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Hi!
The timing of your shoulder turns are getting earlier with the left and right! And so the turns on the exits are getting better and better – super! Now that you have the turns going, make sure you accelerate on the go reps – you were moving slowly so he was confused about whether he should go straight or not.He had a question about which side of the wing after the right turn tunnel exits – he just needed better connection to his eyes and less arm forward to find the side you wanted.
Nice work!
TracyHi!
This is the tunnel exit game – good work here!
The Go rep looked good at the beginning!Left & right reps – the verbal was almost always before the tunnel (you can make it even a little sooner, when he is about 6 feet away from the entry)
To get an even better turn on the exits, let him see the shoulder turn sooner too (all before he enters) – he saw forward motion before entering so he exited straight then turned when he saw you. So, try to get the timing of the verbal and the shoulder turn to match, both happening before he goes into the tunnel.
This is what you did at 1:53 – this was the best shoulder timing and best turn of this video! Yay!
Nice work!
TracyHi!
This is the crate versus tunnel discrimination:
He had a little trouble with the crate here! Sounds like there were new distractions in the background (people, dogs barking) so going into the crate was not easy for him. The tunnel was definitely easier. Maybe the crate in that situation is uncomfortable, so he didn’t want to run into it? He did read the discrimination well, but he just was not as happy about going into the crate. My guess is the pressure of the other dogs/people made him a little tentative about being in a crate in the middle of the floor.Nice work!
TracyHi –
>> I don’t think I ever made wile e 4 on clear enoug
Because it is really hard to make 4on clear!
T
Hi!
I don’t think you are over-thinking the verbals at all! I agree with being consistent and also that the soft turn verbals will be SUPER useful on course at all levels! They are most useful when you get behind, as you found out 🙂The serps are going well! Overall, two things to consider: more upper body rotation, and getting closer to the jumps.
By closer to the jumps – ideally, you are about an arm’s length from the jumps because that totally sets he turns based on your motion, making all serps much easier. There is more pressure on the line, and some dogs don’t drive in as well, so it is good to show them the motion early in the training progression.
Looking at the videos:
First video looks good! She is reading it really well! As things get harder and you add more motion, try to open up your upper body back to her more – think of it as the center of your chest pointing to the center of the bar. This will take some rotation at the waist (not your feet, your feet were great here!) – the further ahead you are, the more you will want to turn your upper body back to the bar. Having your serp arm all the way back and looking at the landing spot of the serp jump (not at MiG’s cute face :)) will really help!
I think you felt this as you were adding more motion and the serp became jump 2 – you had more upper body rotation back to her at 1:08. And the rotation position at 1:12 was FABULOUS!
I think it might be easier for you when she is on your left than on your right – when you switched sides, the upper body rotation was not as clear (1:17 and 1:23)
Coming up the line after the tunnel – even with the line starting relatively straight, you can add more shoulder rotation (and also get closer to the jumps, so she gets used to the pressure.
2nd video – also going really well!!!
She is reading the lines really well – really nice upper body rotation at :32 and :55!!
>>I was so far behind. Finally figured out I could blind cross the tunnel exit instead to get further ahead up the serp line.>>
Yes, the verbals totally help when you are behind. They are most helpful when we are out of position 🙂
This part of the video gave us great angles on how your upper body rotation helps her!!!
For example, when your shoulders were forward at 1:06, she was jumping at you rather than turning over the first jump.
The blind got you there sooner and you got your shoulders turned back to the jump more (1:14) so note how she was already turning while jumping (she put in the turn stride before takeoff). Super!Compare to 1:23 and 1:31 where your shoulders were facing forward, so she jumped straighter to you and had to turn after landing (you can see her kick up the dirt when she is turning after landing at 1:23 :))
You can see it more clearly in slow motion, because she goes really fast all the time LOL!!! So definitely keep your shoulders turned all the way back to face the jump but keep your feet running forward like you did on these videos.
>>Also noticed some of my tunnel exit turn cues were late – oof!>>
No worries, you were really focusing on the serps! The wider turns on the tunnel exits made things spicy 🙂
Great job here!
TracyGood morning!
The teeter work is going well, I think the target really helps her get into position! She is confused about the release though – she seems to think it is a motion release and not verbal because the fast motion is either coming simultaneously with the ‘pounce’ marker, or just before it (if you watch in slow motion it gets easier to see that).
For example, watch the section from :39 to :46 –
You gave her a food reward while you were next to her. Then you moved away. Then you stopped… then released with your toy marker and movement all at once. So on the next rep at :54, she released on motion even when you didn’t say the verbal.So to avoid confusion, clarify the verbals and make sure they are not paired with movement at all. The way to do this is to either be not moving at all, or to be moving the whole time at the same pace, with no changes of motion or hand movement coming with the marker/release.
Since we really don’t want your position standing next to the bottom of the teeter to get a lot of value, you can be in motion the whole time: walking! So as you cue her to move into target position, start walking forward slowly. And while you are walking, you can either throw a reward back to her (marker, wait a beat, then throw the cookie or toy back to her) or you can release forward to the toy on the ground (marker, let her get to the toy, then you can move faster).
This clarification is going to help her be able to hold position better as you run past, add crosses, etc.
Tunnel exits:
This is going well! In general on just about all of the reps, your verbal timing was great! You can match the physical cues to the timing of the verbal cues to get her to read the turns even better – when the physical cues didn’t match, she would exit straight and turn after the exit.So on the left & right turns at the beginning, you can keep that verbal timing but also let her see you moving away to the wing after the turn. She saw you moving straight so she went straight on the tunnel exit, waiting for more info.
When you did that with the RCs too, they went really well! The first couple were really good with the verbal and physical cue!
She had questions at :36 and :44, because she didn’t see the cue or hear the verbals before he head got into the tunnel. Compare that to :56 and 1:06 where everything happened before she entered the tunnel – NICE!!
Looking at the GO lines – She was correct on the go at 1:12 because based on her line from the wing before the tunnel (turns her to a left lead line before entering the tunnel), she went straight which took the other blue wing out of the picture – she would have had to move away from the line to get it, which is not a go 🙂
Doing it on the other side at 1:18 was a much better straight line – the early toy throw took her off the wing.You can be earlier on the RCs at 1:30 and 1:46. The verbals were good, but she was already in the tunnel when you did the physical cue so the last thing before entering was a verbal and physical cue that didn’t match – so you can see her exit the tunnel with her head up at 1:47 and turning after she exited. Try to get the physical cue matching up so she can be turning before she even exits the tunnel.
Nice work here!! Let me know what you think!
Tracy
Good morning!
>> I feel like I did better handling this time.>>
Yes! The connection and upper body was much better. I grabbed some screenshots to help you see what was clearest for her. Link is below.
On the first rep at :07, you got a bit too far ahead of her (past the serp jump) – youngsters need to see us between the uprights as they exit the previous obstacle
Your position was much better on the next reps, even as you flattened the line. And, the most helpful bit of info for her when you were between the uprights was when you rotated at the waist more (like at 1:35). If your shoulder was closed forward, she might run past the jump as if she was layering it.
One thing I notice is that her head is up while jumping these lines, looking up at you. Even with you throwing the toy, she is still looking up. Will she be able to ignore a toy on the ground (til cued)? You can leave the toy on the ground (placed where you would throw it) as you do the serp line, and then as she turns to look at the last jump, you can cue her to get it. This can help get her head lower and looking at the line more.
>> I tried to do the longer course but the ending from the far end of the tunnel to the 2 jumps was hard. I probably need to angle the blue jump again or move the jumps further apart? And use my verbal?
Yes, on the last sequence, the jump line is too ‘flat’ going after the tunnel, so you can angle the jumps more so that she sees the line better. You were connected with your arm back on these reps, but not really rotated at the waist which is why she didn’t come in to the jump. So definitely more upper body rotation will help (like at 1:35) plus verbals will definitely help! You can use her name for now, and eventually you can use left or right verbals.
Here are some screenshots – I think you will see how the rotation at the waist really helped her!
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1DszhSP8Mvi9EFVf0Zxhe8o8Y3KSrdRUPF9fW9qNgT-E/edit?usp=sharing
Great job 🙂 Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning!
>.So I have bad news about Dreamer’s tail, the end has to be amputated because one of the vertebrae is in pieces. That’s why it’s not healing. So he’s kinda out for the count and will be for a couple more weeks until he heals up.>>
Oh, that stinks 🙁 At least there is a path tp healing!!!! He really didn’t get to do any of CAMP, so let me know if you want a refund or if you want a credit towards something in the future. I am happy with whichever you decide, just let me know.
>> so I wasn’t thinking great so I just stuck with the regular stuff with Kaz.>>
Yes, between the heat and the news from the vet, it was a great idea to just do fun, easy things.
He was great with the teeter! He seemed happier to hang out at the top of it and not in such a rush to get off! Super! You can add a little more speed by adding a wing wrap before it: you send him to wrap a wing (which replaces the cookie toss) and you jog towards the teeter so he jogs up it too. Definitely have his reward already at the top, because he will be going even faster and we need something to help him stop at the top 🙂
He also did really well with the lazy game. He doesn’t seem to think that the tunnel is part of it, so a cue is needed for the tunnel (and that is fine). No problem with the cookies, and the toy brought things to a whole new level of excitement without losing the accuracy. The only question he had was at :34 when you started him on an angle then praised him, so he sliced towards you over the jump. He found the jumps perfectly for the rest! So as he is working jump and tunnel lines… don’t praise him because he thinks that means to look at you for a reward. You can use a marker like “get it” for the reward, and use obstacle or directional cues for the sequence.
Also, his toy play looked fabulous!! You have been patient with the toy play and didn’t put pressure on him – and things are coming together so nicely!
You can definitely move to the games where he finds the jump after the tunnel, which is the hardest part of him. He is ready! Check these out:
Great job here!!
Tracy
Good morning! You did a great job here!
First two reps looked good!
Think you are trying to get too much between the uprights of the serp jump – on reps 1 and 3 (:13) you were pressuring into her line to get between the uprights and that pushed her around the first jump at :13
On the 2nd rep, you just ran alongside the line – perfection!
On the 4th rep, you started with too much convergence but then stopped moving, so she came into the line
When you tighten up the jumps up, you were not converging as much. You ran a pretty straight line and she nailed it (thanks for the throw, Brad!)
Tightening the jumps more at :37 was much harder so slowing down and showing a bit serp arm/connection on the next rep and the last rep really helped her!!!! Yay!
She is going super fast, so she is still sorting out the foot work. I have a game coming for that on Wednesday 🙂 For now, you can send to the tunnel from further away, so that you can be a little ahead to show the serp handling and not having to move super fast yet, so she can organize her footwork.
Nice work!
TracyGood morning!
The circle wraps are going really well –
I think she definitely likes the movement in the reward a lot better on the circles wraps! You can try to rotate less – at 1:52, you were connected beautifully and rotating toward the wing less, and she read it beautifully!Getting the BC exit was a little tricky. You were late enough that at :46 and 1:00 she did not see the new connection until after she already saw the cue to go to the tunnel on the original side. Rotating towards the wing less will get the BC faster 1:38 was sooner and definitely 1:58 had less rotation towards the wing and a much quicker blind! Super!!!
She is a very honest dog, so if she ends up on an off course, then you can just assume it was handling showing her that – she doesn’t go anywhere that the handling isn’t showing her 🙂
One other thing I notice here iand on the other videos is that you switch the toy from hand to hand (you probably don’t even realize it is happening) – that switch happens when the handling cue should be happening so it makes the cues late. You can either run with a toy in both hands 🙂 or stick the toy in a pocket or in your waist band so you don’t switch it around and then delay the cues.
Onwards to serps!
Two jump serps look good – try to be so close to the line of serps jumps that you can reach out and touch them with your hand 🙂 The further away you are, the longer she jumps over the serp jump (jump 1 here) and then you have to converge more and push her back to t he next jump.
The FCs at the end were a little late because of the toy switching 🙂
Look at 1:03 through 1:07, for example: the toy started in your right hand. At 1:05, when she is landed from the first jump and ready for you to do the FC, you switch the toy from your right to your left hand. That delays the FC so that it doesn’t happen til she over the bar of 2 – which causes her to land wide because the info didn’t come before takeoff.I am pretty sure you didn’t even realize you were toy switching 😁 so the easiest thing to do is have it in your pocket, plus that gets her used to seeing you run with empty hands (like you would at a trial. These little handling sequences don’t need precision reinforcement, so the slight delay when getting the toy out of your pocket is fine 🙂
Tunnel and 2 jump serp on the last 2 clips: She is reading the lines well and she did a great job ignoring the distractions!!!
The serp position and motion should cue the come in over the jump after the tunnel AND the go out to the next jump, so ideally you would just run up the line with your shoulders in serp position, and she reads both. On this video, you might have been helping more than she needed by pulling her in with arm and rotation/motion away form the jump. Try to keep your upper body “frozen” in serp position as you run on the line close to he jumps, rather than rotating your shoulders out then forward – we don’t want her to rely rotation and arm movement for the serps because she will be waaaay too fast for you to want to cue all of the parts of that line.Safe travels up to PA!!! Bella Vista is really nice 🙂 and it is great that is convenient to stay there and get to visit with your mom! Definitely enter the CPE trial and play FEO – at this point in her career, it is great to focus on getting into the ring and having a great time. No need to chase Qs yet – so FEO and a lower height if they allow ti will be great!! The Q part will be easy for her when she is more experienced. I like to spend at least the first 6 months of trailing doing FEO only – the dogs will tell us when they are ready to go for it for real because they will be fully confident, find the lines perfectly, and be able to nail it without getting frustrated when I screw up LOL!!!
Great job here :)
TracyGood morning!
>>This is so hard for her without her getting BIG MAD!! I am going to have to start very small with this probably. >>
Yes – start on a short, straight tunnel and to jump start the skill, you can have the MM past the tunnel exit. Then over the course of several sessions, switch to you throwing the lotus ball like you mentioned.
>>What exactly are “tandem turn hands” supposed to look like? It feels very similar to a threadle wrap cue when I do it, but I’m not sure if that’s what I want. >>
They are very similar to the threadle wrap hands – I use both hands directed back to the dog (but shoulders pulling away). Threadle wraps are a more complex variation of tandem turns, if that helps you think about them – they are littermates LOL!!
Looking at the video:
First rep – you had a very big exciting GO TUNNEL as she was going to 2, bar down (more on that below).
The 3-4-5 section was really good, especially on that first run! On the 2nd run – you were a little late leaving at 5, so she thought she was going straight and hit the rail there – as you are showing her the threadle slice, you can decel and leave as soon as she looks at the jump. You did this at 1:17 and 1:33 and it was super!
She was a little wide and had some big opinions at 6 – to help her out, you can decelerate into 6 and stay in your initial position (near where the wing and bar meet), and try not to step back as you rotate because that widens the line (:34 had a hard landing, she was wide on the other reps)
She had some trouble with the Lin to the 9 tunnel. At :37 – the go tunnel verbal did not override the deceleration and shoulder turn, good job just finishing it out there!
Good job running into the tunnel more at 1:04 and 1:23. That really helped her. To keep building the skill, ue a marker to indicate where the reward is placed, and throw the reward anywhere but near you 🙂 Using a marker (not praise, because praise draws her to you) will help get her eyes on the line more, and throw it either way ahead of you (get it!), or all the way back to her at the tunnel exit (‘catch’) so she looks at your position less and at the line more.
At 1:40, you put in a comment in the video that the line from 9-10 should be more of an out. I think it is a go because it is a straight line. She was curling into you because she had just been rewarded near you a couple of times 🙂 so she was migrating back towards you and the most recent reward placements.
The opening of 1B went well, no problem getting the backside of 5. Yay!
Stay tight to 6 for the FC, with a little decel, same as sequence 1.She had the bar down on 7 (1:56) but she had been struggling with that bar anyway – more below on that too, but she needs a smooooooth transition coming out of a turn and accelerating into a line so she can process the jumping (I think the lead changes going out of the FC on 6 are more complex then we give the dog credit for).
Sequence 2 went well! You can definitely throw the reward long and far for the jump on the straight line after the tunnel (#4). You can also BC sooner 5-6, when she is looking at 5 but not taking off, to tighten that line a little.
Good job getting up the line for the 8-9-10 section! The blind 9-10 can be sooner in terms of the reconnection. You started it when she landed from 8, but on a line like this where your motion is supporting it so well, you can start it when the blur takes off for 8 – that gives you an extra step or two to get the reconnection, followed by the deceleration into the spin on 10. That decel starts no later than landing of 9 (which is why the BC timing is important) – you started the spin as she passed you (2:21) so she didn’t know how tight the turn was (and she vocalized her opinion there LOL!)
Seq 3:
The threadle wraps are moving along nicely! One detail to add is a little more decel and a little more shoulder pull away from the jump. That will get the turn tighter because she will get it done before takeoff (2:46 and 3:27)
You had more decel at 3:06 but other than using two hands, it looked like a threadle slice til you stepped in to the jump. So think of it as more of a turn on the flat to get the wrap and less of a turn on the jump.On the ending line – you got a little too far ahead for the tunnel rear at 2:53, you would have to run up to the jump before it, let her catch up (decel) then accelerate forward so she passes you sooner and you can set the RC.
The blind at 3:32 got it done – and yes, it is scary LOL!! The trick is to keep your arms in really tight to your ribs, don’t try to use a hand to reconnect, so the dogs can see your shoulders and eyes. The arm blocks the info a bit and slows down the quickness of the shoulder rotation.
Looking at the jumping clips:
Jumping is wicked complex in terms of processing and mechanics. Handling is part of the processing issue, because we have to show the info with enough time the dogs can process it. Plus, there is a boatload of conditioning and skill work we all need to do (but most of us don’t do enough, myself included) So she might need jump grids once a week, just to work the balance and hind end, maybe cavaletti work, etc.
>>I was trying to figure out if there is anything about my handling that is different when she jumps way too early vs much closer to the jump.>>
I think sometimes the bars come down when you get out of visual range (she definitely has a bubble of how far away you can be) or with sudden transitions to deceleration.>>She is a 16 inch jumper, but I trial and usually train at 12 because she has always had such difficulty with jumping cleanly. >>
This is SUPER smart and I wish more people would follow your lead on this.
>>She never has issues with depth perception in the house (i.e. jumping on the couch or bed even when she is running, catching treats in mid-air)>>
Those require less processing 🙂 The brain doesn’t have to split as much to take it all in then spit out a learned skill.
>>That leads to me believe it’s likely not a vision issue (although I’m certainly not a vet nor a jumping expert).>>
The only way to know if it is a physical issue is to rule it out with a vet. With all of my young dogs, I get them x-rayed early in their careers (hips, elbows, shoulders), get patellas certified, get eyes and ears checked (CERF and BAER). I am in the process of doing that with Contraband this summer (plus a heart echo but that is a whippet thing, I don’t think Shelties need it LOL!) And there are other eye exams that can be done – retinoscopy is one, I think?
My best guess based on her jumping questions is that it is a visual processing question – if you are too far away, or make a sudden shift in acceleration or verbal (like at the very beginning when you said GO TUNNEL in a really big way and she landed on the bar of 2), or there is something new in the environment (she had jangly tags on I think here, or something else was jangling) – her brain is unable to process the mechanics of jumping and that is when we see the form changes.
This is not unusual and we do see it a lot in agility – sometimes it is more obvious than other times 🙂 and it is something we also see a lot in Shelties. So she needs a power-steering style of handling – smooth, calm, within the bubble for jumping (maybe 10 feet or less), with subtle transitions – but no slamming on the brakes or hitting the accelerator hard LOL!!
This might also be why she has trouble with the massive distances on the tunnel sends, or finding the weaves from 3 miles away: the brain is trying to process your handling and find the obstacle.
The more we learn about the dog’s brain and multi-sensory integration, the more we understand just how much the dog has to do in sports like agility (and why I don’t ever punish bars anymore).
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
>>Regarding Week 3 Standard, I went back and forth in my mind about which side of #1 to go from; I agree that I made the “wrong” choice when I ran it. >>
I don’t think it was wrong, I think it is more that you and Enzo have reached the fastest lines/winning lines stage of training 🙂 With Casper, run it both ways! With Enzo, go for the fastest way 🙂
>Also, I was surprised that I had to help with jump#3 and I agree that more practice with counter motion is needed (rats – I thought we had that).>>
Yes, he is telling us for now he needs a connection shift to the landing spot on the couyntermotions. Good to know!!!
>>Not sure if I believe “layer the A-frame” will make the line “very easy” but I’ll agree it would help. >>
Easier 🙂 Maybe not very easy, but definitely gets you ahead 🙂
>>Question: What are you using for the video overlays?? There was a Dartfish tool but it was VERY expensive. Did you spring for it?>>
Oh heck no, I didn’t pay for dartfish 🙂 I use my iPad and iMovie for all of the videos and editing. So when doing the overlays on an iPad:
* Isolate the walk through and save it as a different video
* Using the green screen function in iMovie, you can drop the walkthrough right over the run for the overlay. I just slide it back and forth a little to line it up 🙂
Tracy
