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Hi!
>>I’m starting to think a quieter “jump” with a louder “tunnel” verbal helps her.
Yes! It helps the dogs differentiate because they are getting more info than just a word – they are getting different pitch and value info as well.
On the video:
>>Also I was waaaaayyyyy to pointy.>>
Yes LOL! You would have totally spilled your water 🙂
When you point high and ahead of her, it changes your body language and she has to choose physical or verbal cue, because they don’t match up.For example, at :13, th really high arm turned your shoulders to the backside line of the jump and that is where she went. So she was prioritizing motion over verbals (motion won, she was correct) in this case.
On the next rep at :15, your arm was lower and raised later, so your shoulders supported the tunnel verbal and she got the tunnel. Yay!
So another way to look at it is to think of saying the verbals to her, rather than to the obstacle. That will keep your hands lower and also help turn your shoulders to the line you want.
When you were not looking at her, she had big questions about going to the jump or tunnel. But on the last 2 reps, you had more direct connection and lower arms – she nailed it!
I think telling the verbals directly will her will also help solve the extra-pointy moments LOL!! And you can keep moving on these too, no need to be as stationary when you add the next positions.
Great job! Let me know what you think!
TracySounds like a great trial weekend! The bar was probably just an anomaly. Fast dogs will sometimes jut drop a bar, no worries. I am glad Audie had a great time too!!
T
Hi!
>>I have a question about start lines & I’d love your opinion on this. Do I need to use a sit? Do you have a verbal like “Wait”? Excellent question! My main goal is that you and Bazinga start as a team and are not stressed or fighting with each other 🙂
The position does NOT have to be a sit, in fact it is fine to let the dog choose the position. For my Contraband, I go to the line, take the leash off, say stay, and he chooses either a sit or a stand, and I lead out. For my others, I cue a sit (it is there preferred position) and say stay (although I think that is more for me than for them haha!).
>>Frankie has some fears (I think she is afraid of big dogs) that we have been working on and they really manifest at the start line. When it gets bad, she shuts down, so I recently stopped putting her in a sit (I gave up on the start line stay all together for a while until she got some confidence back). It really seemed to help to let her stand at the start. I’m not releasing from far away with F (just a few steps) but it is working for her. >>
I think you are making good choices for Frankie! You are recognizing that the situation is really hard and she is worried, so you are setting her up for success! You can also teach her a behind-the-back start where she slingshots behind you at a run – SUPER FUN! I have video of that somewhere if you want to see it.
>>Bazinga is a different personality, but I want to create a routine that works for her. I’m looking for good ideas on how to give her a great start-line experience. Some routine just for her. >>
Think of it as more of a toolbox than a routine. Routines can be too “locked in” which creates stress when things don’t go according to plan or something unexpected happens. But a toolbox can give you all sorts of fun thing you can use.
>I know some people play with their dogs, some people set the dogs up between their legs… just looking for ideas! >>
I suggest playing with all of these, trying different things and teaching her all of these tools… then you and Bazinga will find what fits comfortably as a team and use that. There is no way to know at this stage what will work best, so for now the goal is to make it all super fun 🙂
Some dogs love the play on the way to the start line, some HATE it. Some love to line up between the legs, some hate it LOL! The dogs tell us 🙂 I am running 4 dogs right now: 2 are very serious on the line and don’t want any play or tricks. And 2 do want the tricks to help them focus. The dogs “told” me when I tried different thinks and noted their responses.
>>I’m afraid my hyper-focus on supporting Frankie is making me blind to the possibilities.>>
That is relatable, and it is great that you are thinking about how to support your girlies on the start line!
The decel is going well! She is doing the parallel path extension with no problem 🙂 On the decals, you were moving into position so the decel ws a little late on some (like 1:15) so be stationary in position when you release for now, so she can really get her collection going.
It was fun to see the get out game! We build this up in MaxPup 2 so it is good to refresh it. She was a very good girl!! On the ‘break’ reps where you didn’t cue the get out, she kinda thought about going to the prop on the first one but was pretty darned perfect on the rest. She started watching you more towards the end on the get out, because the she could see the cookie throws. You can throw sooner on the get out reps (mark with a get it or find it and throw before she arrives at the prop, so she looks at you less :))
Great job here!!!
TracyHi! Mother Nature is being a pain!!
We have til March 14th, unless the weather goes wild then we can always extend it 🙂
Thanks for joining the chat today!!
T
Hi!
>>My timing has gotten worse, so is my handling. Ughhhh
Disagree!!! I think there are 2 small details otherwise it looked really good!!
On the first game – keep moving more for now ,slowly facing the direction you want her to go. You were stopping with rotated feet and the rotation when you stopped was confusing her (a little zig zag at :12 and the jump instead of the tunnel at :23) The verbals are not quite overriding rotation yet, but that is fine for now – she was great when you didn’t turn your feet.
On the 2nd part – the first 2 reps looked great, just remember to use your verbals when doing the blind too, don’t go silent 🙂
She didn’t get the first threadle at 1:00 – she didn’t know she was turning on the first jump til way late. You were earlier at 1:07 but being too early will tart to confuse her about whether or not the threadle is on that first jump or on the 2nd jump. So you can put a turn cue on the first jump – when she exits the wing wrap, you can cue the next jump with a collection cue or a name call to get her to start turning, then add the threadle. The timing at 1:00 would have been fine is she knew she was turning on that first jump.
The tunnel to jump threadle was great at the end!!
Great job! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi! This looked really good and I see what you mean about not being able to get between. the obstacles – he has a huge stride!!!
You can release sooner on these for sure to add the motion he would be seeing if you started from the wing. Also, use position cues to help him out: if you want the jump, lead out or run to within an arm’s length of it (and nowhere near the tunnel :)) On the jump cues here, you were standing right next to the tunnel which makes showing the line to the jump a little harder (and draws his focus to the tunnel). Since you are ahead of him, you don’t need to give him any extra room because you are moving and won’t be in his way at all – that will give him a better visual to find the jump.
Great job!!
TracyHi!
>>I had to do three separate videos to capture our efforts to succeed. This first video demonstrates that Forrest clearly knows the TUNNEL command. It also clearly demonstrates how my body is NOT supporting the OVER command and once again, I see me relying on my arm. Videos are great teachers, aren’t they?>>
Yes, videos are amazing because what we feel or remember in the moment is often different than what actually happened 🙂 One important thing – Good job rewarding even when it was not perfect. These are really hard games!
Looking at the first video – you were facing forward which is fine, almost as if you were going to serpentine the jump – so what he is telling us here is that “over” is a forward cue (to keep running on the line) and Here is not a valuable word to him (he didn’t respond to it without supporting body language) Try his name! Or a ‘right’ directional. Those might help!
>>So here is the second video where I thought I was using my body more to support the OVER command and I guess I was sortof but still got that arm out.
On the 2nd video – the shoulder turn TOTALLY helped him know the difference! That is great! Physical cues are important!! So yes, keep supporting him with physical cues as the verbals get solidified.
>>The hardest part of this handling challenge was getting me between the tunnel and the jump where the wrap was located to the LEFT of the jump. I can easily get Forrest over the two jumps correctly IF I stay on the outside (pulling him over jump 2 with a gorgeous slice). But I simply was unable to get myself into position using the wing…so I didn’t. I abandoned that and put Forrest in a SIT/STAY and placed myself where I need to be. This probably just practice ignoring the tunnel and doing a nice slice…but I’m OK with that.>>
Do you mean trying to run in and do a blind cross or front cross? Using a stay was perfectly fine to get that 🙂 and you can also send away to the wing from as far as possible. But with the stay, you can also add motion – instead of leading out to position, you can release before you get there so you are running into it like you would be on course. And I agree – practicing ignoring the tunnel is a critical and useful skill!
>>We entered our first ever UKI Sweepstakes trial this weekend and we ran it NFC (mostly to dial down my anxiety and to focus on having fun). Forrest did GREAT til we got to the last four jumps lined up for a dog with a great GO commend! Forrest did three of the four perfectly but since MOM was lagging behind, he turned before the last jump to look for me…losing a few precious seconds of time. >>
Yay for UKI! And yes, those huge long lines are SO HARD! In UKI, you can have a ‘helper’ come in the ring on those NFC runs – so when I was training the big GO GO GO lines at the end of a course, I asked a friend to sneak into the ring with a ball and when I was running that last line and the dog was driving ahead, she would throw it to reward him for looking ahead (and not back at my slow self LOL!!) It really helped! Helpers and thrown balls are legal in UKI 🙂
Great job here!!! I see you put the 3rd video in the next thread, I will go there next.
TracyHi!
>>Do you know when the Flyball Invitational will be aired!? I love WEC! Any time we trial anywhere in Ocala we take a trip there with the dogs & have dinner.>>
I don’t know when it will be aired, but I will definitely share the date/time. And WEC is so cool! I still have about 6 pounds of leftover brisket nachos from the Yellow Pony last night – SO YUMMY!
Bummer about the video not working with the verbals game!
I think she is getting the idea that she needs to process the verbals, even if the processing is not perfect yet. Yay!>>because I’m not sure what to try next.>>
Revisit it with you standing – that is where she seems to have the most success, and then eventually you can go to sitting in a chair.
>>She was funny in this session, when she took the jump incorrectly and didn’t hear the MM beep, she detoured into the exit end of the tunnel, like “I got it!” So I think she is understanding that it is 1 or the other but not associating the verbals?>>
That is a very good thing – instead of being frustrated or deflated, she is attempting to solve the puzzle. Super! I think it is brilliant! Reset cookies can affirm that solving the puzzle is worthwhile, and the MM can reward correct choices.
>>Calm Your Hands with a Drink! I did it. It REALLY made me change the way I was running/moving>>
OMG this is so fun! And it is hot in Florida, so a cold drink should be rewarding for you! Congrats on NOT spilling the water! Also – Note how you never got the wrong end of the tunnel here! I think the hardest part was when you had to do a spin on the wing and move the bottle to the other hand that caused some delays LOL! And at 1:42 when you switched hand, you looked forward so she correctly read it as a blind cross to the tunnel. But then you nailed it on the next rep!
I think the whole running with the drink felt different and weird because it makes us humans have to prioritize connection and running smoothly, instead of going fast and pointing at stuff 🙂You can also try this with an ice cream cone – vanilla ice cream, so if you drop it then she can eat it LOL!
Great job here!!!
Tracy
ha! Well I would totally be the one obsessing, so I can relate to anyone else who might also be obsessing LOL!
Good morning!
Connection on the wing wraps looked great!! Distance was great too, she was happy to commit and drive back around, nice and tight. Yay! Definitely add your verbals back in so that she knows exactly when to start 🙂Rocking horses looked fabulous! The FCs and race tracks looked great!
>>my first effort at the blind was very late. >>
Yes, it happens LOL! But your response was 100% correct: telling her she was brilliant for committing to the barrel and rewarding her.
She had BIG OPINIONS at :25 and :32 about countermotion being stooooopid. I think you did move a tiny bit too quickly or too early for this stage (as you mentioned) – so slow down for now, and we will keep gradually adding more and more speed. Everything else looked great – connection, verbals, her commitment & turns, etc. Yay!
Good timing and connection on the go tunnel game! You had really good timing on the GO before she entered the short straight tunnel, for example, and excellent hustle to show her the line to the next tunnel. Yay! I think she enjoyed it LOL!
She is also moving super fast, which is great – so with that in mind, make sure the tunnels are fully stretched so she doesn’t hard bends to navigate. The bigger tunnel here had a hard bend (you can see the tunnel moving) so you have reached the point where you will want to safety-check the tunnels after each rep. My guess is that the tunnel was not set that way, but was moved by the fast dogs hitting it 🙂
The threadles looked great too – I love that the threadle verbal is sooooo different sounding than the other verbals – really helpful!!
Great job on these!!!!!
TracyGood morning!
>>Oooo but I’ve had it drilled into my brain that I’m supposed to really do crate games from when they are little puppies. I actually don’t do that, lol, I’ve kinda considered myself lazy. >>
You are not lazy 🙂 I do reward for going into the crate, and I also do a little bit of don’t bolt out til released (especially in the car) but I don’t do formal crate games anymore. There was just too much failure and pressure on puppies.
>>So today I made sure he wasn’t going to leap out of the crate, but didn’t really ask him to do a hard wait.>>
Sounds good – I do the “don’t bolt out til I get your leash on and release you” from the car. And it is a gradual process. My 7 month old puppy lets me hold his collar while I put the leash on and that is great for now.
>>Thanks for saying that his brain is still growing and things will go up and down with him for a while. I need to hear that! >>
I will keep repeating it a lot LOL!!! The dogs LOOK adult but are definite baby dogs.
>> At trials he gets to say hi to lots of people and friendly dogs and I don’t mind. I don’t worry that he will cause him to visit jump setters in the ring. I think we’ll work out a good working relationship when the time comes.>>
I agree! By allowing him to feel happy around bar setters, etc – he will have MORE focus in the ring. The dogs that are stressed or uncomfortable are the ones that tend to “visit”.
>>Today the environment was too hard for him for the resilience game. And there was a weird thing in the corner he had to check out. And I wasn’t using as high value treats so this session told me all those things lol.>>>
That is pretty normal – weird things are WEIRD lol!!! If possible, let him investigate it for as long as he needs to until he takes himself away from it (as long as it is not dangerous to let him investigate). It looks like he was definitely able to eat the treats but not as close to the weird thing. Weird plus lower value treats plus I am sure he as tired (simply being in that environment is tiring for youngsters, plus the travel to and from the trial and the schedule change, not as much sleep as normal, etc). But he did well! So you can try for higher value treats on day 2 to offset the tired brain 🙂
Great job here! I love that you are working the resilience games at trials!
TracyGood morning!
I totally understand the working getting in the way of the training! He is doing really well 🙂
The stay in front of the tunnel is looking really good! You are getting a nice lead out and clear releases/rewards. NICE!!! You don’t need to click anymore, you can use your verbal reward marker or release to the obstacle.Threadles – This went really well!! I think you might can be closer to the jump – on the very last rep, it looks like you were one arm’s length away and that was perfect.
At the beginning with the cross arm and at the end, you were pretty rotated. Ideally we keep your feet pointing towards the exit line (the MM in this case) so eventually you will be able to run through the threadle without rotating your feet. Which arm to use is your choice – you had your cross arm going here on some reps and then one arm on the others. The one arm looked more natural for you in terms of your feet (less rotated, which will make it easier to run in the future).I personally show the dog both arm cues because even though I mostly do one-arm threadles, there are times when the cross arm totally helps.
He lost the flow a little (was thinking a lot about the MM) so moving in from the stay was an excellent decision. I think he got a little into a mode of cookie-to-MM so you can also call him and shake your threadle hand.
Great job here!! I think you can start adding a tiny bit of motion here :)
TracySo true about how it is hard to stop with the young dogs! They are willing participants LOL!! I found the real answer is to get more than one puppy, so you have so many dogs to train that you can’t do long sessions with any individual pup LOL!!!
I don’t set a timer – I usually play music and give myself one song for the session. Songs are between 2.5 and 3 minutes, so I end when the song ends 🙂
Hope you had a great the at the trial!!!
T
Good morning!
This session went went really well – lots of great work! With the snow and ice on the ground, I suggest taking out the wing wrap starts – she is slipping a lot and we want to protect her shoulders. You can start from a stay instead, until the snow/ice is gone.
Great job adding a strike a pose review, she did really well here!!! She understands the handling from what we see here, provided you are connected. The only errors were early disconnections:
Your blind at :37 was too early, so she came off the line – at :36 she was exiting the wrap and you were already disconnected to start the blind, so she was correct to NOT take the jump.
The FC on the next rep and BCs on the previous and next reps were better timing and connection!
The only other blooper was at 1:03 when you were not connected, so she only saw your back and missed the jump. The connection was MUCH better at 1:12 and the last rep too – you easily got to the threadle! So remember to watch her til you think she is locked onto the line, then you can move to the next cue.
Great job here! Stay warm!!!!
Tracy
