 Then it will be very easy to fade them out as you keep that really nice flow!
Nice work here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
Nice work here!A general observation:
I think in practice you tend to run parallel to her when ideally you would run ahead or laterally. This is especially true on the contacts (more below) so it is changing the lines you run. Rehearsing that might mess things up at trials, when you will need to be ahead or she is moving faster or bothOpening line –
The lead out worked well on the first rep! Very nice!!The shorter lead out would mean a RC on takeoff side of 3 to get the line – you did it on t he landing side, but you were not quite far enough area so she spun.
She also had a little question on the line from the DW to the frame: The jump at :23 (jump after the DW) is a serp you turned your shoulders forward so she didn’t read the 2nd part of it and had a question. It was smoother on the 2nd rep but you can be more laterally away from the DW and so you can get the backside and show the serp arm/shoulders there.
The A-frame exit at :31 was confusing – you decelreated then moved towards her, then said good and she released. At 2:08 you rotated towards her and then moved forward so she released but did a zig zag – caused an extra step to the backside for you. Just keep handling and either release to the next jump or throw a reward back to her.
I think the confusion on the frame delayed the send to the backside at 10 . Be sure to turn your shoulders so that she knows it is a right turn not a RC at :36 rather than step in. You had a great shoulder turn on the next rep:
Really nice a 2:12!!You can add in some decel into the FC at 12 so she collects, to get a tighter turn there.
OK, let’s talk about contacts. There was the decel and moving towards her on the a-frame, and you did the same thing on the teeter – decelerated, rotated towards her, stepped towards her then released on motion which would explain why she thought she should release the frame.
I think you are doing all 3 contacts: decelerating, rotating towards her, then trying to rotate back to the line. Ideally you would keep moving – is this decel because she might not stop? If so, put targets back out on the contact bottoms so you can help her stop while you continue to drive through the handling.
Hanging out at the teeter bought you the off course jump at :49 and at 2:23 you totally stepped to it. Reward her or continue, she was correct – no stopping without reinforcement (very frustrating for her and she rehearsing barking at you and being in front of you after the first stop there) . The ideal handling would be to leave her at the teeter and drive past the tunnel entry, so a target for the teeter end position will really help!
One other small detail – when saying go on the last line, say it to her (more connection, even if she is ahead :)) and not to the jump so that she gets the connection and makes the line smoother.
Nice work here! Let me know what you think, especial about the general observation of staying too close to her line especially at the contacts 🙂
Tracy
Hi!
Sorry to hear about Enzo!! Hope his rest is short and he is back in action soon!Casper stepped up rally well! I am happy to look at his work 🙂 He does need things broken down more because he is still trying to process the lines, the handling cues, and how to use his body – all while going really fast 🙂
He did really nicely on the first line – you had a little too much pressure into the jump before the weaves, so he read it as a rear cross – a lower arm and more motion towards the right turn wing will help smooth that out. Nice weaves!!!
He had really good distance on 1-2 on 2nd clip! He needed a more obvious connection to the 3 jump, you were looking ahead and peeling away so he came with you. Be sure to reward more so he is getting a lot of reinforcement for his effort on these really hard courses – if he misses a jump, just keep going and reward somewhere else n the line (like after the next obstacle) rather than stop him. Missed jumps are handler error with baby dogs so it is fine to keep going. That will keep him in a really centered arousal state and not frustrated at all.When you did it again, you definitely had more support and he read the line better (different handling choices, but that went well!) You can reward after the tunnel then set him up to be able to get ahead of him again: those weaves are miles away 🙂 and we want you to be ahead to support him. And then after the weaves, you can isolate that line to the tunnel – convergence and lead changes away are hard for youngsters, and he gave it a great try!
So definitely keep playing with Casper 🙂 I think breaking things down into 3 or 4 obstacle sets will be a good starting point for the really wicked stuff 🙂 Then we can build it up from there.
Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
Zane’s runs went really well!!!
Most of the handling lines were super smooth, even the spots that were challenging in round 1!!!The send to the tunnel in the opening on the first rep so you can layer was OH SO CLOSE! You can totally break it down – take another step or two the tunnel then throw a reward for it – and each time step a little less and keep throwing a reward for the tunnel exit. We add more layering next week which will make it easier. It was so close!!! He will get it 🙂
>>Then the 10-11 jumps…ugh. I wanted to try to improve having the correct leg, >>
I thought 10-11 went well! And yes, you can use your dog side leg more but at :28 and on the 2nd run too – you got closer to 12 and that helped him a lot too. Trying it without Zane so you can be slower is a good way to get the muscle memory of the dog side leg for the send started.
Nice line from the teeter to the tunnel! Doing it in flow really helped in the first run but you nailed it after the release the 2nd run! Nice!!!!
Dice was great in the pop out!! The opening looked awesome – very nice job trusting him and doing s timely BC at :03 and :16 I think the BC at:03 was actually better because the rep at :16 was a little early, so he was not as sure about taking the jump 🙂 The other lines looked great!
And yes, at :07 it is a ‘kiss kiss’ tunnel threadle 🙂 You had it too, he was coming in, but you opened up your shoulders too early and stepped back to the tunnel at :09. On the 2nd rep, I think he needed a more exaggerated cue because he looked at you then popped into the tunnel. Definitely a good spot to refresh for him by breaking it down then adding it back to the rest of it.
Great job! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
Congrats on your super successful weekend with the dogs!!Rosie’s video:
Interesting that with the tunnel there she added the distance to the tunnel! I wonder if she was in trial mode where she probably ran bigger courses? Or in the previous session, she had the warm up of running it without the aded jump so this was harder!
You can open up your shoulder line as a serp to help bring her in and see how that helps her ignore the extra jump. Closing your shoulder to pull her in actually kept her out on the line, so swinging your dog side arm back for the serp (left arm here) can really help her.
On the second sequence – the opening line looked great and she didn’t look at the added jump at all. Super!
The blind cross opened up the tunnel for her, so you needed to really emphasize the connection – it worked like a charm when you did that!
On sequence 3, she needs a tunnel turn cue before she enters the tunnel, especially if you don’t layer. She didn’t pick up the off course when you got in front and faced her, but it slowed her down. I think sending to the tunnel with a turn cue and then layering the jump will really help her find the turn on the tunnel exit.
She was super about not looking at the tunnel at any other point! Yay!!
Lily did have a ton of energy! On the first rep, you pulled her in a little too much 2-3 – the extra support on the other reps really helped her! She was speedy and perfect on the other reps, and didn’t seem to look at ht tunnel or the extra jump.
Seq 2 at 1:06 you stepped to the center of the bar and accidentally cued a rear cross on 4 – make sure you reward her there, she read you correctly. On the next reps, you had a nice line to the left turn wing of 4 and then a very connected blind to get the turn and not the tunnel 🙂
Seq 3 -The blind cross 2-3 works really well. The opening looked really good and she got the tunnel turn with her name call as the cue. Nice!! I agree, handling from the landing side of 5-6 made the push 7 easier for sure!
On the 5-6 line – getting to the inside for the blind was great – be sure that the blind is done before she takes off for 5, and then make a big connection to push to 7. And if something goes wrong, assume it was handler error and reward her 🙂 She is reading you correctly, like at 2:45 when your shoulder turn/lack of connection to play with pulled her off of 7. You had lovely connection on the ending and got that push to 7 really nicely!
Nice work! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
I hope you thumb isn’t too painful!!!
Nice angle on the camera here – the yard looks great!!!
This session went REALLY well! My ideas are really more about timing and running lines, to tighten up turns and take out some strides – he is now at the level where we look for any spot to cut off ticks on the clock 🙂 I don’t think he looked at any of the off course options 🙂
Seq 1, no distraction obstacles – super nice! You can trust him more and do the blind as he is over 2 and then open up your serp arm sooner as well. You can push the timing to see how early you can deliver the info!!!
Seq 2- looked great! When he is landing from the 2 backside and turns his head to look at 3, you can immediately drive away to the wing of 4 to get a slightly tighter turn on 3-4. I couldn’t hear if you were using a turn verbal or a threadle verbal or not, but it is a good spot to use one!
Seq 1 with added jump – he appears to have not even looked at the jump 🙂 and you were earlier on the timing of the blind!!! Yay! Try to open up the serp arm sooner – at :46, he is about a stride from takeoff and your shoulders are closed forward s he takes off towards you not towards 6. He changes line on landing, but adds strides to do so. Getting that lead change before takeoff of 5 will take out extra strides 5-6!
Seq 2 with added jump – very nice! As with the first, you can leave sooner for 4 to get a tighter turn on 3, and use a verbal (if you were not using one :))
Sea 3: Lovely! You can do the blind sooner and more towards 3 (1:14 was a little wide). This might be a spot where the FC might be a better choice, because it turns your feet to 3 sooner and creates a tighter turn. Ending looked great!
Seq 1 with tunnel – super nice! And earliest blind yet on the 2-3 line! Keep pushing that timing forward – he was halfway between 2 and 3 here, and I bet you can do it when he lands from 2 or even when he is over 2 🙂 as long as your position is up by 3.
Same as previous rep, open serp arm sooner so that he can drive to the 6 jump and not towards you at all.
He never looked off course here either. YAY! He is totally locked onto the lines you set.Seq 2 – Adding the tunnel here opening up a line question: he was wide at 4 because you were right in front of the Tunnel at 1:52. You can get closer to the wrap wing, or at least the wrap wing line if yo car not that far ahead, and pick up the connection there then step forward directly to the next jump (you were stepping back a bit which was ending you up near the tunnel.
You had a little disconnect at 1:56 unusual bar down, no worries because you were great on all the other reps.Seq 3 – nice opening and great timing of the right cues for the exit of tunnel 3! Your surprise cracked me up LOL! Talking to him about it distracted you both so he almost missed 5 🙂 Good save!
At 2:13, you are a bit far from the ideal line and a bit close to the tunnel on the FC on the backside – so there were a couple of extra strides. Try to get right on the wing and then move out of the FC directly forward to the next jump, so you don’t end up near the tunnel.
2nd rep was also great opening!
At 2:34 the turn was a little wide on the BC 5-6 (it can be a little earlier, but I think the FC will be the better choice here). And there was that same tiny bit of wideness at 7 for the FC after the backside there (2:36). I don’t think he is looking at the tunnel, I think he was chasing your line so if you get right on the wing then head forward to the next jump, you will see him drive directly to it.Great job here! Let me know what you think!
Tracy
Hi!
About the lead outs – to bridge the gap from training to trialing, about half of your runs in training should be practiced with a lead out… and half in training should be done with little or no lead out so you can get into the mode of handling her when you are not ahead of her.
>>Did exercise 2 first- video I was confused as to where it went- pulled her to the inside of jump and then nothing lined up. Second time forgot to turn video on after rewalked it and we did it correctly. We seemed to find this easier than first sequence.>>
I was confused too LOL!! Exercise 2 has a backside at 2, so I was not sure if you wanted it on the first rep and she ended up on the front side? Be sure to stay connected and moving towards the backside jump until you see her lock onto the wing to the backside.
>>Second time forgot to turn video on after rewalked it and we did it correctly. >>
Ah! That makes sense 🙂
I think the first sequence reps were the last two here – it was kind of a combination of sequence 1 and 2 but that is fine because you were connected and smooth and fast! Yay!!! I thought you were moving well. If you feel restricted because the ground is slippery – do you have cleats or something type of great running shoe for mud? That way you will feel comfortable running and not feel as restricted by the ground.>>Will do again on wider spaces hopefully thursday but 90 min round trip to where can do this.>>
Perfect!! She is definitely ready to see this with more distance between the obstacles, to match what you would see at a trial.
Nice work!
TracyGood morning!
Very nice session here!
She did really well driving into the serp from different angles. SUPER!!!You can now do it for a toy reward in your non-target hand, and eventually we will get that toy to the ground.
At this point, she no longer really needs to touch the target. The fading process has begun! She is figuring out that is it the in-then-out behavior and so you were seeing her set up the turn: that means she was doing a cheek touch LOL or no touch – still all good, because we fade out the touch as we get you moving on the serps.
>>I just let them slide and focused on the exercise we were working on.>>
You can start the session with a stay or two then go to cookie tosses. She was starting to release a little when you moved your hand into position, which is pretty normal (she was being a smarty and anticipating :)) She had a bunch of good stays so you don’t need to use a stay the whole time.
Great job here!! Let me know how she does with the toy 🙂
Tracy
Yay! I am glad you have added this in! It is very different than the ‘norm’ of demanding a lot of control from the dogs… and the cool thing is that there is a TON of science of support it (not just my happy anecdotes LOL!!) A lot of people ask if it gets MORE sniffing or zooming, etc but it does the opposite: the decompression and completing the stress cycle actually reduces all of that. The focus and engagement we are getting now that we have added that for the dogs is AMAZING!! Keep me posted on how your students do!
Tracy
Good morning!
>>the ideas of how to deal with JJ and her lack of even use of her hind feet.
Also please bear in mind that it is not that important right now – there are definite side preferences with puppies, and they balance out over time. And puppies are still developing processing skills and mechanics/motor skills, so you don’t need to do a lot of thinking about which back foot she leads with 🙂
>>It is really tough to get her to isolate the hind feet, but I had a few successful attempts (>>
It is really tough mainly because of their brain development at this stage. It requires the front of the brain which does not finish developing til late adolescence/early adulthood, so you probably won’t see a lot of success at this stage. No worries – don’t add pressure to it, she will get it sorted out 🙂
Looking at the tunnel videos:
Gold start to you for proper tunnel bagging!!!
>>Cana even see someone walking the course I had set and JJ does not even seem to care.>>
What a great experience for her to work while there are distractions!!! YAY!!!!
The tunnel games looked great! On the line ups,
Try to line her up with a cookie at your side and then take her collar, rather than take her collar and physically move her into your side. That will keep her in a better arousal state (physically moving the pups tends to not keep them in the same optimal state that we like :))2nd session was on the backside of the tunnel, she thought that was fine and dandy too 🙂 And she turned away into it (threadle side) – only one error partially because it is hard mechanics, partially because there are visual distractions. But on the next rep you dialed back your motion a tiny bit and and also she figured it out, so it looked great.
I think on all of the reps you were using the tunnel verbal. So now since she can also find the threadle entry so well – time to add the tunnel threadle verbal. So when she is on the outside of you as you send and she is turning towards you to take it (it will look like JJ – you – tunnel as a sandwich :)), that is the tunnel verbal. When she is between you and the tunnel and turning away from you (it will look like you – JJ – tunnel as a sandwich), that I the threadle verbal. She is definitely read to learn the difference!
And we build on this tunnel stuff really soon too 🙂
Great job here!!
TracyGood morning! Super nice session here!!!
Pop out 1, rep 1, looked great both times!!
Layering the tunnel there was effective because the jumps were close – the other option would be to do a BC 2-3 but that is for when you set this on the bigger course (the opening of the big jumpers course has a definite blind there :))Pop out 2:
I have found with most dogs that the “tunnel” verbal is a forward cue, meaning they drive straight to it rather than turn towards us, even if it means they take a jump on the way (and that is legit, because we often use a go tunnel verbal to mean ‘take the jump on the way to the tunnel’ :))That is what happened at 1:02 – you were not fully turned and saying tunnel, so she went straight. Don’t mark it with an oopsie – note the frustration barking which is a behavior we don’t want to rehearse – just keep going by sending her into the tunnel and carry on, fixing it on the next rep.
You gave her a big LEFT!on the next rep before the tunnel: nailed it!!!
You were actually a tiny bit early on the rotation for 4 at 1:26, but great job supporting her to get it done nicely! And nice wrap to the left at the end – you can add more challenge by wrapping to the right on that 5 jump!
Pop out 3 needed a little more momentum 1-2 on the first rep – start further back to get the layering and don’t say ‘tunnel’ til you know she is locked onto jump 2.
1:46 was great!
It is possible the off course jump was a little close there, but also you can try a wrap verbal instead of a left to get the turn. Left is the soft turn I believe, so she was correct 2:04 to not wrap when you gave her the left verbal.The handling at 2:12 totally helped – nice rotation and position to show the tunnel entry! And you had even better position nat 2:24 to get it, which allowed you to get her on your right for the next line. The pushes were late : she got the first one but was waiting for info, then the FC on the 2nd one was as she was over the bar (2 bars down) and she ended up off course because it is hard to get the FC done in time…. I think you have the skills to totally do this as a blind cross! As soon as you see her turn her head to the push at 6, do the blind and head for the tunnel (big connection needed!)
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
>>I will put her to 20 for training. Do you think she would still be able to compete at 24 if I do that?
Yes, she can still compete successfully at 24. And you can also choose to compete her at 20, for a longer career. 24 is a brutal jump height!
>> I’ve been told that if she practices at 20 she will become lazy about keeping her feet up?>>
That’s BS, there is nothing lazy about this dog. 20″ will be better on her body, keeping her more sound. And with conditioning and sometimes running at 24″, she will be able to adjust beautifully to it.
>>When you said to stay near the backside wing to avoid the tunnel, do you mean the one closest to the next jump? Or the following obstacle? I wasn’t sure how to handle that part.>>
Both! The easiest way to not migrate over to the tunnel is to figure out the best perfect line you would want her to run as she exits the turn – then you handle literally on that line, going from jump to jump and NOT backing up towards the tunnel (those tunnels have giant magnets in them LOL!!)
Tracy
Good morning and welcome!
You are not that late – we have til late August til get it all done 🙂 I am glad you are here!!!
>>With Emmie, I’m really needing to focus on coursework with contacts. I’m struggling with her dogwalk. She very much knows the criteria but she is not confident going over the top (especially with tunnels underneath) so it messes up her striding. I’ve worked A LOT on different things to try to make her more comfortable but I’m kind of at a loss right now how to help her.>>
Ah yes, I feel that pain too. And there are 53 tunnels under every contact nowadays too!!! The first set of courses don’t have tunnels under contacts, so the is a good confidence booster. The next set coming next week do have tunnels under the DW. You can use her DW mat in the course work or whatever you used to teach the skill, and break things down and back chain. We will get it sorted out!
And of course, it will be great to see Kippy 🙂 Have fun!
TracyGood morning!
Wow, look at him doing grown up stuff in class!
The first threadle wrap looked good! The 2nd threadle looked like a threadle wrap to me for a moment based on the decel and the low arms… for the threadle slice, you can be more upright and use your arms higher, swinging the the dog side arm back more to rotate the upper body more – that will bring him in to the gap nicely – and then keep moving like you did at :56, that was great!
The rest looked really lovely – you are connected and moving all the lines really well, and he is reading the lines and that lovely blind really well too! Baby dog is growing up!!!!At home:
>>This boy needs the sounds and energy of dogs running agility to get himself fired up, just me and him – yawn – having Cody out helps a bit.>>
I see what you mean! You can do a couple of things to help get the same speed you get a class: you can lower the bars to 12 inches, so he can run really fast 🙂 And, does he bark or spin on cue? Those are both great for raising the arousal level and getting him pumped up. Tugging can do this too, but I find barks and spins more effective 🙂
I think if he is watching Cody, he should be tethered or in a crate so he can get excited but not chase (we don’t want him thinking it is a stimulating thing to chase dogs on course) or get in Cody’s way. Cody seemed offended when that happened 🙂
On the sequence – you made it a little harder but doing the threadle between 2 and 3 – you can do the natural lines there, to get the speed so when you add the distraction obstacles, he is flying. If you don’t have room to add a tunnel, you can add a jump as the distraction obstacle there and it will work just as well!
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning!
Leaving for France? That is so amazing!!! I am so excited for you all – please post lots of photos!!
After reading your post, I thought there were going to be a lot of issues with the course here, but there were really just a few spots to smooth out. And tons of great spots!
I think part of this is a canine education thing, to teach her that these skills exist and where to use them.
Opening:
This is a simple line but it is a HUGE line and there are all sorts of nearby obstacles that she has to pass… so it is actually really hard. You mentioned ‘obstacle overload’ and that is a great description: so many visuals and it is hard to ‘see’ the correct one.The dog walk to tunnel – definitely a skill to work on! You can try a go verbal from the DW so she continues straight? Breaking it down (like at 1:11) was GREAT and she got it beautifully at 1:59 and after that!
She has an amazing teeter! Your running line was good and the layering was good, but release maybe 2 steps later so she sees the weaves and not you on the landing of the jump when you release (:24). :55 and 1:20 and 2:01 were a step later and definitely better (but she still curled in towards the jump a little), plus she was beginning to realize that she should stay on her line and not drive to you. Even without the layering, you can release when you are another step or two past the jump so there is no visual draw to it.
You can also release with an obstacle cue rather than a release (the obstacle cue is also a release). The normal release might cue too much focus on you and the obstacle cue can help keep her focusing forward.
The 8-9-10 section was hard in terms of finding the tunnel – I think this is linked to the tunnel after the DW, in that she needs more value for the drive to tunnels on the line way ahead of you. So you can isolate those sections and for a couple of weeks, throw a reward at the exit of every ‘go tunnel’ line to pump up the value.
11-12 was really nice and 12-13 was AMAZING. And perfect again at 2:18, even with that tunnel right there!
That set up nice handling lines on the 14-15-16 section.She had trouble at 16, because you were facing forward for a bit too long (which limits the info). Try to leave 16 sooner so she can make the turn soon – maybe a spin instead of a post turn because the spin will face your feet to the a-frame and that gives much earlier info. You were facing forward for too long (she was lifting off when you started to move at 1:39 and 2:24) and that resulted in a bar down both times there.
That ending line is indeed a doozy 🙂
>>My course I think is maybe a tiny squished here too, which makes it incredibly hard>>
I think it is just a really hard line no matter how you set it!
The shoulder turns were not quite enough, so other options include a brake arm (opposite arm) to help turn her as you hustle through that line, or layering that 9/15 jump to get the line. It looked like you had a brake arm going at 2:35 (a little hard to see) but you released it a shade early so she went back on the line to the tunnel. On the run the following day, you had a shoulder pull and she totally read it as a pull-then-send into the tunnel (3:57). Now, we know she is not a naughty tunnel sucker LOL so if she is going in that tunnel, she is legit reading the cue for it.
After the rear cross at the end, especially since you are coming in off a rear cross – I think a “jump” verbal is more helpful than a GO verbal. The Go can apply to either the tunnel or jump and the tunnel is the first thing she sees 🙂 On the run on the 2nd day, you can see her spinning on the “go” verbal as if asking “which one? Which one?” You started to use a jump verbal towards the end of the first day session, and also got a little further ahead, both of which really helped.
The blind cross there would be FABULOUS but I think the only way to get there would be to do the big layering. The RC on that line is a great skill – rear crossing into a jump/tunnel discrimination? YES! Really hard 🙂 Try it with jump verbals instead of go verbals and see how she does!
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
Tracy
