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Hi!
>.Does this exercise eventually add to a full set of 12?
Yes, eventually, but I recommend starting on open poles (channels or 2x2s) so that it is easier on the dog’s body.
>> you picked up on when there was a little bit of pressure on his way to the poles he flicked away and went to the tunnel. We have this same thing happen on our Reverse Wraps….my timing of when I can leave is pretty critical…if I put a little pressure on the line “too early” for him he’ll flick off just like he did here. Sort of like he thinks it was a rear cross? Is this something we’ll be doing anything with in Camp?>>
We have them scattered throughout the courses – in isolation, you can see a reverse wrap on sequence 1 B of the first live class. They are also in the jumping courses. The tmiing should be as soon as he is past the commitment plane of the backside jump and turns his head to the bar. You might be leaving too early and pushing him off the line, or he might need more reinforcement tossed on the landing side as you leave to maintain commitment and not chase you… or both 🙂 I am sure we will see it on one of the courses.
On the video –
the first option looked good!Layering is a good option – on this rep, when you tried for the layering, the physical cue drew him right to the jump and the tunnel verbal does not (yet) override it. To set up layering, you can handle from the landing side of jump #3 like you did so you can show parallel motion from #4 back to the tunnel.
But I think teaching the layering skill is the most important part here, like you did at :57 to show him that it is indeed and option to go directly to the tunnel (he picked it up quickly). The reps form this morning all looked good, so he definitely retained the info!
>>so I timed a bunch of the reps and except for the very last rep of the layer this morning, which was like .3 faster than any other rep, both of the handling choices ended up being essentially the same time.>>
I love that you timed it! The last rep being fastest by a good margin was no fluke: handling without the layer caused a longer path to the tunnel and he look at the door tht was right there. Handling with the layer at the end was the best rep where you got off his line – the blind on that jump should be moreof a German turn, where you get past the wing of the jump so he has less yardage – the other reps with the layering were a strie slower beause you did that blind as more of a normal landing side blind, which sent him a little wide because you were on his line.
Great job here!
Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
>> I still have a question on that wrap at 13 on course one. What should my person be doing? Should feet be going forward and chest facing her? Or should I stop motion til she comes into me or everything facing forward?>>
Do you mean course 2, black numbers, where it is tunnel – wrap – tunnel? In that case it is decel, rotate and be running the other direction before she takes off.
Or, if you mean course 1 with the threadle wrap at 14 – then yes, your feet should be going forward and your upper body cues the turn, while you are in motion the whole time. I use 2 hands on that cue to help the dogs know the difference between threadle wrap and threadle slice. I have more specifics on it coming on Monday in the next set of games 🙂
On the video – this is going well!! Definitely train this on lowered bars partially to make it easier for her to do and partially because jumping 24 is just so hard on the dogs that we don’t want to do a lot of it.
I think the key for her will be getting the momentum into the line: Stick closer to the first jump til she comes around, then move and use the verbals – that was when she had the most success! When you got ahead like at :26, you had to peel away and move back to get the layer, so she did not take the jumps. Compare that to :59 where you stuck closer and she got it easily! On the last rep, you were not as close but not as far ahead, so ended up sending and that is what caused her to drop the bar there. So, to set up the layering, you can strategically be staying close to her and the jumps before it, to get lots of momentum into the layer – that way you don’t have to stop and send, then move away.
The layering is off to a good start! Hopefully you can get a break in the heat to do more 🙂
Have fun!
TracyHi –
On the mountain climber video:
>> Had a little issue with the supporting jump moving on the first one that we had to work through
Yes, you have to be 1000% certain that the support will not move. Do you have something other than the light wing jump? Those wings are very light and more likely to move. A more solid wing can work, but I prefer something that is more solid like the teach it I was using, or a saw horse of some sort. We don’t want to to move from under her.
>>before really getting into tossing the treat – the grass is making that a pain, takes forever for her to find the treat>
You can try it from a stay, or you can use the MM or a food bowl if the grass makes it too hard to find the treat.
try going with her on the first several reps if she is showing signs of concern, more like what you did at :56.That really helped her!
Was the food already on the target before she got on there – it was hard to tel if you were putting it there beforehand or after she started moving. I prefer to have it there beforehand so she can trust it will be there as she moves up the board.Love the slam –
She was getting the hang of hitting it with her front feet for sure! To help with back feet, you can move your position so you are more off to the side, more like the bang game. That way she can get on the side a bit more, then you present the reward towards the bottom which can encourage the back feet to follow through. Do this with less tip though – even 2 inches can be a lot! You can start it with no tip at all to get her trusting the board and putting her back feet on, then over the course of several sessions add tip in tiny increments.Separately, on a wider plank that doesn’t move, revisit the backing up games onto the plank so she remembers that back feet can get involved too 🙂
>>Just read and watched this one and confused a bit as I think I missed a contact game somewhere? Is there a game introducing the end behaviour for the contacts? Did I miss it? There have been plank games (mving across the plank) but I don’t recall anything re end behaviour?
In this game, we are either shaping a 2o2o or 4on with the board and a target and the rewards, or most people have already chosen the position they want and have started adding a target. They have some value for the target based on the strike a pose games, and they have value for 4 on the board – so even if they don’t fully know 2o2o, you can begin to shape it when they offer getting on the end of the board. The presence of the target is part of the reinforcement process.
>>rom the video I can’t really tell what you are doing end behaviour for HS as the text is going over it a lot and the vid quality seems lower but maybe not a nose touch as there seems to be more pawing of the target?
The target was going in when she offering being relatively still on the plank. I was not reward for a nose touch, I was rewarding for not looking at me and just being in that position. The target promotes the low head and I don’t mind the foot touch at this stage.
>>With Contraband is it a nose touch? I think so, but not the ‘traditional’ repeated NT?>>
The nose to target builds off the strike a pose nose to target, but my hand starts low then I put the target on the ground. The target was going on the ground when his back feet got on the board. I was rewarding for touching the target while staying in position, but I really don’t care about the traditional nose touch. The nose touching here is basically to get a lowered head and it becomes a superstitious behavior that remains while keeping the head low as they run into position. The lowered head helps for speed and balance.
>>I am using a transparent target taped on the end of the teeter for the teeter work so I am not putting PB ans sardines right on the teeter to keep the mess down. Maybe use the with a foot target???>>
I prefer easily seen targets to get started – with 2 of the dogs I was using an index car and plastic lid with HS.
Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
>>We do an around for frizz toss which looks very similar, however he kicks way out anticipating the throw. Should I switch to food and put it on a new word? Try a different toy?>>
No worries about kicking way out to anticipate the throw, that indicates super high value 🙂 He looks great here!
He did well here turning to his left, that is clearly the strong side for this game. He thought your were a little NUTS when you asked for it to his right, but he did it. YAY!!!
A couple of things to try on this: have the “send” hand empty, and the reward in the other hand – that can help make it look more like what he would see in training or in the ring. The frizz can be in the other hand for now, and you can also play with a different toy or a treat to throw, to begin transferring the value. I use treats or balls a lot, because they are small and easy to have in my hand as I am fading the giant visual of the frizzer.
And I think to help him understand it in the agility context – skip ahead to sending him around and then to a jump in front of you, so in the agility context he drives to the jump you are moving towards (rather than expecting the friz toss). How well he figures that out will tell us if he needs a different word or not (because it would be so nice to NOT have another word LOL!):
If he is happy with it and drives to the jump? Cool beans, use the same word. If he is confused and thinks we are insane? New word. Fingers crossed that he likes the concept and drives to the jump (I think he will :))
>>So for live camp tomorrow, the heat index will be 105. We will try our best to hang in. I also realized when I tried to film today that I left my tripod in GA… which I guess is better than leaving my heart in San Fransisco, but I have to see if I can get a replacement. The stars aren’t feeling in my alignment>>
LORDY 105!!!!! We will do very short blasts, the structure of it tonight is short sweet blasts bcause it is going to be hot everywhere. And you can maybe let him plop in a baby pool as a reward 🙂
Darn it about the tripod! You can tape the camera to something LOL!!!
See you later 🙂
TracyHi! She is doing well here, you tackled all of the hardest stuff from the live class 🙂
On the first video:
>>Spins in general confuse me. My body just doesn’t want to turn like that but I think I got it done,>>
You totally did! This session was really strong!
The FCs look good but I think the wings are a little too close – she is past you and at the wing before you have time to think 🙂 The spins are looking good too! But more distance will actually make them easier because you will have more time to move in and out of them. You can put the wings about 18 feet away or more.
The tight blinds look strong too!! Especially at 1:28 – great timing and great attention to reward placement.
Remember to bring your arms in closer to your sides (wings in!) so that you can be super quick on the blinds.
Adding the the FC and the spins looked great too, her commitment looks great, your timing is solid and you connection was spot on.
2nd video, double blinds:
I agree, double blinds are hard but you gave her cookies whenever something went wrong so she was happy to keep trying 🙂
You got them really well in terms of timing at :24 and :40! The trick is to do the first blind before she arrives at the first wing, then the 2nd blind as soon as you see her nose come around the first wing. That is pretty much what you did on those 2 reps. You did a great job staying in motion; that is really hard too but it really helped her. As with the single tight blinds: wings in! You will be even quicker if you can just change where you are looking, rather than have to also change your arm position.
3rd video: wrap ladder
1st rep was pretty strong til the wrap when she was facing the tunnel at :19. It is possible that your position was blocking the wing a little so she went right past you into the tunnel (which is a big distraction for sure). Be sure your position lines up to the jump cups, so she can fully see the wing.
She was definitely better on the 2nd rep – it looks like you showed the wing more and you had your verbal going too!On the other side, I think you moved a little too fast on the right turn wing after the tunnel so the countermotion was definitely harder for her – also, she might be a lefty, not a righty, so that can contribute to why that side was harder. Good job rewarding the commitment there! You can slow down your motion, so you stay in motion but basically a slow jog or fast walk. You can also drop the reward sooner, as soon as she turns to the wing. That can help make going around it more automatic because she will learn to look for the reward back there more and look at you less.
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning!
This is off to a good start!!! Looking at getting her to move past you more and more:The main goal now for the next step is to throw the reward before she looks at you. It will be really early-feeling, because you will want to throw it as soon as you accelerate and say Go, and as soon as she looks forward. You can move in even closer to the tunnel to help get this so she drives ahead more, and also add the rest of the jump back to the wing (I think it will be a bigger/better visual for he to drive to now.
She was looking at you during the throw here, which means she is not yet ready for you to wait til she chooses to pass you… because she will look at you then you will throw, which rewards looking at you 🙂
And then when you add the wrap on the wing – throw for the next jump, driving ahead of you to the jump and tunnel after it.Remember to decelerate into the FC on the wrap – you were hitting the brakes on the turn without decelerating, which was pulling her off.
Also, I think the foundation of this has gotten a little diluted so you can re-visit toy races, or start them if you never played them. Toy races are the foundation for driving ahead: first to a toy on the flat, then to a jump. I play them pretty systematically to help get the driving ahead.
On the flat:
Then basically you repeat the process with a jump and a low bar, starting with the toy thrown out past the jump before you let go of the dog, then when she is driving ahead nicely, you can start running to the jump and when she is looking forward, you throw the toy (or someone else throws the toy). And same with a short, straight tunnel!
These are fast & fun (also good for your puppy on the flat!). Let me know how they go!
TracyHi!
It is great to hear that you have so much access to people who can help the dogs, and that you help the people 🙂
She adjusted a lot, that can definitely contribute to weave avoidance and also teeter avoidance – it might have hurt to ride it down and feel the slam of it!T
Hi!
>> I don’t do tons of luring but when I do I add a lot of small pieces of variety and fade the lure as quickly as possible and I think he appreciates that. He doesn’t appreciate being babied or talked down to. He just wants me to explain the concept and then get out of his darn way.>>
True!!!! Shaping with a lure here and there really helps! And whenever there is a lure, there must be a plan to fade it, which is part of the fun 🙂
>>I feel like we’ve seen that in Max Pup where you’re like – “Okay, now do the cha cha, followed by the rumba” and I’m like “What?” while Ripley’s like, “Got it, cha cha, rumba, now what.”>>
Yes! I have found that if we teach the dogs the concepts, then they are very sponge-like and transfer things very easily. They pick up all the dance moves very quickly LOL!
T
Hi!
If possible, I vote for the wing jumps because they are easier for the dog to see, and easier to do the wrappy stuff that I have planned 🙂
TracyHi!
>>he would hopefully sleep and not drive us all nuts.>>>
Ha! I guess I only get to see “Working Ripley” and he is always serious and perfect, so I forget that he is probably a normal teenager in the house LOL!!
Well, he sure seemed happy with all the treats used to teach this and he figured it out really nicely! Plus, no sprinting for you LOL!
Has he ever done this before, or is he just a sponge who absorbed it really fast in both directions?>>I like the idea of more options to not start flat-footed with him.>>
Yes! Great for resets in training, starts without being flat-footed, and also I use it as part of my active warm up before runs, to get the bending in both directions. (Sloowwww leg weaves then this behind the back game).
>> I feel like my 0 to 60 is much slower than his (it’s one of the reasons I think I’ve been avoiding too much decel on course – since too much and it’s really hard to get back up to speed).>>
Yes, 0 to 60 for humans is hard! I will get a video about more decel – you will actually find that decel gets you up the new line faster because the decel allows you to push off better. The hard stops and rotations don’t allow for as much push off. I worked with a soccer coach back in the days of running on international teams, and he sorted out the decel being quicker to get turns for me! We can definitely discuss it more because it helps me run better and helps the dogs turn better 🙂
Tracy
Holy cow 103?!?!?! I cannot believe how hot this summer is. The weather here in southwest Virginia is normal but everyone else is getting crazy temps.
Do you remember which spots the chiro adjusted? Usually it is T12-T13 but I like to keep track so we can send dogs to the chiro with good info if we see something in the ring 🙂
TracyHi!
This is a really great facility – more room to run, looks like great footing, and great distractions!!!! Where is it? It is so valuable for a young dog to work in a setting like this!!
This course totally looks familiar LOL! It is fun to see it setup and getting dogs running on it! He did really well and his DW looked really good! The camera cut off his a-frame bottom so I will assume he was perfect 🙂
After hitting the contact and getting rewarded, most dogs will self-release like he did, so you can reward, release, then reset him on the bottom when you want to do the next part. That will help prevent ay self-releasing.
He found the backside brilliantly after the DW!! I don’t think you have time to do the spin there because it was hard to reconnect quickly and the rotation puts you behind him – he is speedy! He almost ended up on the wrong side of you on the first rep at :36 and he did end up on the wrong side on the 2nd time through there. So rather than try to be faster to reconnect… you might find it a lot easier to just send to the backside with your fly verbal on your right, and take off, o your right, no spin. A little name call or a left verbal will keep him looking at the correct line and get a good turn, and you will be ahead because you won’t have to rotate at all.
Nice job on the tunnel threadle after that big long line! That is hard and you made it look easy 🙂
Nice adjustment to open your shoulders and connect more when he missed the tunnel at 1:51 (your shoulders turned away too early) – you were much clearer at 2:12 when you kept your connection to him for longer until you were sure he was committing to the tunnel.
Great job here! I am looking forward to seeing more!
TracyHi!
Looking at both videos in a row:The evening session looked great! He was driving ahead beautifully, and going back to the tug between MM moments 🙂 When you got further behind at 1:06, he wasn’t chasing you but didn’t quite have his organization together so he bailed on the line – he fixed it on the next rep 🙂
And the other side was perfect – there was a little steam coming out of his ears but he got it right!
He is also doing a great job of wrapping the jump and chasing you to the tunnel… and committing to the tunnel without any questions. SUPER!
Today’s session looked great too – when he is on your right, the angle of the tunnel exit does present a little zig zag so you were great to help by getting close to the wings. And on the last rep, you added the wrap in really well and then drove all the way through it – looked GREAT!!!
So keep going on this track -any time we need him on a straight line, we can have a reward target out ahead – and on something like this, you can have a reward target out on the end of both lines: a MM on one side, and maybe a big empty food bowl on the other side that you can toss the lotus ball or treats into.
You don’t have to use this setup (you might be sick of it LOL!), more handling games are coming soon 🙂 You can also play with the rear crosses with the reward target placed more on the direction of the turn, because he has to drive ahead and find the jump for those.
>> I was wondering if the other exercise with the backside wraps using the MM would be good since it’s reinforcement for him not chasing me as well?>>
Yes, that is a great countermotion game!!! And different than all the sprinting you had to do here LOL!
Great job! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi –
>> I have a 4 on for the teeter (touch) and a 2 on (feet) for the dog walk (which I haven’t started training yet). How do I use this game for both, or can I?>>
Because you will have 2 separate stopped contact behaviors, use the lazy contacts game for the 2o2o dog walk position only, because the board doesn’t move. And the 4on will only be for the board that does move 🙂
>> I was going to put my foot target at the end of the dog walk using the “feet” command and then back chain. >>
Start at the end of a plain old plank, so you can sort it all out away from the actual obstacle, to protect the future understanding of the behavior.
T
