Forum Replies Created
-
Posts
-
I tried to share it but FB wouldn’t let me. I will look for some other videos to share – those threadle wraps are very popular and they all use varying degrees of decel. And it is easy to see with the Europeans handlers because they run with such gigantic strides LOL!
Excellent question!!!
Basically, left or right names a turn on one obstacle so it can be used. However, the way I have taught, defined, and used the ‘switch’ cue is that it names a line and a scenario:
The dog should turn away from me, we are both going to move in the entirely opposite direction (a u-turn) and the dog should pick up a line while I layer the obstacle. It is super specific and provides more info than the left or right directionals.Let me know if that makes sense or if I need more coffee 🙂
T
Hi!
>> I am still having trouble throwing the ball timely as I have to hide it until he is released else he would fixate on the ball and do NOTHING.>>
The ball throw doesn’t need to be sooner, we don’t need a ton of precision rewarding on these particular handling games 🙂
He did really well on the first video here! He found the jump instead of the tunnel when cued (yay!), and easily found the tunnel when cued (super!) . You can begin the Go Tunnel cue even sooner, because that cue can name the whole line – so you can so GO TUNNEL as he exits the wing, rather than needing to say over then say tunnel.
I think his only quesiton was at :42 when he came to the correct side of the jump but didn’t take it. You were really far so he didn’t really know what line you wanted – you can totally move more now, to get close to the jump to show him the bar (the handling games involve running :))
The 2nd video looks great too! You were very clear about the jump versus the tunnel, and you got closer to the jump after the tunnel so he took it easily. YAY!
>> Looking forward to doing the Switch Away tomorrow and try the last handling challenges also…Friday it’s going to rain and Sat and Sun we are entered in our first AKC STD and JWW trials!>>
Sounds like a good plan! Have fun at the trial and send updates 🙂
Great job here!
TracyHi!
>>Guess I had too little sleep and too much wine in Italy 😂😂😂.>>
Sounds like a perfect vacation….
The handling combos looked great – your connection and timing were lovely! She had no questions about the discriminations and her commitment looked great on all of them (my sequences and your sequences :))
Her only question was on the bar on the jmp towards the tunnel towards the end of the video. At 1:55, you yelled tunnel and pointed your arm up, down came the bar. Aha! So that was a good thing to work on! She is going to need you to be able to yell over the bar and fling your arm around, so showing it to her with a tunnel cue after it is useful! She was figuring it out by the end of the session, but definitely keep showing it to her. It looks like you raised the bar late in the session – you can raise the bar early in the session, so she is fresh and fatigue is not a factor.
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHello and welcome back! I hope you had the BEST TIME EVER!! Please post photos!
This was a good session, looks of good info from her! In a nutshell… finding the outer obstacle was hard without a little more handling.
>>Seemed like when she struggled finding tunnel it helped when I looked at tunnel(not her) and shouted directional at entrance.
On both sides, the closer obstacle was easier for her – it was not so much a matter of you connecting too much, but the differences you were feeling were more about when you took an extra step or two on the line (which might have coincided with looking ahead), she went to the outer obstacle.
When you looked at her a lot and didn’t take the extra step, you ended up turning your shoulders to the inner obstacle so that is what she took.
Looking ahead helped her find the further obstacle because of the body motion. So the connection is less important than the motion,
So for a plan of action – we don’t want to use toooo much handling help so she can respond to the verbals more. When you revisit this, start in position one and say the verbals then give a tiny step to the obstacle (and keep moving). Then we can fade out the extra step she needs as you gradually inch the start wing over to position 2.
No need to get to position 3 yet – the main goal is to get her happy to go to the outer obstacle without you also needing to go to it 🙂
And latent learning will kick in, making it all easier! So give her a day or two then try it again 🙂
Nice work here, glad to have you back!
TracySorry about the weather but THANK YOU for the Ripley TV!!!! He looks great! Yes, the Masters Series was hard but he did a ton of great stuff. The other runs looked amazing – he has found a new gear of speed!! And I am loving the balance of distance skills and tight handling skills. And sorry about the drop-and-roll blooper but you both recovered well 🙂 He looked like he has come a long way with the arousal management at the end of the run too!!!!
Fingers crossed for good weather ahead – all of those UKI courses had a ton of jump-tunnel discrims 🙂
TracyAre you FB friends with Lisa Frick? The most recent video she posted has a nice threadle wrap and you can see the decel.
T
Hi!
>>We also had a discussion about my codependency tendencies-i.e., wanting to help too much.
Bwahahaha we need a support group for “Codependent No More: Agility Edition”
>>>>had decel and clear upper body cues, and she nailed it. You also had good decel at 1:40 and on the last rep (good coaching, Jamie!
>>>I would like to work toward her performing a threadle wrap with less help from me so I can keep moving forward and not so much decel.>>
They all require decel to some extent, even the super fancy Europeans. I will find videos to show you what I mean.
>>haha, Jamie called me on that too and as soon as she started to say something, it hit me that I used the wrong verbal.
Ha! The dogs are so good at figuring us out 🙂
TracyHi!
>>Here is the repost of A Quick Opposite Side >>
These looked good too! He definitely still needed the one step to help commit to the proper jump but that is fine: you can get him moving around the wing, start the verbal, then give the one step of handling he needs for now all while staying in motion – no problem LOL!!! If he can hear the verbal before he sees the one step to help, it will be easier to fade the step – so start the verbal super early like you did here.
>> I agree that I DEFINITELY need to throw quicker. I know I am holding back because I am waiting for that commitment, which turns into completion because I am SO LATE.>>
Or, you can re-define commitment in the skills games: as soon as he answers the question by taking a step to the correct obstacle – reward 🙂
The handling challenges looked good!
>> in these combos posted today, I moved a bit more– but really still not as much as I probably should be.>>
On these, yes, moving a lot is good because the motion makes the side changes harder so the motion is more of a distraction. The handling games are less about the verbals and more about the handling in the discriminations. So you can run run run on these 🙂 The skills games are more about the verbals with less handling help.
The blind crosses looked great and so did the threadle slice! And so did the little mini sequence at the end! I think the hardest part for him was going back to the tunnel after a few reps of the jump.
>>. I believe the wing was too close/bad angle to the first jump, so I think that is why it kept coming down. I probably should have just moved the bar to 4″ after the first bar drop.>>
I think the setup worked well! He had a bar down at :52 – I think it was because of your position – you stepped back towards the tunnel then moved forward to the backside jump, so he couldn’t quite make the adjustment in time.
On the threadle wrap (lap turn because your feet were facing him) – you can decel more to turn him away before you indicate the jump. Try to decel then turn so you don’t end up runnig backwards (that is why he dropped the bar – running backwards presents a different line of motion). You can rotate your feet to face him like you did here (like a lap turn) or you can keep your feet facing forward and decel and use upper body only to turn him away. But decel is the key 🙂
Great job here! Fingers crossed for good weather!
TracyGood morning!
Wheeee! Fun! These looked great.
The layering to the tunnel was easy peasy! I think she liked it LOL!You entered The Death Zone on that first blind by moving between the uprights of jump 1 rather than running to jump 2. We were all concerned for your personal safety, including Roulez!
You were better on the next reps (earlier) but you mentioned feeling late – it was not that you were late with the actual blind, it was just that you were over-helping by running to the first jump then you felt the her hot breath on your heels LOL!! So send to the wing and let her find that first jump all by herself while you run to the 2nd jump.
Then the video froze on a really acrobatic leaping catch – eek! LOL!
You gave yourself more of a head start on the blind at :35, but it still looks like you were moving across jump 1 rather than just leaving her on the line to head to jump 2 (to where you can be close enough to touch jump 2 with minimal effort).
The threadle slice worked at :41 and :45 but you were actually too early with it 🙂 and that might muddy. The waters elsewhere. I think a turn cue on jump 1 will be more effective to tighten up the line – you started the threadle cue as soon as she exited the wing wrap start so theoretically it should have applied to jump 1. To keep things clear, you can use a verbal turn cue on jump 1 (a name call here because it is not a big turn) then the threadle as she is approaching/taking off for 1, so she knows the threadle applies to jump 2.
Very nice job with the go tunnel and the blind to the backside!
I agree with Jamie that you were in her landing space at :55 when she took the bar, with your shoulders closed forward and throwing the toy. The same thing happened at 1:24. So you can be in that space as long as you have “serp” shoulders facing the bar (strike a pose, grown up dog edition :)) to cue the turns and don’t throw the toy til she lands.The first threadle wrap had a little too much forward motion so she read it as a threadle slice. On the 2nd threadle wrap, you called her name at jump 1 (note how well she turned!) and then you had decel and clear upper body cues, and she nailed it. You also had good decel at 1:40 and on the last rep (good coaching, Jamie!) so she read it great! She back-jumped on the last rep but that was presented by your line of motion and you said go, so she was being a good girl. The exit of the threadle wrap would be more towards the start wing.
The mini sequence looked great too! I think you were using your backside push verbal, but you were standing in the threadle position so the threadle slice cue might make more sense (unless I am mis-hearing your verbals).
Great job here! Excellent connection and hustle throughout!!!!!
Tracy
Hi!
>>I’ll admit, I just used the field guide and didn’t watch the video until after so it’s not fully done as prescribed and I missed a step or three but strong work here!>>
Well it is a good experiment to see if the field guides are clear or not LOL! In theory, as long as the handle understands the goals, the field guide should be all we need LOL!
He was good boy here! So many challenges: pool, barking friends, not a lot of handler motion (because this is a not a running game, you wee good!). He rocked it!
Sending to the tunnel was great with the layering. The blind to threadle looked strong. Blind to backside looked great too – you can be slower to the backside line so you don’t need to push back as much.You were late on the threadle slice cue but he was like “I got you” and did t he threadle. YAY!
The threadle wrap cue might be a little underdeveloped (it is a relatively low priority) so breaking it down was great and he nailed it at the end!!!!!
On both the threadle slice and the threadle wrap, I suggest adding a turn cue to the jump after the wing wrap part, so he is already turning when you cue the threadles. In this situation, a name call is probably all he needs, so that he can turn. That will tighten up the line of entry to the threadles (he was landing wide then coming back to get the threadle here).
And then ending with the super fun tunnel send on the mini sequence was perfect.
So I guess you don’t need to watch the videos LOL!! The only “error” was that you can be on the takeoff side of the backside to threadle on the last mini sequence, rather than move into between the jump and tunnel to push to it (but that worked well too, so it is not an error).
Did he get a well-earned swim swim after this fabulous session? Great job!!!
Tracy
Good morning!
>>Me films a working segment and thinks I’ll edit and post later… and then forgets>>
Relatable. You’ve been busying getting married and all! That is a pretty darned good excuse to not edit videos LOL!!!
>>I left some transition footage. We were having a lot of victory lapping and frustration over toy exchange. I’ve switched to using two frisbees to see if that helps some. Like your idea at the seminar, I may just let him hold it if he doesn’t want to drop but he did good here.>>
You know I love transition footage!!!!
After the seminar where we just let the dog carry his toy and all the frustration vanished, I was talking to the neuroscientist/dvm/goddess about it and she gave me the neurobiological reason why it worked (it has to do with object enhancement and how the brain prioritizes things). So it turns out my “F*ck it, let’s just let him carry the damn thing” was soundly based in science LOL! By letting the dog hold it, we immediately deprioritized the toy and got the dog (and handler) thinking about the obstacles rather than fighting with each other about a toy 🙂
So yes – if he can’t let go of the toy, fine, he can carry it (maybe use a smaller frisbee so it doesn’t smack the tunnel by accident) but definitely don’t fight about it or try too hard to get it back, because it shifts the attention to things that neither of you want to focus on.
On the video –
First rep looked strong, the side-step at :15 is what pulled him off of the wing (he had not yet really looked to it and you moved sideways) but his response to the blooper was great: what do you want here, mom? Rather than checking out or tooth hugs or launching for the frisbee.2nd rep – super nice – I think the a-frame behind the wing was a big visual and he considered it at one point!
3rd rep – super nice, he stayed connected and nailed it even when you looked like you had a momentary change of plans LOL! And he brought the frizzy right back.
4th rep was really good too – that jump angle is definitely a threadle (which is how you handled it) and I think he was getting hotter because he was going a little wider on the wing.
Last rep looked good too! He did a great job responding to all the cues and you were clear in the handling.
>>We were having a lot of victory lapping and frustration over toy exchange.>>
I guess I was expecting to see that in this video, and I didn’t see it here (or maybe I need more coffee??) He brought the frisbees back pretty quickly, let go pretty quickly and stuck around while you got ready for the next rep. Le the know if I missed something but the transitions here looked good!! And he ignored a frisbee on the ground and ignored the leash on the ground.
Great job here!!
TracyGood morning!
>>However, I find that my shoulders and or feet tell him more than my verbals are. Should I be more stationary in these exercises? >>
Definitely add motion, because he needs to process these verbals when you are moving. Standing still is cool as a trick 🙂 but not super useful when running a course LOL!!!
The key here is to be moving but not really handling, if that makes sense. What I mean by that is you are generally moving on the same line of motion on both of these (slowly at first) and using the different verbals.
So on the first video, you were meandering on a line parallel-ish to your deck, no real handling help on the first couple of reps and he did great! On the 3rd rep, I think the transition into the rep was too quick – you were playing and talking then suddenly you were giving cues. So like a good boy, he didn’t wait to process, he did THE FAST THING which was not correct lol
O after each reward, take a moment to reset, get quiet like you did on the next rep, then give the cues.You stopped moving on the next reps so he got out towards the tunnel but then second-guessed himself because there was no motion (which is indeed a turn cue, good boy). So keep meandering on the line you had on the first couple of reps. And you can put a line on the ground to help you stay super consistent in terns if your line of motion without actually handling.
2nd video had a little more movement which is great! You were giving him a little step towards the tunnel when you wanted it and a little more shoulder turn when you wanted the jump, which definitely falls into the ‘help as much as needed and as little as possible” realm 🙂 So on the next session(s) you can fade the little help steps and then you can add more of the same motion of you walking on a parallel line.
3rd position video also looked really good!! You stayed on the outside wing of the jump the whole time – so now you can add moving past the jump on both the jump and tunnel cue. The difference in physical cues you can use to help him would be to maybe take one step and keep your shoulders open to him for the tunnel til he definitely commits, and turn your shoulders a little more for the jump – but your line of motion can be the same for both, passing the outer wing of the jump.
>>A Quick Opposite Side
I am getting an error message on this video, can you repost? Thanks!
The Wing near tunnel video is going well too – you can use the same motion concepts here too in terms of keep gin your shoulders more open to the outer obstacle but staying in (slow) motion on both cues. Your verbals sounded nicely different too! And great job with the reset reward when something went wrong.
And since finding the jump is harder than the tunnel here, you can reward sooner. The instant he looks at the jump or take a half step towards it… you can affirm his choice by throwing the reward (no need to wait til he takes the jump, because affirming the early decisions will help get more commitment). For example on the last rep, you were really far away (yay!) so he started to go but then had a question – you can throw as soon as you see him starting to go to the jump.
>>o really try to get my OWN verbals down pat! It’s so hard and I’m just standing there!>>
Yes! Totally agree that it is hard! People ask em all the time how to get good with verbals and my answer is to rehearse, rehearse, rehearse, just like you did here 🙂
Great job! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning! You have had some crazy weather!!!
>>Would it work equally well to use left and right coming out of the tunnel for these exercises?
Good question! I suppose it would… but I use switch as a compound line cue to indicate that there will be a complete change of direction for both of us (usually heading back the way we came) followed by layering. I guess it indicates super independence on the next line with more detail than left/right would (those don’t indicate more than just a turn).
Kind if like “Go Tunnel” means ‘stay on the line to find the tunnel at the end’, ‘switch’ can name an entire line too.
Here are a couple of videos to look at. One is taken from MaxPup, which is basically tandem turn foundations 🙂 And the 2nd one is putting it into context. Let me know what you think!
