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Hi! This was a good session to get us closer to the goal for sure!
Moving the MM closer really helped and just doing a bunch of reps really helped, so she could begin to predict where the reinforcement is going to be. One suggestion to also help: let the MM do all the “talking” – you can be silent and when she lands in position and looks forward, just click the MM (praise after she is at the MM). When you were praising and releasing, she was wanting to look at you. So, we take that out for now until there is more of a reward history for looking forward and not at you then it will be no problem to talk to her.One other thing you can do is click sooner – split the behavior a little more. She is very skilled at being able to down AND look at you LOL! So you can look for that first moment when she gets on the board, where she is looking ahead and beginning to move into the down: you can click that and she can go get the treat from the MM. Splitting it like that will isolate the choice of looking forward and balancing. Then you can gradually change the timing to get the full down while still getting the looking ahead. It will actually help the down behavior because it will be easier without looking at you 🙂 And is she is in a down and looking ahead but one foot is off the board, you can just call her off to restart so you can reward all 4 feet on the board 🙂
Another session or two like this one and I think she will be ready for us to move the MM further away and add more motion too!
>> She seemed to have more difficulty coordinating herself when she was getting on the R side of the see-saw and I was on her right.>>
That was just because she likes to look at the momma LOL!
>>I am in the process of making a wobble board (which may turn out to be more of a mini see-saw than a wobble board – but I think it will do) – just need to get a bracket to hold the pvc pipe underneath – then we can practice her end position on that too…>>
Perfect! That will also help 🙂
Nice work here! Let me know what you think!
TracyWelcome to needing 3 or 4 arms now for teeter training LOL!!! She is looking MUCH happier with this weird getting-on-the-board game with the board being relatively unstable. Yay! I mention the need for 3 or 4 arms because ideally you would have one hand holding her or feeding her so she doesn’t get on the board before you are ready, one hand holding the board, and then another hand to deliver a cookie for hopping on LOL!!! Since that 3rd arm is likely not available 🙂 you can have cookies in your ‘wait til I am ready’ hand (she can also hold a stay there, as that can build anticipation too!) and then the board holding hand is empty: so you can grab the board, ask her to hop on, cookie her for hopping on – then do the countdown and target cue.
>>. I wasn’t quite sure if I should actually count down or not so mostly I did not but I think during one rep I did.>>
For this early stage it was fine to just get her happy getting on to the board. She looks so much happier now, so we can show her more about the game and add end position – historically, she always gets really into any of these weirdo games as soon as we tack on the end position LOL! So try this now without the milk crate – the target will still be there for her to get into the 2o2o, and one hand holds the board, the other hand holds the cookies, so you can get her into the rhythm of hop on, get cookie, countdown, target cue, board drops, cookies for targeting, release.
Feel free to noodle around with the mechanics before you add her to the picture so you are comfy with which hand to use. You can hold the board with the dog-side hand and deliver cookies with the opposite hand, or vice versa, whatever feels easiest. I personally found it easier to hold the board with my bigger dogs when I was standing up a little straighter or bending my knees a bit – that way my legs could assist with the board and my back didn’t have to do all the work 🙂
Let me know if that makes sense! Adding the elevator game and getting her happy with it is basically the big step towards running the full teeter – she prefers it when we humans are SUPER clear with this so take your time at first, no rush as you sort out which hand goes where. And then you will see things come together very quickly after that. FUN!
Great job!
TracyHi!
He did really well getting the indoor behavior to move outdoors! No problem, from what I could see. And by the 3rd mountain climber rep, he was running up the board then weight shifting at the very top: perfect. Yay! He cracked me up by joining you in the reset moment: where is my peanut butter, human??
The angled entries were no problem, he seemed to find it really easy to line up to run up the board. And he was happy to let you run past and also his sends looked great. It is a rare and beautiful thing when behavior generalizes like this!>>We also did an elevator game, bang it and some downhill to the target with a 10in tip (a bit less than in the basement) and Nemo as a reward after the cookie on the target but someone forgot to hit the red button to record…>>
I feel that pain…. Elektra’s first full teeters are not on tape because SOMEONE forgot to hit the stupid red button (Someone = me LOL!!)
How did he do on those games? If he had any questions, then you can repeat that or simplify the games to help in the new environment.
If his behavior looked pretty much the same as it did indoors – you can focus on the Elevator Game. Part 2 adds the height and motion separately. And since his Mountain Climber review looked great, if Elevator 2 also looks strong then I recommend going to Elevator 3 (posted yesterday) soon 🙂Great job!!
TracyGood morning!
She is doing really well here! All of the games are moving forward really nicely.On the elevator game, as the board gets higher – because she is sometimes NOT careful with herself, start the board lower so she can hop on without splatting and reward – then raise it, then countdown then cue the target. Starting it that high was too hard for her to safely jump on and we don’t want her to splat herself LOL!!
The targeting element looks really good here. So we move on to the next steps:
I scrolled back to see if we have done any motion with the elevator game, but I don’t see it. She has experienced you moving with the bang game, so we can add your motion to the elevator game as well. Start with lower height to reduce that variable. Do everything the same: but right after you give the ‘tee’ cue, start to walk forward and see how she does (she will probably be just fine :)) Then continue to add more motion with that lower height. And on subsequent sessions you will then be able to add the higher height – at which point you can do to the Crazy Elevator game 🙂 Yay!Keep an eye on her front feet during the end position work – she tends to one to keep one foot on the board instead of both feet in the grass. My guess is that that will go away when you are moving, it only seems to happen when you are next to the board.
She is also doing really well with the downhills! Only one suggestion here – if you are moving when you deliver the ‘tee’ cue, keep moving – do anything in your power to not decelerate or stop near the end of the teeter because we don’t want her to cue off of that. You can move slowly, but don’t stop 🙂 And I think she will be fine with movement now!
So since both of these are looking really strong – when you do a session of Elevator 2 with your motion, if that is successful like these sessions were: you can get started on Elevator 3 (Crazy Elevator Game :))
Great job here! She is getting really close to the finished product 🙂
Tracy
Good morning!!
>>I’m feeling the pressure here because I feel far behind >>
Understandable! I think some planning will help you feel less pressured (plus we have a solid month more to post videos – one more set of games will be posted next week then we keep doing video review through May).
But first planning: You might be looking for too much perfection before moving on, which means you repeat things that don’t need to be repeated 🙂 The goal is approx 90% success for 2 sessions… then we move on to the next step 🙂 The other thing you can do in terms of planning is pick one track to work through, rather than both. Training time is limited, so you can choose to focus on one track which of course means it all happens faster 🙂
So at about the stage we hit striding, I chose to focus on *just* the channels with Contraband (2x2s were not helping his striding and time is limited, so I chose not to bother trying to work it through on 2x2s when I was getting the behavior really nicely on channels). And with the girls, I did the opposite for a while (only 2x2s) and then towards the end put them back into channels.The other thing I suggest is to, at this point, do all motion – all the time 🙂 No slower than a fast walk, but try to get into more jogging and running. And I feel the pain of watching to see what he is doing in the poles – you will get really good at jogging and staring at the weave base to see what he is doing LOL!
>>I straightened the second set of 2×2. I was very happy with our progress. I really really really tried to avoid the lava zone but may have had a small relapse>>
This went really well! And I think I only saw you in the lava zone one time hahaha He had a nice high rate of success here!!!! That makes 2 sessions in a row, yes? So now we go to the next step.
A couple of thoughts for the next step:
He was fast and accurate here in the 2x2s, but he uses his body MUCH better when you work him on the channels. He is hitting the 2x2s a bit and his head is higher. So I vote for channels for the next sessions because of what we get in terms of behavior plus it will be 6 poles.At this stage, to get ahead past the 3rd pole as he enters, use the wing or cone to send and wrap on the straighter/easier entries, and do the big sends from the hard angles (like you did at the very end, that was gorgeous) – that way you can also layer in arousal and speed while still being all around the clock.
One other thing to think about – getting the striding sorted out on 4 then 6 poles and all the entries and running and Find’Ems – then it gets MUCH easier to get to 6 straight poles and then 12 straight is SIMPLE 🙂 Wheeee! So you are working all the foundation and that will make the final stages go very quickly 🙂
>>Also enjoy me finding that my tripod fell over. Miraculously, it fell after our first session as I was headed to a break.>>
OMG that was HYSTERICAL: “Mother%$&^&^#$(!” I feel that so deeply: Elektra’s first full teeter session was amazing and gorgeous and I was so happy… and then I noticed the tripod had fallen over so I had fabulous footage of the grass. And Hot Sauce’s first set up gorgeous straight weaves was done when I forgot to turn on the camera. OOPSIE! LOL!!!!
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
These are going well, as usual 🙂>>I can’t wait to get to 12 poles though because 6 does not allow me to easily get a blind or front cross!!>>
Agree! I can only get them on 6 poles when I send from basically 6 o’clock LOL! 12 poles are coming next week.
>> When I was late with the throw, he did turn to see me which I guess is not ideal. I want him to know his job is to drive forwards no matter what, although he only turned after the 6th pole.>>
Actually, I think he was fine with his driving ahead in the poles and then he was correct to look for you on the exit: as soon as he exits, he should already be processing the next cue. On the reps where you did the rear crosses, for example, he should exit turning to your position and not driving straight. So it is fine to wait for him to exit before the throw and then thrwo on the line the handling produces – you can see when you were trying to throw a little earlier, he was hitting poles 5-6 at :07, :11, & :17. So, letting him exit and look at you a little there is fine 🙂
>> I was able to do a rep with counter motion which he was ok with.
Yes! That was really strong!!!
>>The last couple of reps in the video are with 4 poles only, practicing that 7’oclock angle. It is still proving a little difficult as he doesn’t seem to be able to notice where the first pole is. I guess that will come with more practice.>>
Good job isolating that. You can even open poles 1-2 a tiny bit to help so you can add more motion now as well. It is a really hard angle and he will get it with more practice 🙂
>>Next session should we do the harder angles with poles 5-6 open, or would it be better to play the third find ’em game?>>
Planning for the next session, I vote for the Find ‘Em game 🙂 That should be played on 6 slightly open poles because the variable is the tunnel discrimination, so the poles themselves should be a little easier. That session will tell you what is next: if it is easy for him, then the session after it should be harder angles on 6 poles and then moving to 6 closed poles after that. If he finds the Find ‘Em hard (less than 90% success) then you can play that game a few more times before going to the harder stuff on 6 poles. That Find Em is an exaggerated set of courses challenges which hopefully you’ll find very useful for his entries and exits 🙂
Great job!!!
TracyHi!
Thanks for the update! Not sure if there was a video link too?
It sounds like the left side sends are going really well – poles 1-2 are straight. Have you added poles 3-4 there yet? If not, it sounds like she is ready for you to begin the next steps with poles 3-4 added. Yay! If so, let me know how it is going.It is pretty normal that one side is harder than the other – for the right side entries, you can isolate them in a little clicker shaping session: have them straight, you will be pretty close to them, and allow her to offer going through. Start with an easy angle/entry and then work up to harder ones. Click every correct entry and then toss a treat nearby. I did this with my smallest dog who was having the same trouble you describe – I did it in my living room on a 5×7 area rug 🙂 2 shaping sessions like that turned on her lightbulb and now the right side entries on straight poles are much better 🙂
Let me know how it goes!
TracyHi there!
Hooray, this is the week you get to see your parents! That is so awesome!!!Let’s talk teeter before your week gets busy again:
The target fading on the board was good especially at the beginning. When the frisbee is further away and you are right next to him, he looks at you a lot. So, for now, make it one or the other – if yo uar enext to him, have the frisbee target close. If you are moving, then the target can be further away.
Speaking of the targets – looking at the bang game, I think the frisbee target and the blue target are probably redundant at this point… let’s just take the blue tape off. I don’t think he is using it anymore that much, maybe once or twice but not that much over the course of these 3 sessions. Otherwise, the bang game looks good – add some more tip to it, fade the blue target, and keep the motion in 🙂
On the elevator game, you can now start him very close to the end of the board so his down is right at the end. Also, same as with the target fading on the plank – if you are next to him, have the yellow frisbee close. If you are moving, it can be further away (and you can definitely add motion to this game now) – with you next to him, he looks at you a lot (because, starving for cookies hahaha) so we move you more and get the cookies out of the picture 🙂
You can definitely be moving to the Elevator 2 game, with more motion after the drop of the board, and also adding more height after he hops on. Try to get it as high as you hip, or higher!
>>I think you had said that as long as he is focused forward as he goes into position, it’s not such a problem if he checks in with me afterwards.
Yes but I think that was delaying he position because he was slower to down and his elbows were up – he was definitely craning to look at the cookies LOL! But motion will solve that 🙂
>> If I only have a chance to work on the teeter once this week – what would you recommend we focus on?>>
Elevator Game 2! And also a brief refresher of Mountain Climbers.
That leads us into the new games posted today, which take us to the full teeter. Wheeeee! But I figure we will keep the forum open til the end of May, so there is no rush to try to get those finished yet.
Let me know what you think! Have fun with your parents!
TracyHey there! Wow, if I had to guess, I would have said you were just in a different part of your field. His behavior on the end of the board looked really strong on the bang game – he was a little extra pumped up so the extra cookie to line him up will help so he doesn’t try to rip himself out of your hand. Also note how he is looking down at the target as he leaps on and not at you – that is great and makes for better weight shift!
The elevator game also looks good, easy peasy in the new place LOL! He was cracking me up with his scratching. Same as with home game, try to get him to the very edge with the hop on cookie and keep placing the reward right past the very edge of the board so he gets his toes right to it (I run back to hand it to the dog more than throw it to her at this point)
>> Just another day at the office.>>
That sums it up! He was amazing! At this point, I have two suggestions: first, add more height to the Elevator Game so you have him hop on low, then raise the board gradually so it can be at the height of your hip or higher, then do the countdown and drop the board. If he is really comfy, you can get it almost all the way up in the air! Then, when he is happy with that for a couple of sessions, the next step is to focus on the Elevator Game part 3 that I just posted today 🙂
>>When you talk about fading the target, why do we switch back to the plank?>>
To be very honest, it is because there are going to be screw ups by me and by the dog… and I want those screw ups to happen on the plank because the plank is meaningless in the grand scheme of things. Then, after I have fixed my screw ups and have gotten the mechanics right and taught the dog what I want, I can take clean mechanics and an existing foundation right over to the teeter, creating a session with no screw ups. That creates a history of success on the teeter 🙂 And it makes fading the target on the actual teeter very simple and stress-free.
The other reason is that we are still going to be using the target on the teeter for a bunch of the games, so we can get the fading going separately and then when we are ready to fade it on the teeter: it is super easy to do.
>> Because my target is a piece of yoga mat folded in three to make it more noticeable, should my first fade be to make it one thin layer, but make it cover the same amount of seesaw/board?>>
Yes, I love that plan. Thinner, then smaller, then smaller… then smaller… then gone 🙂 It might take a couple of sessions and that is fine.
Lovely work! Let me know if the plan makes sense 🙂
TracyHi! Sorry about the crappy weather! This was a great session though – you could see her lightbulb go on and she was all like “oh! This is not too bad at all” You didn’t even need the 4-wheeler LOL!
And I think you read my mind sometimes – right as I was about to type “you can add motion to the board” – that is exactly what you did. Great minds LOL!
So since the thing that spooked her was that board being up in the air running down to it, the elevator game becomes important: so let’s morph this setup into a mini Elevator Game – before we make it the true elevator game, use this exact setup to show her how to “hop on” when you are holding it. Of course, because there is something under the board here, you will be ‘fake holding it’ but you can also have a little tip so the board is not 100% stable when she jumps up. Then feed her for hopping on, then keep peanut buttering her as you lower the board or let it land on the milk crate.
When she is happy with that, we will work it into the real elevator game and focus a lot of getting her to weight shift so she doesn’t get worried again. And if she does do something like get too forward and come off the end, just have a massive party as if it was the BEST thing ever (she is not the type of dog who will keep repeating that behavior even if we reward it, so the party is more to keep her happy and not let her over-think it if it was uncomfortable).We will be using the elevator game to bring the full teeter together, so when we revisit the downhills she should have an even better understanding of how to use her weight shift. Let me know if that makes sense! I am exciting to see her Elevator Games as they are the beginning of putting it all together 🙂
Tracy
there is some tip to the board,
Hi!
Hooray for good weather!!!
>>ere’s our session. I moved the tunnel way back and curved it, and put the tire where the exit of the tunnel used to be. The tunnel doesn’t show in the video, but you can hear her running through it sometimes, and it is there.>>
Yes, and I think the toy landed in it once or twice LOL!
>It seemed to make a difference, and we got some nice bouncing.
Yes! Lovely speed and striding. That is exactly what we want.
>>She was slower at this point, and did a bit of trotting on the last run. I figured it was getting harder and she was tired – so we ended there.
I think she was just tired, so you can structure the sessions a little differently. Maybe do one rep with the weaves where you last left off… then immediately tighten them a notch or 3 or 4 more reps – but only one tighten-up moment per session. Then she gets a break. Then after a break, either do another session at the angles where the weaves were (if she had any questions in the previous session) or do one rep where you left off… then tighten them up one more notch for another 3 or 4 reps.
That way you still get them tighter but super short sessions with very high speed throughout. If she is successful, we keep tightening every session or two. If she has trouble, we can stay at one level or take out some of the motion (or both :))
>>She did seem to check with me mid-course (near the poles) if I was behind
I noticed that too – you can throw the reward while she is weaving so it lands before she looks back at you. That will be easier to do on 6 poles 🙂
>>So, what do you think? More at this positioning? Start here and close up more? Open a bit first, then close up again?
A plan for the next session can be one rep where you left off, then straighten poles 1-2 (they are really almost straight here, right? Then 3-4 more reps like that. After a break you can come back later that day or in a couple of days, do one rep where you left off, then tighten poles 3-4 🙂
Pretty soon we are going to be on 6 poles! Yay! Nice work here – let me know if the plan makes sense 🙂
TracyHi!
>>I totally missed that in video review! Sorry! His kiddie pool is in that corner so I sent him in to swim. I try to use that one over the nasty bird bath that he prefers.>
Ha! I thought you left that in for my entertainment LOL!
>>I’m always so worried about speed since I really have to work to power Callie’s engine, so your feedback here is helpful. I tend to get fixated on it. Thank you!>>
Yeah, understandable! Sometimes they feel slower but they are not 🙂 And sometimes I let young dog training a little slower so they can be thoughtful – I personally think my Contraband is a little slow right now in the weaves, and that is GREAT because he is not screwing up, he is not killing himself, and he is not biting me as other BorderWhippets do to their handlers. So, if he wants to be a little slower until it all clicks into place? Perfect! We know how to get them to run fast when we want it 🙂
Hi! I will be heading over to the Teeters forum in a few minutes 🙂
>>Oh, I also included a video of Nikko doing her weaves (open at 2″ too), since I’ve mentioned hers. I think a key to her speed might be how she lowers her head to drive through.>>
Head position is influenced by a lot of things in the weaves – structure, size, experience, etc. How big is Nikko compared to Presto? The other thing is the reward – his head will come down with a toy reward instead of a Manners Minder, so you can switch to a thrown toy and see how he does.
Also, he will drop his head when he wants to go faster, and he wants to go faster when you move. And that is fine, because we definitely need to add more motion. Because reps are limited, you don’t need to do any more right now where you are completely stationary. Add motion to all of them!
Now one thing about the motion: start moving right away, as soon as you cue them – and move fast 🙂 When I was watching the video, I noticed that you had a tendency to stand still or move very little until he was just about at the end, then start moving. On the reps where you started moving fast in that moment, he had an error. So the next thing we need to show him is how to weave with you moving fast fast fast the whole time 🙂 So if speed is the difficult new variable, and if he has too much failure at 2″ tightness: do a session or two at 3″ width to introduce your running. Then you will be able to tighten the, back up to 2″ after that, followed by getting them even tighter 🙂 Fun!
Nice work here! Let me know if the plan makes sense 🙂
TracyHi there! Look at him, weaving straight poles Yay!
>> the early part of the video, Cowboy is able to find most of the entries but is moving slowly. His speed increases towards the end as he becomes more confident and I am hoping that it will further improve on grass.>>
One thing that I think will help both indoors and outdoors is a slight adjustment to how you start each rep. Have him come back to you, stop your motion and line him up next to you. Get him pumped up with a little ready ready or gentle hand on his chest or hold the tab: then cue the weaves. That explosive start will add more speed to the weaves right away for both of you – and it actually is a good next step for him! More speed driving to the weaves will also mean he really has to sort out the weight shift to get in and go fast in the weaves. On the first session here, you were in a calm, smooth, steady slow-ish pace… an so was he 🙂 But I think he is ready for you to turn up the excitement a bit with that moment before the send where you both get ready then explode into it. The accuracy is looking good and he has the striding, so now we add the speeeeeed 🙂
On the last 2 reps at the end with the red and blue poles, you can already see that he is happy to explode to the poles, he just needed your permission 🙂 So definitely let him rip! Wheee!
And you can that outdoors too, even if the poles are not totally straight yet: after the reward, reset the training loop with a moment of engagement and excitement before the send.Nice work! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
Were you wearing the white claw a little at the beginning? LOL Too funny!>>His speed wasn’t there for me so I didn’t close the channels any.
I think for the most part, he was moving at a good speed. Was it the same as “early morning chilly day” speed? Not necessarily, but it would probably be more successful to close the poles when he was being more thoughtful anyway – he was still moving fast enough to be able to stride properly. He was a little slower on the rep at 1:35 but then he had a short break when you moved the giant tree limb LOL! and he came back fast after that 🙂 And then he looked a little hot on the last rep – you rewarded him but I could not tell if he had weaved successfully or not? But anyway – other than those 2 reps, I think his speed was good and you can close the poles. If it is crazy hot – just do 3 or 4 reps and end the session so he doesn’t slow down.
>> I’m not sure why he was lacking in that department- we did have a day of training earlier and he had steak for dinner>>
So if he already had a day of training AND a steak dinner… I can see why perhaps he was not as speedy 🙂 I would also be a little less speedy in that moment 🙂 It sounds like it is getting hot there and also you are training more frequently. So you can plan for the speed stuff to happen when he is fresher during the morning when it is cooler, and the brain stuff can happen later.
Be sure to be watching his shoulders after the entry and throw the reward no sooner than when you see his left shoulder passing pole 3. That will help prevent the accidental early throw 🙂
Overall, you did a GREAT job of working the hardest challenge of being way ahead of him. He was a superstar and nailed the entries! So I think you can definitely tighten up the poles 🙂
Nice work! Fingers crossed for cooler weather!
Tracy
