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Hi!
I think the questions here were mainly because you were handling and this is more of a dog training setup 🙂 Bearing in mind that the big ol’ dog walk will be in your way blocking a lot of handling… just say jump and turn your shoulders (rather than face the jump or try to handle too much) – this is more of a dog training skill than a handling skill. You are trusting her dog training more and just yelling the cues with some connection, and turning to run by the line when you drive her back to the tunnel, so coming out of the tunnel for the 3-4-5 line should be the same.
Position 1 of the invisible dog walk went well, but you were facing 3 for too long which delays the next handling. You can be turned more and heading more to 4 when she exits the tunnel (remember to give the verbals before she enters the tunnel).
On the 3rd rep – the out jump at :20 with the outside arm was too much handling and set the rear cross (right turn) – good girl to read that! That might be useful on course!
You were better at :47! But you can handle even less there, trusting her to find the line (and breaking it down if she cannot find the line).
Try not to back up into the throwback at :51, just decel, rotate, then move forward. You were rotating and moving backwards so that was causing wider turns and a bar. Also, not handling the 3 jump as much will get you through the blind sooner, making the transition into 5-6-7-8 even easier.On the 2nd sequence, you did less handling and more moving/yelling 🙂 and it worked really well to get her to the jump on the other side of the tunnel! When she gets into the tunnel at 1:14 and 1:35 – get outta there, don’t stay to help her, it made you late for the blind 🙂 that is another trained skill, no send needed (also remember that there would be a dog walk right there so you won’t have room to send and also she won’t see it because the DW is in the way 🙂
Nice work here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
Great news about the class! The more you rehearse, the more you can execute during the performance 🙂
>> I have been walking with the mindset of getting ahead and then doing damage control if he gets ahead. No wonder we are both getting frustrated!
Yes – too much failure for you both. It is a failure in planning, and that is why we do this walk through section every CAMP class 🙂 We need to learn about the dogs needs and where he will be on course, and plan for it all very specifically to be ready for the run. It is not as hard as it seems at first; it gets much easier with practice.
The threadle wrap training is going well! He figured out really quickly that in in was the release 🙂 The stays were hard for him, so have your cookies ready before you lead out so he doesn’t have to wait too long (he broke the stay every time you were fiddling with the treats after the lead out)
For the next steps: After a couple of come to hand rewards, you can throw the toy back to where the landing side of the jump would be to begin getting the concept of turning away. So it would be come to hand, turn him away.. .then toss the cookie back to the landing spot of the wing, which will be behind you (rather than throwing the toy ahead).
>> What should I look for before we move to Step 2, step 3, etc.
I look for 2 short sessions (10 reps of less) of 90% success or better. Then I move to the next step. That helps make it really specific and quantifiable.
>>I wonder if he will have more difficulty when we switch to a jump instead of the wing?
Yes, he will, because the bar has higher value and his current understanding it to take the front side. They all find it much harder. So when you get to that stage, you will want to start by making the other parts of it very easy, like being stationary and rewarding him for coming to your hands like you did here.
Great job!!!! Let me know what you think 🙂
TracyHa! We are both tired then… I knew you sped up the tugging, but I didn’t notice the sped up rep LOL!!! He was definitely not distracted by your speed in that one LOL!
Hi!
It has been wicked hot, I can understand why she would think working in the heat was poopy!!!
Seq 1 – On these reps, the start should be a dog-on-left to start, so there is not blind (she can be on a slice and find 1-2 as a relatively straight line. Doing the BC on just those 2 jumps makes it hard to time, because she is so close to the jump.
Seq 2: the BC started on time so her question was about the connection as you finished it: at 1:02, you are looking at her on the new side but your arm was pointing forward. So you probably saw her, but she did not see the new connection. As you finish the blind, keep the new dog-side arm back and make a clear eye contact – if you remember with Nuptse, we worked on showing him the reward across your body (toy in the right hand, held on your left hip) to open up the connection. That will really help her too!
She found the GO line brilliantly! SUPER thrilled with that!!!! It is great fun too see the young dogs find all the lines so all we worry about it timing and connection. YAY!
Nice work! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
Gorgeous cool morning… color me jealous!!!
>>Dellin seems to be one of those dogs that finds her own set up spot and I don’t mess with it too much since it feels like something that could cause her to melt, so she’s happy, she seems to pick a good distance and she does not move on the start line, so I call it good.>>
That is great – I never want anyone to fight with the dogs on the start line or argue about the stays. I do think that as the bars come up, you will want her to be at least one big stride further away from the first jump, but that will be easy enough to get: just show it to her, then leave her be to sort it out at the bigger distance (with lots of rewards :))
The BCs, throwbacks and FCs went well, she reads everything perfectly. Now she needs them all to start sooner LOL! Doing the BCs on 2 jumps makes things harder to time, so looking at the full sequence:
For the BCs, don’t stop before the release: keep moving through the BC line and release while you are running – that motion helps support 2 so you can start the BC as soon as her front feet land. That way you can be re-connected on the new side before takeoff for 2. You were consistently re-connecting on landing of 2 so she was wide.The other thing that will make the blind cross reconnection quicker is to keep you hands in much tighter to your ribs (wings in!). You had some airplane-ing happening so even when it feels like you start on time, you end up late because it takes a while (in dog years) to get the arms changed and connection happening when your arms are out. If you keep your arms in, elbows bent, hands by your hips: your connection change will be SUPER quick and that will help with the blinds.
On the throwbacks, she doesn’t need as much throw 🙂 You were moving backwards a bit and your arm was swooshing a bit, so she was a little wide. She is more like her classmate Ripley: stop moving as you rotate and put your hand down on the takeoff side of the bar and leave it there (no throwing motion). And just casually look her in the eye – then as she collects to jump, maintain connection as you move to the tunnel. That will mean getting to the throwback position on 3 a bit sooner – but at :38 you can lead all the way out to it rather than move into it, for example. That way there is no backwards motion into it (which dogs read as forward motion).
She was also great reading the full FCs – you will not likely ever need these on lead out (they have been replaced with BCs and the lead out push) but they are good to practice timing. Same as the BCs – start as soon as her feet land from 1, so you are fully rotated when she takes off for 2. At :59, she is taking off for 2 as you start rotating so she makes the turn on landing.
Connection was overall really strong, and she read the lines brilliantly! So now you can push the timing up sooner and see how it goes. Great job!!!
Tracy
Hi!
Serps are looking really good!!!
One jump serp went well. 2 jump serp looked good too, 3 jumps serps looked strong too! Super nice session and you were a good dog trainer by quitting before adding more challenge although it might have been tempting to keep going! Ha! So since this went so well: on this setup, you can add more motion (start jogging). And you can definitely try the setup with the tunnel and the open-angled serp jumps, so both of you get to run run run 🙂
My only suggestion is a subtle thing: as you are moving with the serp arm out, the position and connection look terrific – you don’t need to swing your serp arm back at all, you can leave it locked in the great position it was in and keep making the connection.
Great job! Onwards to more speed through the serps!
TracyIt is great to see Cody running! Yay!
You can send to tunnel 1 from further away (closer to 2) so that you are done with the FC or BC before he exits – a BC might be easier. And yes, you don’t need to go as close to 3 (although I don’t think that is why he got distracted there. And you can also try layering the 2 jump on the way to the dog walk!
On the 2 hard parts, I don’t think it was a WOO (timing) issue for either:
The weave entry is a hard one, most of the dogs in class have been missing it: I thought your cue was good but he just couldn’t quite get the entry. It is a good training skill to work on, so you can try the weave skill game with the wing to help him out so he finds the weave entry independently.On the tunnel send at 1:34 – timing was good! But your connection turned forward so he took the jump (you can see your arm come forward and you look forward – if you turn the sound off, it looks like a cue to the tunnel). Note the different at 1:48 – definitely more connected so he found the line to the tunnel easily and it looked like you were still able to layer that section. Nice layering on the ending line too – he read the tunnel send there really well so you can trust him more for that long ending line: as soon as he is heading to the tunnel, you an layer like you did but keep moving. You hung out a little so he caught up pretty quickly 🙂 Try to get ahead and stay ahead til the end (he drove ahead really well there!)
Great job here! Let me know what you think! I am sure Coal will be ready to run this one too in a few days 🙂
Tracy
Hi!
Yes, the goal with the tunnel rear was to try to stay behind the tunnel plane – it made a lot of dogs think! Clearly we all need to do more rears on tunnels!
How did River’s appointment go?
T
Hi!
>>I’m trying to run like you say, but I don’t always execute it well. Less footwork and more run works for me!
I think you’re doing a great job! It is not easy sorting out mechanics with young dogs and things are coming together really well. We keep noodling around to see what fits her best!
>>Where is the best place to leadout for the push? That worked well and I wouldn’t necessarily have chosen that move.
The lead out push basically replaces a lot of places we would have done a front cross.
The best place is on the spot where you want her to land and turn, to really show her the line. As long as you move on time, you won’t be there when she needs the spot LOL!The zig zag looked great! The toy play looked great! My only suggestion is to move the toy another 3 or 4 feet away from the 2nd jump, so she can power out even more.
Next session: angle the jumps a little flatter but about 6 inches. 🙂Great job here!
TracyGood morning!
I am glad your mom is out of the hospital! That is a relief for sure. And congrats on your success at the trial! Sounds Iike an amazing weekend, wow!!!!!The walks versus runs on the skills challenges looked good! Definitely keep practicing the walk throughs, that will continue to make a big difference in the runs!
Seq 1 – Comparing the walk through to the runs: you can walk with more connection and more speed and louder verbals 🙂 You were definitely showing the lines with your motion, but your arm was up so your invisible dog would not see your eyes 🙂 and you were very quiet LOL! So, act exactly as if you are running the dog with a low arm, watching him behind you (on the opening, for example, and on the exit of the FC at 5) – and remember to use your loud verbals 🙂
The runs went well You had more time than you planned for on the tunnel exit at 8-9 so ended up doing the FC, which is fine – and good to know that you have plenty of time on the big sends and layering to get where you need to be. You got your connections and verbals here, but I will bug you to keep working them in the walk throughs too because that is where most errors on course are for all of us: broken connections and lack of verbals 🙂
He ran it all really well – the only little bloopers were a bar down at 2 (he just slipped from what I could see) and on the Last rep you got behind on the 5 backside so he pulled the bar there.Seq 2: The walk through happened after the first 2 runs, maybe just video editing out of order? You went in more on the 6-7 layer line in the walk through ( then he joined you LOL! ) so maybe the walk through was after the runs here to fix the questions he had?
The overall shape of the handling was great! A couple of ideas for you – you can be sooner with the FC 3-4, trusting his commitment more to be further ahead and start the cross sooner. The FCs were late here, so he was wide – the timing matched the timing on the walk through, which means you can definitely practice seeing the invisible dog land from 2, cue 3 then start the FC.
Even with the FCs a little late, you were rehearsing great connection in the walk through especially at 1:30 and it worked beautifully – he turned well and never looked at the off course tunnel. Yay!Sending into the layering got tricky – more connection after 5 as you send will help him, and more patience to set him on the line before you move away. You stopped a bit one the early runs so he had questions – the send 2nd rep had more connection but then you stepped back so he pulled in . After the walk through, you went in further at 1:35 and it worked great, it matched the walk through there. The layering looked great!
Seq 3 – the 3rd run started off well but then the layering pulled him off 6 when you hung back by the tunnel exit (I think he was correct there based on your position to not take 6) You got up the line closer to 6 and it worked a lot better on the 2nd run . So definitely plan your lines of motion to support his line more especially on the layering, because decel or stepping back tends to pull him off.
I loved the lap turn/threadle wrap at 8, that worked brilliantly! !The live class sequences looked really strong too – the weaves there were an added challenge especially coming back down the line towards the tunnel. He found position 1 with the invisible dog walk to be really easy. Position 2 was harder (the placed toy really helped!) and then position 3 was easy with the placed toy as well. It gives him the support to really commit independently, which made the whole line much easier.
Be sure you keep moving down the line to the tunnel so he doesn’t start asking questions about curling in or taking the weaves 🙂 The extra motion will help support the line, and also connecting to him more will help. It sounds counterintuitive, but looking at him more (or looking at his tail when he is ahead haha) will turn your shoulders to the line and he will see that peripherally. If you point forward more, it turns your shoulders away from the line and he might curl in or ask questions. You can see a bit of that at 2:46 when you turned away a little too soon and used a little too much arm pointing, so he almost came off the line.
Great job on these! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning!
I am glad you was working hard not the walk throughs, they are really the key to producing those great first runs!
>> The only question I have is regarding your last sentence: “and the spots where you were not supporting the verbals as well were all in the walk through, versus what you had to do to cue the line in the run.” So, I know that is one of my weaknesses, but how do I improve it? Is it more visualization after the walk, exaggerating my handling on the walk? Before you answer take a look at the below>>
I will answer first before watching the videos, then answer again afterwards. Since it is happening during the walk and you are not rehearsing it then forgetting it, I don’t think it is a visualization question after the walk through. I think it is exaggerating the handling during the walk through, bigger movements and really trying to ‘see’ the invisible dog. I will look below and see if I am correct or not then answer again LOL!
>> 3) On the side-by-side run thru vs. run, I am not supporting sharp or hard turns with my handling in the walk thru enough to succeed in the run with the dog. So it may be an example of your sentence above, right?>>
Yes, exactly! If he needs a stronger cue, you need to deliver it in the walk through so it is at your fingertips in the run too.
About the struggling in small spaces – it might have been the timing of getting him sent into the layering? You definitely have to wait a bit to set up the send after the jump before it. I thought you did well with your running line on the rest!
On the videos:
Seq 1:
The walk through can have a more intense connection to the invisible dog, especially on sends such as the exit of the backside into the layering. At :07 you disconnected after the backside and looked forward to send really fast and leave. That is almost exactly what happened at :25, when he didn’t go to the layer (you were more connected than on the walk through, then disconnected and sent so he thought you wanted the tunnel). You were great at :35 – that is what the walk through should look like (connected and patient on the send til he is on the line).
The other trouble spot was the exit o the 8 tunnel – the verbal was late at :39 (his head was just about in the tunnel) and I can’t compare it to the verbal timing in the walk through… because I couldn’t hear the verbals in the walk through LOL! Much better the 2nd time, you were a stride sooner on the verbal and had he physical cue sooner too. The last run looked good too, but he pretty much knew it by then – no need to do those final runs on these sequences, you can move to the next sequence to start fresh.Seq 2:
On the walk through – on this one too, you had a good shape to the handling but you needed more connection strongly to the invisible dog 🙂 Specifically, you can ramp up the connection on the sends (exit of 1, 5-6) and exit of crosses (3-4). Without the connection practiced there, you either have to wait longer to get the turn you want (which puts you behind where you planned to be) or he doesn’t get the send. Both of these happened on the first run.On the ending line – on the walk through, I thought you were sending him on the same big line you did on the first sequence (figured you forgot the course :)) Then at 2:01 you were trying to get the correct line but the handling was late and he didn’t read it. So yes, I think this is an example of what you were saying above: the physical cues can be stronger in the walk through. You got the line there on the last run but the bar was down, because the cue as late (you can start that cue as he exits the tunnel, or you can use a spin or break arm there instead of rotating and backing up).
Seq 3 – let’s look at this in reverse! Look at the last run, in terms of connection, speed, and intensity of handling cues. The side-by-side really shows this – the last run is as lot more pro-active and clear in the handling cues. You can work backwards like that – take a simple sequence, run him correctly, then walk it just like you ran it to get the feel of it without him… the walk it again. So we can take a reverse approach to getting the walk throughs.
You can use this sequence since you already ran it: without walking it again, run it intensely like you did on the final run here. Then – walk it just like you ran it. That might produce the muscle memory and feeling of how you want the walk throughs to be, in terms of the verbals being loud, fast running, big connections and strong handling cues.
Great job on these! Let me know what you think about my reverse order idea of run then walk then run for now!
TracyGood morning!
This is looking really great – he is doing what ideally we want the dogs to do: coming to the correct side and finishing the wrap without you having to use more hand or shoulder motion, or footwork. PERFECT!! I am still convincing my dogs of that LOL!! He did have the random error, might have been a subtle difference in the timing of the movement and the cue, hard to tell, but it was only that one random error so we will let it go (I have random errors a lot more than my dogs do LOL!!)
Since this is going so well, you can add in the wing wrap before it to have more speed and motion coming into it. You will see this skill begin to appear in the sequences and courses in coming weeks 🙂
Great job!!!!
TracyGood morning!
I am glad you played along with the class! Fun!
Walk through was strong in terms of the handling being clear! What yo can add to it is a lot more connection to really see the invisible dog and where he would be (especially 4-5-6 l;one and the exit of the 8 backside to the end). Then… do it all faster 🙂 He will be running hard so your speed will need to increase too 🙂 And also… verbals 🙂 You were super quiet on the walk t though and nice and loud on the run – so be sure to rehearse your loud verbals too!
O the run – Great job!!!! You had a feel for the run and you were connected, so he ran it really well 🙂
The opening went nicely! And you did have to run faster 🙂
From 5-6, you added more exaggerated collection handling then you did on the walk through (it was there on the walk through but a much smaller arm motion) and it put you a little further behind than you had planned for the 7-8 section. So definitely rehearse the bigger movements in the walk through too, you want it to be pretty identical to the run so you have a realistic feel for where you will end up relative to him.
Great job! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning!
I think the walk through preps are really showing good results!!! It is great to have another set up eyes on you for the walk through and plus it allows you to identify areas to work before running (like the backside on the 1st sequence or the past turn on the 2nd sequence). It sounds like Kim was giving you connection advice and that was perfect – the difference between the first walk through and the last walk through was tremendous in terms of connection!
Seq 2 w/ Buccleigh:
This went well! Comparing the walk through to the run, a couple of things to remember for the next one:The behind the back start looked really good! Bear in mind that he will not be behind you for that long so plan for him being ahead in the walk through. You were looking behind you in the walk through and the reality was that he was ahead of you almost immediately there. That changes the pace and timing of the opening, so definitely something to plan for when doing your next sequences/courses.
The backside at 5 – You had good position on the walk though but lost the position at 1:33 when you stepped to your right and that opened up the front of the. On the bar second rep you rotated and pulled him off. I think the difference was that you were perhaps trying to help more than he needed and part of the walk through can be the patience of getting to position and letting him pass you 🙂 You Got it the 3rd time after working it but then lost connection after it. After getting the connection, the rest ran well and the last full run looked lovely!
Seq 3 w/ Keltie: She did really well too!
I don’t see the fast walk through here, that must be where you ran out of time. If you are working w/ Kim and stop the walk through to work a specific skill, yo can also stop the walk through timer so you can still get the fast walk throughs in (they are important to practice).
Overall, she ran it really well! She did had a little question about the layering on the first run, and I think it was because you did the blind and got a bit past the tunnel when you sent her to the layering… so then you had to back up to layer – that was the moment she hesitated. A blind without going past the tunnel would work better, or a rear cross at 3 so that you can be in motion the whole time. Also, when you are further ahead from the layering, be sure to keep your arm down & back to her (more connection) so she can see where your shoulders are. When you were running with her and not layering, your arms were down and connection was very clear, so she was able to be super speedy!
Nice work getting the backside on the 7-8-9 section! You had rehearsed it and it was easy to produce when you ran her. Yay!
Great job on these! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
She was really driving here! And the good news is that you had too much Go happening, which pushed her past some of the lines (good girl!)
On the invisible dog walk warm up and sequence 1 – the line was in a great spot, so try to run parallel to your line and not over it – running past it towards 3 and 4 is what pushed her past 4 at :21 and :35. Ideally, as she exits the tunnel, she is finding 3 and 4 as you are running parallel to the line on the ground and perpendicular to the tunnel.
The same “too much go” was happening on the line going back down to the tunnel after 5 at :51 and 1:07 and 1:21. You caught it and used a Go to get her initially on the line, then added at turn cue at 1:34 and it worked like charm! Yay! And with that in mind, you nailed the last sequence when you put it all together. Yay! So now you can move your invisible dog walk increasingly further and further away, as long as you run parallel to your line and not over it.
The only other detail to note on this session is she was set up too close to the jump at :58, she was not able to get full hind end under her to take off and landed on the jump. She was set up further back there on the next rep, and had no trouble at all 🙂
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
Tracy
