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Hi!
He definitely has a lot of gusto!!!! So fun!
>>Thanks for describing how to move away slowly while he “explodes” the other way LOL. I’m definitely struggling with that and not just feeling like I need to “react”.>>
Most of it is pretending that you are calm and reminding yourself to move slowly LOL!! It is not easy but definitely helps the pups see the details of what we are showing them.
T
Hi!
>>I know this just hasn’t sunk into my head clearly. Could you describe a spin again for me?>>
A spin is a FC-BC combination: The FC happens on the wing/barrel/jump (like a regular FC) and then you do a BC on the flat, which is after the dog has committed to the jump/wing/barrel. So think of it as doing a FC and moving to the next line then doing a BC. The exact timing will depend on the course – for this barrel stuff, do the FC just as he is arriving at the barrel, and the BC as he is still at the barrel.
>My second question is regarding how close I should start these combos to the cone. I know earlier you mentioned starting closer to the cone in order to help him understand and balance out the right/left turns. Is it easier to start closer to the cone?
It is easier for him to commit and for you to make clear connection when you are both closer to the cone. If you are further, he has to think more about commitment and also can’t see your connection as clearly for the exit.
>>In my head I’m thinking (for me LOL) I need room to get all of the handling changes in, but then as I think more about it…. If I start closer and there is less distance/motion does that help both of us figure all of this out?>>
yes – you need room to get all the handling in but that is causing rushing. The connection at the exit of the barrel is the most important element, so staying closer for now will help you show it and him see it 🙂
T
Good morning!
>>Nope nope nope nopety nope 🙁
Only because the mechanics were not quite correct and everything was happening too quickly – so she was correct to turn the way she did (like a FC instead of a RC) on all the reps where she did that, due to what she was when it was time to make the decision on which way to turn (it all happens really fast with whippety creatures where the brain prioritizes motion).
Think of this as a processing game, where we need to be able to show the info early enough and quickly enough that she can prioritize it and process it to produce a movement that is unnatural (turning towards where you were last is natural, turning away is not natural which is why rear crosses are so hard!)
To do that – we have to use mechanics to slow her down for now, to buy you time to show the info with motion. That is why I was soooo methodical and had my full whippety creature go slowly… so I could show his brain the priority info before he made any decisions based on the info he had.
(side note: Slowing the pup down to teach the skill will not result in a slow dog 🙂 It results in a really fast dog who can also produce amazing skills at high speed. My Contraband is pretty slooooooow in all of the demo videos in this class (I mean, MY GOD he was slow haha) but he grew up to be amazingly fast AND accurate with his turns and lines. Pointy dog brains prioritize motion in a way that other dog brains might not, so we need to prioritize getting them to see the motion we want before we add speed to the equation).
With that in mind: The goal is that you are in her field of vision on the correct side *before* she processes which way to find you. So looking at the first part of the video, for example, on most of the reps you were behind her and while you did move to your right, you were not in her field of vision on her right side – you were still in the field of vision on her left so that is how her brain processed the info (turn left!)
The missing element of the mechanics? Hold the pup’s collar 🙂 It can be a collar or harness, but not a stay (because there are a lot of existing conditioned responses about turning towards you after a stay release that we don’t want to deal with here). You need to hold the collar so you can better predict when you need to move, as well as better control the distance between her and you so you can be close enough to get into the field of vision on the new side in time for her to process it.
Adding in the collar hold will make a world of difference:
– line her up right next to your leg
– hold her collar
– toss the treat very close to you, less than a meter (I suggest using the corner of the training room, where you can toss the treat to where the door and the white cabinet meet, next to the flag)
– when the treat has landed, let her go to it while you immediately start to move into her line of vision on the new side (trying to get to or past her shoulder on the new side, this is critical for processing).This is going to be the key to jumpstart the behavior: when you were not holding her on the video, she was basically at the treat and finished before you were moving, which makes it much harder to appear in her line of vision.
Using a corner will help because if the cookie is in the corner by the brown door, and you appear on her right shoulder by the Canadian flag, she is going to find it easier to turn right. In theory, as her brain prioritizes info, her brain should see two things: You moving to her right shoulder, and a wall on her left shoulder. The brain should then prioritize to turn right because also in theory, the amygdala should be asking her to NOT run into a wall – but pointy creatures do run into things a lot, so I can’t promise her amygdala will be on board with this plan. It is not impossible to turn left, but easier for you both! Then when you appear on her right and she turns her head to her right: BIG reward! Make it bigger (and more surprising) than if she turns left. Left turn when you wanted right? A cookie. Right turn when you wanted right? Surprise! BIG toy or handful of treats or something. Science says that a surprise like that is a more powerful reward in terms of a dopamine release than a maintenance cookie.
The other thing you can do is use a bigger or crunchier treat so she has to chew it (or a couple of little treats for her to grab) – this also allows you more time to appear in her field of vision on the new side.
I would try all the things: collar holding, short throws, crunchy cookies or a couple of cookies, into the corner 🙂 The mechanics to start this are really methodical (and GREAT for us humans to sort out this type of methodical mechanics where both handler and dog need to move slowly) but then when she gets it, you’ll find it gets all much easier.
I love your blue leg extenders LOL!! She was better turning to her right, and at her best turning to her right without your hand target as a cue (when she was offering it to her right). That was when she was at her most organized, getting feet in each gap without touching the blue bumps. So on the right turns, just let her offer (the hand target was raising her head a bit and also introducing a bit of chasing, and the offering had a lower hand and no chasing of the hand/toy so her form was more coordinated).
To her left, she was able to get organized for the first gap but not the 2nd gap (she would either jump it or land on the last bump). So for the left turns, start her in the first gap between bumps 1 and 2, holding her collar so she can’t go til you are ready, then tap the 2nd gap, then move your hand out of the way, and let go of here so she can offer. Reward her for getting into that 2nd gap (with the reward past the 3rd bump). If she can’t get into the 2nd gap, 2 other ideas:
– start her in the 2nd gap, so she can exit the bumps with good organization, then after a few good reps try starting her in the first gap.
– do the left turns without the 3 bumps – use 2 bumps (or your actual legs LOL!) and that can help her focus on getting organized on those.Nice work here! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning!
The resilience game in the garage looked great! The only thing to add is a ‘get it’ when you drop the cookie. You were very patient, which is great! You can definitely bring this game to new places – it is perfect for being the very first thing he does in all sorts of new places.The get it game also looked really good – building the confidence to drive ahead to the toy and the quick transitions into it are the bedrock of driving ahead! You had good timing of releasing him to get the toy – he was looking ahead each time. Keep up with this game for sure! At home, you can start to play it with you moving forward a tiny bit more. In different places, you can keep it just like you had it here (short throws, quick releases, and not a lot of your motion) so he can transfer the value of this game to different environments.
That is a perfect plank for Huck! And since it was flat, he had no trouble getting all of his little feets on it: super confident! You can add in asking him to turn in a full circle on it, with a low, slow cookie lure 🙂
He got a little worried when the pointers started barking – in that moment, you can flip to the resilience game where he can look…. then get a tossed treat for looking back at you Don’t keep asking for the plank until he is fully re-engaged because you can see his focus was split and his feet were a little all over the place LOL! If he gets on the plank, great. If not, no worries, because he was sorting out something worrisome in the environment. The resilience game is great for those moments where he gets a little concerned, so you can flip into that game at any time to help build resilience to unexpected changes in the environment.Backing up is making big improvements! Yay! He offered plenty of good backing up reps and zero downs, bows, or scooches LOL! Great! So the next step is to do two things:
– when he is offering the backing up, begin to toss the reward back to him (ideally between his feet and before he stops, so toss it early). By feeding from your hand, he quickly locked onto your hand (smart!) and that will cause him to step back and look up, rather than keep stepping back. The tossed rewards will help him continue to step back more and more
– be quieter while you are working the shaping element… you can use a marker like a ‘get it’ but try not to praise or chat with him – it causes him to look at your face, which stops the backing up. So you can be super quiet except for ‘get it’ when you toss the treat or drop it between your feet to start the next rep. then you can take a tug break and have all of the chat you want 🙂
Great job!!
TracyGood morning!
>> Bazinga is doing great! We are ready to catch back up. I think we need to finish up Week 3. How do you think we should proceed from here?
She looks terrific, I’m so glad this is behind you both and regular fun can fully resume 🙂 As you get back into it, definitely work the resilience game, that’s a good one! And see what she is doing with the prop and the wrapping, those will move quickly. If I recall correctly, the hand targeting was going well, so that will be easy to build up in weeks 4 and 5. There is no pressure to catch up, because once you get into week 4, you’ll find that the games build on each other so you will not feel like you are behind.
>>We jumped back in with the new Alternate Rear Cross Game. I was surprised that we are having trouble with one direction. We only got 1 successful non-spin when she starts on my right & turns to her right. I’m so directionally challenged – does that mean she is left-pawed?>>
Yes, I think she is a lefty 🙂 Those reps looked great!
It makes sense that she wouldn’t be able to turn right – it is a processing thing! She wants to go fast, the treats are VERY motivating, and by the time her brain sees that you have crossed to the other side to get her to turn right, it is too late… because she’s already turned left (turning left requires less processing because it is more of a reflex for her). My puppy is a righty, so he had an easy time going right but a harder time turning left.
So basically we need to buy her brain time to prioritize and process the info LOL! To do that, slow the whole game down by holding her collar when you throw the cookie – you were not holding her, so she was in motion immediately which was fine for the left turns but made it harder to see the right turns. Throw the cookie pretty close so she doesn’t take that many steps to it (therefore not working up a lot of speed). Then, when the treat has landed and you are ready, let go and tell her to get it. As soon as she starts to move, you step behind her and make yourself visible on her right side, and call her. You might have to move quickly to get visible on her right, which is fine because she won’t be that far from you 🙂 that is what happened on the right turn rep that was successful!
That should slow things down just enough that she can process your movement in time to turn right. And you can try tossing the cookie into a corner, making it even easier to turn right and harder to turn left.
>>Also – I LOVE your treat ledges in your hallway in your demo video
Ha! The previous owner put those in to hold lovely family photos… I use them as treat ledges for puppy training LOL!
Glad you are back in action! Let me know how she does with the rear crosses and the other games.
TracyGood morning! Great session here!
>> I could see in some of the reps I said “break” before her fluffy butt was completely on the floor, but sometimes it’s hard for me to tell.>>
Sometimes you can release on that intent-to-sit 😅 but also, you can wait to see a weight shift to more of an settled sit. And, if you can see her tail, watch her tail: when she is fully in the sit, her tail relaxes too LOL!
But overall, great session. She was engaged and stimulated, like she will be at a trial… but never broke the stay. Yay!
Two things to add now, along with gradually increasing duration using the ping pong method you used effectively here:
– walking forward like a lead out rather than backing away from her
– doing it on a surface that won’t slide under her when she releases explosively. She is powering out of her releases, which is great, so we want her to be able to trust that the footing won’t move.Great job! Have fun!
TracyGood morning!
>> For the running contact training I have a question about front feet vs back foot targets. When I started this training with my last puppy (who is now 2 but not fully trained… partly a COVID issue) my trainer and I were doing front foot targets in the box, but you are suggesting rear foot. I guess my question is what’s the difference, is one better than the other and why, and does stride length make a difference in choice of front vs back foot target?>>
Good question! A couple of answers for you:
The “traditional” way to work running dog walks lately is to train them behavior as a split-rear-foot Target, meaning that both rear feet hit the contact zone in a running stride. This was developed for and works best for those “traditional” agility structures and striding styles found in breeds like border collies and Shelties. It worked great to teach my 2 females and my Papillon, who stride more like BCs and Shelties.
It did not work that well for my lurcher (BorderWhippet). He is not that tall, but his structure and stride length lean more towards whippet (definitely not what the “traditional” RDW methods were developed for) so he couldn’t go fast AND do the split rear feet. So his is a front foot hit 😀
For the running aframe, all of my dogs do a front-then-rear pattern, and get marked for the rear feet. They have to use their rear feet correctly on the frame, or they end up leaping or doing something dangerous like sky diving lol!
So back to why train the rear foot target – as a tool for the RDW if needed, as a definitely needed tool for the aframe, plus it is great for hind end awareness for the dog. And it dramatically improved my “eye” for seeing the dogs’ footwork!
Two other reasons: it is a great balance for all of the front foot targeting we do on the prop 🙂 and it is also useful for training flyball box turns!
So to teach the concept, use something different from what you are using for the front foot hits. If the front foot hits are using a box, you can use a mat or something else for rear foot hits.
Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
>>the only thing that could make it better would be a little nicer weather so I could do more outside.>>
True! We need some warm weather!!!
>>I am so addicted to saying “Yes” that I don’t even think I realize it and I am not sure I noticed how much I was saying it in the videos. I will keep working on that because I can totally see how it makes her look at me and that is an issue I have struggled with so much with Jackson.>>
I think it is a planning issue for all of us! But we can shape ourselves 🙂 as you plan you cookies and toys and what you are going to do… also plan what word to use. So if you are going to toss treats, for example, plan the get it marker.
>> I have experimented with using both arms to cue it, the dog side arm, and the offside arm. I feel unsure about which arm to use. Are there handling moves coming up that could make one arm a better choice for the tandem as far as avoiding confusion (hope that makes sense) or are two arms always the way to go.>>
I use both arms for the tandem turn because it looks more like my threadle-wrap cues – and different from any other hand use. But, it is a matter of what feels right to you. I have found that dog-side arm alone is not salient enough, outside arm alone involves too much twisting or looks too much like my tunnel threadle arm – and two hands down low seem just right 🙂
>>One other question – in your videos, you have those white plastic gates that you can move around. I have looked on-line and not sure I am finding the same thing. Do you know where you got them?>>
I think you mean these:
Stay warm!
Tracy
Good morning!
Glad you had fun at the UKI trial – the video you posted on FB looked FABULOUS!!!!Slices looked good! You can start the fading process here too: Do a short session where you cue the sit on the plank but click the PT as soon as his butt hits the sit position (you can release with a verbal too, if you think he won’t release when he hears the PT do the beepbeep :))
Then, keep the plank in and fade the sit – switching to your real verbal for the backside or threadle and staying in motion should make it happen really easily!He had a little confusion about where to sit relative to the jump on the wraps – you can help by using a hand signal with you standing stationary in wrap position to get it started. Motion and timing made it harder – he was sitting but he didn’t know where to put his butt specifically. It might be easier to work the backside slices with the sit first, because it is easier to tell him where to put his butt (you can be on the landing side helping with a physical cue). And the plank can stay in there for the front wraps for now.
Great job! Let me know how the fading sessions go!
Tracy
Good morning!
Perfect mechanics on the new rear cross game! I kinda made it up yesterday so I am glad that Ramen AND Baxter now have rear crosses happening LOL! The only challenge for Baxter was making sure he didn’t drop the treats 🙂 You might need softer treats, I was using tiny bits of cheese.
He turned a little better to his left but you had good position on the right turns and he was able to get them successfully. Super!
And yes, when he cookie was lined up wrong, you were correct to say “get it” and let him move forward without a rear cross.
So to build this to rear crosses on the prop – do one more session with treats just like this… then using the same hallway, we put the prop in the same spot as we put the treats here, everything exactly the same except we toss the prop to where you tossed the treat (towards the wall) and see how it goes. Let me know if that makes sense!
Great job!
TracyGood morning!
His collection looks really good! His reading your deceleration pretty perfectly, and the pivoting is nice and tight to you. Yay!
So with that in mind…. let’s put more value on acceleration to you, and ahead of you 🙂 You can put the decel games on the shelf for a week and put a lot of value on the acceleration games:
– toy races! Let’s let him have a rip-roaring good time of leaving you in the dust to run ahead of you to a toy. Wheeeee! Just do 2 or 3 reps per session (because it is exhausting LOL!) with a great toy.– chase da momma! You can either have someone hold him while you run away, or toss a treat to start – then let him chase you while you run HARD (no decel at all) and then when he catches up to you, let him have the toy and run around with it 🙂 Just be connected so he knows which side of you to be on.
This should swing the value to acceleration – then next week, we balance the acceleration with the deceleration 🙂 Fun!
Great job! Let me know how the acceleration games go!
TracyGood morning! Nice work with these games!
You had lots of really good clicks on the retrieve games, he is doing well! Just be sure to not click when he looks at you. If you miss a click and he did something great but is looking at you, you can wait til the next offer before you click anything 🙂
On the 2nd video, he had a lot of good lifting of the toy! You can click when it hits your hand – that can be a clarifying targeting moment for the pup to target the toy to your hand (doesn’t matter if you can’t catch it LOL! You can click as long as he gets it to hit your hand) I think you were reaching for it or wanting to grab it but you can click for him targeting to your hand without you reaching for it – eventually he will place it in your hand 🙂Running contact foundation is going well – at this stage, you can replace the clicker with a get it marker and cookie toss – keep marking the front foot hits for now (so we can condition him to look straight), but mark with the ‘get it’ and toss for now. If he stops on the mat, just toss a treat so he doesn’t think he should offer sits or downs 🙂
Parallel path commitment is looking really good! You can toss the rewards sooner – get the reward thrown before he reaches the uprights, so it lands as he goes through the uprights and he doesn’t look at you. For this game too, you can replace the clicker with a get it marker, so he doesn’t look back at you (clickers tell the dogs they are correct but don’t tell them where the reward is placed, which is why they often look at us when we click :)) We will be emphasizing “don’t look at the momma” with all the pups now 🙂
You can add more lateral distance to this too to see if he can commit when you are a few feet away!
Rotated sends are also looking strong, his commitment is good! You can start a little further away now.
What is your “reward in hand” marker? He is ready for you to use it on this game, to replace the ‘yes’. When using the toy, you will want to have the toy in the hand that is not next ot he barrel so you can use your hand to send him to the barrel, not just a foot step.
Sometimes on the sideways sends with your left (like at 1:32 and 1:54) you had him come between you and the barrel – he is correct to be on the other side of the barrel on those, so on the backwards sending when you send with your left, he will go around the other side of it to his left (coming between you and the barrel is a threadle which looks different, more like a tandem turn or lap turn)
Have you decided on wrap verbals? He is ready for you to add them 🙂He is doing really well with his backing up! So fun!11 Interesting that he often carries his right hind – you can reward for him touching the ground with it rather than carrying it 🙂 And you can see if he will do all that backing up with you totally stationary 🙂
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning! Lots of lovely work here, all of these skills are coming along so nicely!!!
Starting with the lap and tandem turns: bearing in mind that both are tight turns cues, you can move more slowly into both of them. For the lap turn, things go better when you are standing still and not backing up, because backing up makes the turn cue unpredictable (in terms of when the pup can expect to turn). If you are standing still, feet together and arm extended, she knows that the turn cue will begin just as she arrives at your hand.
With the tandem turns, things worked better when you decelerated, got connection to your hands, then turned her – those were nice! On the first few, you were moving too fast then trying to turn her: moving fast is an acceleration cue, so she accelerated and that made the turn cues late. The decel then the turn cues with your hands made it much easier to read.
On both of these, and any time you toss a treat… say “get it”. That will condition her to look ahead. If you say “yes”, she is going to look at you and see you toss the treat – which conditions her to look at you more 🙂
This will be really helpful when you add the prop, because she won’t look at you as much. On the lap and tandems with the prop, I don’t know if she was seeking out the prop or juts incidentally moving over it because you were near it and she was looking at you. So when using the prop, be a little further from it – do the lap or tandem turn but don’t mark anything and don’t move the cookies until you see intention to move to the prop: then say get it and toss the treat ahead.
***
Tunnels – looking great! Remember to say ‘get it’ on this one too, because you want her to drive ahead to the toy and not look at you when you praise or say yes.She only had one question, at :18 – you let go of her and moved backwards, so she thought you wanted the tunnel entry next to you (smart! LOL!). You were more patient on the other reps to let her commit, and she was great!
The threadle entry also looked great, plus she slept on it from last time and was like “I GOT IT, MOM!” Super!!!
**** handling combos
Looking good here too – your timing on the 1st and 3rd rep of moving away from the barrel was really good (you started moving away as soon as she arrived at it). On the 2nd rep, you were too early when you moved away (she was still several feet from the barrel) so she came off of it – good reset cookies!! So for now, her commitment allows you to leave just as she is arriving at the barrel – the commitment will continue to expand, but be patient for now 🙂
All reps looked good with you accelerating and connecting to the toy out ahead after the barrel: she was driving ahead nicely (note how you said go go go get it and never said “yes” :))*** running contact foundations
Nice job building value!!! On the next session, you can start marking for when her back feet get in (ideally, that 2nd back foot) – those clicks were for the front feet. The trick is to stare at the box and not watch he – just watch for feet to hit the ground in the box 🙂
At that level of precision, two other ideas:– have the cookies in your hands and ready to throw, no moving them around so she doesn’t look at you (and if you need to reload, break out of the session for a tug game which is a good thing to do anyway
– you can swap out the clicker for a “get it” marker to help condition her to keep looking ahead. Definitely do not say “yes” LOL!!*** concept transfer: parallel path
Super good click timing here! And keep those treat tosses as immediate as you can – when she was on your right, you were VERY quick. When she was on your left, you were later with the tosses even though you were tossing with you right hand. So click/toss should have basically no time in between them, so she doesn’t look at you at all. You can also use a ‘get it’ marker to replace the clicker here too.
For now, don’t start from a stay because she looks at you the whole time when you do the stay and release. To work the skill from further ahead, start nearer to the jump and toss a start treat further away so after she grabs the treat, you are way ahead 🙂 And you will need more room for this game soon, so you can add more lateral distance 🙂
If she misses, you don’t need a reset cookie on this game (although she was not sad about it LOL!) you can just keep walking, turn around, go the other direction (no need for a verbal mrker or anything). A miss is good info, as long as she doesn’t have too many misses.*** concept transfer: rotate sending
>> I have never had her do little barks before while working. I think she thought this was loads of fun>>
Yes, I think she liked it a lot!!!! She was super with the food and she definitely liked the toy and was able to maintain her precision even in higher arousal which we like!
I think the little barks were when you remained too close to the barrel… I believe she was giving feedback that you were in her way 🙂 She is SPICY! HA!
She did not give any little woofs when you moved away or you started a little further away. So with that in mind, you can start a little further away and add more moving away 🙂 But be sure to maintain the clarity of your cue to go to the barrel, and the clear connection to the “landing spot” 🙂 Both of those were great!
Great job with the wrap verbals! Try to be consistent with the markers – with the toy, for example, I think you had “bite” “yes” and “good” all happening 🙂 Try to emphasize the bite marker.
Great job on all of these! Let me know what you think!
Tracy
