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Good morning!
>>So last week I video tapped a zig zag and thought he seemed off. That was the 3rd time that thought had crossed my head so I took some time off.
That is interesting! Do you have the video? I would love to see it: sometimes there is something “off”, or sometimes the dogs just don’t get it at first and we need to help them with bigger handling cues or a bit of the wire like you did. I used HUGE handling cues to get my dogs to understand it at first, including some foot rotation.
>> I am keeping an eye on him still and he has a massage tomorrow so I will ask her to feel around.>>
Perfect – ask the massage person to take a look at his left hind and see what she feels or how he reacts. I suggest that because he was protecting it a bit – note how he rolled onto it at :26 and was also to a lesser extent at :59. So there might be something that is ouchy?
I think the stay was the hardest part for him LOL! But in this session, he did well sorting out the game. He might have so much value on wrapping wings tha he needed a couple of sessions to sort out what he was supposed to come to your hand. Feel free to use BIG gestures LOL!!! Don’t be subtle 🙂
>>I don’t think I chose the best angle to see his lead changes. Also still not sure he is using his leads correctly.
The angle was good! When the wings are really far apart, it is harder to see his adjustments but when you moved them closer, he was doing a good job of shifting back and forth. If you move them even closer, 4 or 5 feet apart, you will see things even more clearly 🙂
One thing that will help: if the massage person finds nothing ouchy today, you can help him get organized by having him use his sit platform for the stay! That way he will hold his hind end in tight rather than roll on a hip. But wait to see what your massage person says before we do more – definitely keep me posted!!
Nice work here!
TracyGood morning!
This is looking really good! I think the hardest part for him was holding the stay LOL! You did a great job with the setup next to the wing and he was strong with the lead changes without the bar, and with the jumping when the bar went in.
Since this looked so good, yes – move to the next steps:
– yes, onwards to the 2 jump game! Since he is young and big, start with the bars at 8 inches so he doesn’t have to think too hard about the height and can focus on all the other pieces. Be sure to have a reward target on the ground so he doesn’t look up at your hands 🙂– as an added challenge, you can also try this flatwork game without a bar, but with the wings 4 feet apart then 3 feet apart. That will add an element of “fast feet” for him, which is always good as we add more speed to all of it 🙂
Great job! Have fun with the next steps!
TracyGood morning! This looks really good! Even Dr. Cat seemed to give his approval.
Watching the tiny details, she was tending to move her right hind out a little, so that is something to keep an eye on so we can get it strengthened and balanced. It is a really tiny difference. Definitely keep rewarding, but it is possible that the right hind is not as strong as the left hind (which only moved out once). She did well with the various angles, and with more speed. Yay! You can move to NOT rewarding in position: she gets up, sits, you toss the reward off the plank with a ‘get it’ marker (to one of the angles), lather, rinse, repeat a few times 🙂 That adds even more of a plyometric element to it.
She is ready to see the plank work with the wing and jump – you can drag it to class with you, as a warm up tool even fi you don’t get it to the wing (but you can also do it on the wing if there is a warm up jump). Just a couple of reps to warm up, otherwise we risk depleting her for her class runs.
Great job! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning!
I am glad he had a successful weekend, especially with lots of birds and no holes 🙂 Yay!Lead with the Head is looking good!! Great job with your mechanics and rewarding. This is a good one to keep in your training rotation: he is a powerful, forward dog so the more you reward him to turn his head, the more it will happily blend into his turn skills. You can revisit this came once a week or as a warm up for other sessions – the next time you play, you can back up a bit more so you are 5 or 6 feet from the wing. Cue the wraps like you did, and you can even use as clicker to mark the instant of head turning (which should be easier to see when you are further away and he has to make a very distinct turn back to the wing). Starting further away will also allow you to add more speed into the skill, and mark that very first head turn on approach to the wing.
He was fantastic with the short spacing on the zig zag flatwork wings! 4 feet? No problem. 3 feet? Also no problem. SUPER! Quick feet!
>>A few times he was really looking straight ahead instead of at me, yet he still serped the wings.>>
Yes, he was a good boy! The only thing to add to this game (and the others) is to try not to use a ‘yes’ marker because it causes him to look up at you, which we don’t want in the jumping work. Instead, you can replace it with a ‘get it’ marker to drive to the thrown (or placed) reward. I try to use a get it for these things, even though a ‘yes!’ slips out sometimes LOL!
Zig zags with bars also went really well! He read the line well and that is the most important step. So now, you can make two adjustments to add power:
– line him up parallel to the wing and bar of the first jump, rather than facing the center of the bar of jump 1. So when he is on your left in this setup, for example, his left shoulder will be right next to the wing (and his front feet still relatively close to the bar). This adds the element of powering to the side for these slice jump efforts (on the last rep of the video, he was really getting it and also didn’t tick the bar on that one :))
– add a reward target on the ground, about 10 feet past the 2nd jump. He was looking up a bit at your hand (because, cookies are delicious LOL!). The target on the ground will help lower his head which produces more power in the jumping. At first, you can start with a stationary reward – a bowl of food, or Manners Minder if you have one. Then a stationary toy (something big so he can just scoop it up). If he is still organized with the toy… then we will add the moving target. This might happen all in one session, or in a couple of sessions: let his form guide you as to how quickly you can add challenge 🙂
>>but on the video I hear his nails ticking the bar.
I slowed the video down to try to figure out which foot was ticking, and I believe it was his inside hind leg (right rear on your left, left rear on your right). So because it was not front feet or not the same foot every time, it is an organization/balance/power question and he will figure it out 🙂 He was already figuring it out on the last rep.
You can also try this on a 5 foot bar so he has a little more room – it is possible that he was dropping the inside rear because the 4 foot bars didn’t give enough room in this grid. Figuring out the correct distance on this grid needs some experimenting – since he is big and powerful, he might need a 5 foot distance.
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
It was a smart idea to begin with some bounce grid reminder work for her! The 3 jump grid you had set up was a bit too small for her current size. The distances between the jumps were more of a cavaletti (trot) distance for her, so you can expand this grid to have a minimum of 4 feet between the jumps, with bars no higher than 8 inches. You will see her really begin to bounce and then you might need to expand to 4.5 feet or 5 feet as she gets more powerful.
I think she is off to a good start in the zig zag reps her – it looks like she went around the 2nd jump on the first rep because of the pressure of you standing in her landing spot. She is able to bounce the distance you had here, which is great! As the angles get flatter, you might find that you need to overlap the wings more to shorten the distance between the jumps a little.
The most important tweak, though, for both the regular bounce grid and the zig zag grid will be to get the reward on the ground and not in your hand, so she is driving forward with her head down. The reward in your hand was pulling her head up, which inverts the jumping form.
So, start with a stationary reward target like a Manners Minder placed 10 feet or so past the 2nd jump. You will lead out to it and stand still, clicking it after you release her and when she is jumping the 1st jump (yes, the first jump, to try to convince her to look down and not up :)) Do that do a few reps, and if she is driving to the reward, you can delay the MM click until she is jumping the 2nd jump.
At some point we will also be going to the moving target, but that will be after she has experience powering through to the stationary target.
Nice work here! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning!
His pounce on the lotus ball was adorable on the first rep! When it was really moving, he was good about not moving properly and not pouncing, especially when you used it on the jump.Since it went so well, you can add it to the zig zags with the 2 jumps! The zig zags are complicated from the dog’s perspective, so use an 8 inch bars as he learns to sort himself out 🙂 And since he has a long stride, lead out 10 feet past the 2nd jump and start to move as soon as you release.
>>Consistent desire for toy play is something I definitely need to build with this boy. Some days he’s a tugging fool and then the next day it’s hell no. I don’t want to do that – something I need to figure out>>
I agree that consistent interest in tugging is a helpful thing for training! Have you seen a pattern to it – will he tug at home but not in class? Will he tug when food is around? Also, will he tug more when you throw the toy or drag it for him to chase? A pattern will emerge and then you can get it figured out 🙂
Great job here! Onwards to zig zags!
TracyHi!
She is doing well on these! It is a challenging skill and se is sorting it out nicely!!! I like her head position and also that she is NOT taking any extra strides anywhere.>>She’s landing really close to the first jump and while she’s bouncing, it doesn’t seem well-centered. Does that matter?>>
Yes, and no LOL!! She is learning to power off her rear, so she might take a slightly different landing spot on jump 1 and it is fine. Also, you can change a couple of small details to help her power more:
– move her start position further back, so she shoulder is right next to the wing, more like where she was at :06 (her other starting positions were a bit too far forward).You can go to the moving target reward, so the toy will end up being further from her landing point and you will be facing forward & moving forward.
You can also overlap the wings by another 6 inches but I think we don’t need to do that yet – I bet she sorts it out as the toy starts moving and the angles flatten a bit more too 🙂
Let me know how she does in the next session! Then we can add even more challenge 🙂
Great job!
TracyOMG Pneumonia! That is definitely NOT slacking! I am glad you are feeling better!
He has figured out the line for the zig zags very nicely! Now, we need a target on the ground to get his head down that he will look at – when your arm is up, he is looking up and that inverts his jumping form. You did have a target… but he wasn’t targeting to it LOL! So either leave it open so he can just grab the treat from it, or use a toy or something he will want to drive to without looking at you. That will take his form to a whole new level 🙂
>> I tried one with me moving and he did drop the bar so we stopped.>>
As you add moving, especially the moving target, lower the bars to 6 or 8 inches so he doesn’t need to think about height at all for now. An 8 inch bar will allow him to focus on form and then we can move the bars up.
Lead with the head: This is going better than you are giving yourself credit for! Your hands are correct (sending and turning away with the same hand, reward with the other).
The one thing you can add is turning him away sooner, so your turn hand is right in front of his nose as he finishes that first wrap, then you can immediately turn him away.In this game, we also want to get his head down (that is the main focus for him: get yer head down, Alta! LOL!). He is looking up, and maybe that is why it feels weird to you. The easiest way to convince him to lower his head is to have you sitting in a chair (or on the ground, but not in the snow :)) Your hands are automatically lower when you are sitting, so he will build the habit of looking down. So try it sitting and feel free to try it with a wing instead of an upright, and see how it foes 🙂
Motion override: he did well with the frisbee – he was a little surprised at first but was able to respond. Yay! Remember that your goal is that you are moving away from him, not towards him, when you ask for the sit, so it might be easier for you to hold the frisbee while you walk forward. That way there is a good visual distraction and you won’t be tempted to turn to face him or move towards him.
Since he loves that frisbee so much… you can use it as a moving target in the zig zags! Tie it to a line and drag it on the flat at first and see how he does, then add it to the zig zags 🙂
he did well with the platform sits here – yes, this is a great platform for him and he was organizing a lot better – some really good tuck sits happening there!!!
The plank was much harder, it is narrow! he was figuring it out though, yay!
>>So much hand watching. We will work on this with the clicker and maybe treats off my body. He can’t even think. It was at the end of the session too. I might have done too much for his boy brain!>>
He looked good on the reps on the videos – were there reps where he was unable to do it? Feel free to include those 🙂 I think he is waiting for the hand cue, which is fine to start and then we fade it. This on both the platform and plank here, you can do a session or two of each while you are sitting so he realizes it is “get on the thing and sit” rather than watching your motion or hand cues as much. Yes, you can still give a verbal sit cue and a little hand cue, but it is primarily shaping. Then you can click and toss the treat for the next rep to start. At this stage, I am not concerned about where he is looking so it is fine for him to look at you hand/cookies as long as he is able to get on the thing and sit.
Great job! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
Looking at the wraps with the bar: This was a cool session! He totally got the hang of if, it was an easy concept transfer for him. Super!! I don’t know if he wraps better to his right… he certainly wraps differently! He was a little more organized into the sit on the left wraps – but then had to think harder about the push off from the sit for the first few reps but then he was really strong.
He seemed “looser” on the right turn sits – notice how he was shifting his weight onto his left hip, rolling onto it to the point where it was almost sliding off the edge of the plank LOL! So he was lifting from his front more on those rather than pushing from the rear. Why was he doing that? Could be that he was looking at your hands more, could be that he was a bit fatigued because it was the 2nd part of the session, could be he is a little looser on that side.
The next session will give us more info about that – you can make 2 adjustments:
Do the right turns first, because that will let us know if fatigue was a factor (this game is a lot more tiring than it looks!).
And, you can add a food bowl as a target as he comes around the wing, to provide a focal point so he looks at your hands less. It will be interesting to see how those tweaks change things.
Zig zags are looking REALLY strong – big improvements for sure! Good boy! He looked like the almost-flat angles were easy!
>> He does much better when he jumps to his left over the first jump. So that probably his stronger side for this exercise.>>
He did well on both here! And noting that the jumping to the left better here is good to keep track of for future conditioning and handling challenges 🙂
A couple of suggestions to build on with the 2 jumps here:
Change his start position slightly, so he is a bit further back by the wing (his shoulder will be right next to the wing) – he was center of the bar here and that doesn’t give as much room for the power slice as being right next to the wing does.You can also move the reward even further away – make it 15 feet or so from the 2nd jump – and you can add more of your motion now. You can also add the moving target at long as it doesn’t upset his belly.
At some point this week, you can also go to either the 3 jump version of this, or the 2 jump backside version (it is totally your choice!). When you move to those, open the angles back up so the line is easy to see. For the 3 jump version, use your lead out and a moving target. For the backside version, the placed target will work because you won’t be able to send to the backside AND get far enough ahead to drag the moving target 🙂 unless you have someone there to help out with it 🙂
Great job!!! Let me know how he does on the next steps.
TracyOh no! Poor Street! I am glad he is feeling better.
He is sitting so nicely now! You can really see it on the reps where he is facing the camera – lots of great foot positioning! He definitely had the flow and was beginning to understand that it would be approach, organize, release – only one moment of anticipation LOL!
When you are in the position that faces him, reward then toss a treat back to the camera so he doesn’t loop back round to get on the plank sideways. We want him to be approaching straight to add more speed and challenge to the organization like he did when you were on the ‘takeoff’ side of the wing.
If you train indoors again, you can add a bit more spice to this with toy play between each rep, or exciting tricks for cookies – then back to the organization game. By adding some arousal, we are beginning to transfer his learning to the state of mind he is likely to be in when he is running courses.
I see you have a video of it with the bar below, onwards to those videos!
Great job!
TracyGood morning! I am glad you had gorgeous weather on your birthday weekend!!
The skills are progressing very nicely 🙂
The organizers are going well in terms of hind end use. after the first rep from the wing where he was looking at your hands and almost fell off LOL! He did really well with the food bowl and also with the distraction of the moving target for the most part 🙂 You can wait to present the moving target til after he is taking off for the bar. The 4 inch bar was a good intro (“oh hey, now there is a bar”) and the 6 inch is perfect for the next steps.I think on the next steps, we can add even more flow. You were already doing the flow of: sit – release – reward. Now add on more actual handling that he would see, which is you would be rotating away before he takes off. This will rely on some serious motion override 🙂 so move slowly at first: Move forward like you did here, cue the sit, and as he sits: You release and rotate to finish the FC as if it was a ‘for real’ handling moment. He might need a food bowl target on the landing side to help him get the idea at first that he needs to take the jump.
And you can also start the slices!
The zig zags look really good! Only one suggestion:
You can lead out further before releasing him. when you are just a step or two past the 2nd jump, he ends up shortening a little – you can see it when he landed on the foot of the 2nd jump at :14 and touching the bar at :33. So, go a full 10 feet past jump 2, start dragging the toy… then release 🙂There are 2 different “next steps” you can add:
– you can stay on the front side and tighten the angles more
– you can open the angles back up the tiniest bit and go to the backsides. I know the backsides are actually step 4, but they can be done before the 3 jump game. With the US Open coming up, I’d want to take a look at these and then we can always go back to the 3 jump game when the 2 jump version is tighter (almost flat). When you do the backside, you will want to have a reward placed out front or someone else dragging it, because he is likely to catch up to you very quickly LOL!!
Also, you can do these in alternating sessions: for example, on Monday you can do the 2 jump tighter front sides. On Wednesday, you can do the slightly more open backsides. Then on Friday, back to the front sides, and so on.
Great job! Let me know how the next steps go!
TracyHi!
This was a fabulous session!
Your mechanics were spot on, from the line up to the reward to the next line up. She nailed it – great lead changes and weight shifts. When the wings were closer, she responded by being quicker without losing form – truly excellent!How close together did the wings end up? They looked to be 4 feet apart. If so, you can go down to 3 feet to really challenge her 🙂
Also, based on what she did here, she can definitely move to the next step, the 2 jump game. Have you had a chance to look at the moving target reward game? That will be useful for her as you add the jumps.
Great job! Let me know how the 2 jumps game goes 🙂
TracyOmg I love her!!!! And her wagging tail!
This was a good session! And I loved the look on her face when you wanted to take a break in the middle – she was in her good sit and didn’t want to leave LOL!!!I think this platform is a good solution – my only suggestion is to try it standing, or feeding her with your hands higher (up by the center of your chest). I suggest this because a higher head position for her will help tuck her hind end under even more. She was experimenting with where to put her feet (especially that right hind :)) and by the end she was doing a great job! A higher feeding position, so her chin is tilted upwards, should make it perfect 🥰
Great job! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning!
Looking at the zig zags – the jump setup is really good (angle is good, distance between the jumps is good, but one of the bars was too high or now, both should be at 8″), and her striding is going to be GREAT! The only adjustment is to move you and the reward much further away – the reward was so close she had to land and stop all in one motion. So, using the stationary reward – you can the reward should be a minimum of 12 feet from the second jump so she can land in extension and power out to the reward.
If she is fine with that… go to the moving target reward 🙂 She likes that and it will add even more challenge here 🙂 You would lead out about 12 feet past the 2nd jump put the toy on the ground. For the first few reps, release her and don’t move the toy. If she is organized, you can release then start dragging the toy. If that is fine and dandy? Drag the toy *then* release 🙂
Head turning is looking strong! She is happy to make the bend but she really wants to watch the cookie 🙂 I think you noticed that and your hand got lower and lower during the session which was GREAT! That brought her head down and really helped the turning. Super! So you can do this on a wing with a low hand (or sitting in a chair so you don’t have to be bent over the whole time 🙂
>>getting organized plank – I have tried to get a “sit on the plank” however, she sees it as a contact board. I have started out reminding her that the sit is valuable on the plank. after that, every time she should go into a down just as if we were training our 2o2o. how important is it that she use a plank for the second step?>>
The organizer is really important, so we can do some problem solving to help her out. Does she sit then go into the down after a reward? If so, you can cue the sit (verbal and hand signal or anything else she needs to get the sit) then you can release and throw a reward, rather than feed in position. So basically, it would be get on the board, sit, release, reward. No stay on the board because she might then offer the contact behavior.
Also, we can find something that is nothing at all like her contact board. Looking back at your step 1 video from October 15, she did well with the smaller square platform. Can you make a slightly bigger version of that? Big enough to sit easily… but still square and different than the 2o2o plank. I think a different looking organizer and releasing instead of rewarding in position will help 🙂
Let me know what you think! Great job here!
Tracy
