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Hi!
Some ideas for you about which reinforcement procedures can go where:
>>1. Buccleigh: Start line stay in the agility ring at a trial
This is a combination of strengthening the behavior through the ‘catch’ procedure (more on that posted yesterday) as well as the remote reinforcement procedures (more coming in weeks 3 and 4 on that)
>>2. Buccleigh and Keltie: Increased confidence in the agility ring at trials. Both of them worry. This makes Keltie very slow and this is a consistent behavior for her. Buccleigh is either like a little bomb waiting to explode or he is slow and will sometimes just stop and look at me. Frequent rewards in the ring help so I think that being able to move the rewards out of the ring will help.
Yes – this is definitely a good one for remote reinforcement!
>>3. Buccleigh: Getting him to come to me at the end of the run. He has a tendency to head back to the start line and the gate we entered. I just realized that might be a product of my training our ring entry procedure at home where we exit and enter through the same gate. At agility trials we enter one gate and exit through a different one. Hmmm..>>
Also… remote reinforcement LOL! If he understands exactly when/where/how to get reinforcement at the end, he will come back to you.
>>4. I would like to be able to build value for toys so that I have something we can do that’s fun other than just feeding them.
Check out the building value for toys game I posted yesterday! We can get creative and add toys to some other really fun procedures and activities!
Tracy
Hi there! It was great chatting with you on Zoom!!!
>>As I brought up in the call, I am struggling with my 20month old Bichon bolting on me during class when he sees something more exciting going on. Rush is very smart and learns very quickly. A lot of my issues are handler related too I’m sure. He hates walking on leash and pulls most of the time. I’m struggling with breaking that habit.>>
I think you can get a 2-for-1 approach here with the leash walking and engagement – be sure that your reinforcement hierarchies are very clearly outlined your ‘get it’ procedure is VERY strong using food (with him on leash) because next week we add an engagement installation to it. For now – since he has to be on leash – maybe find a harness that he is more comfy with so the pulling is not as annoying to you and him? And also, you can stop the rehearsal of the leaving you and zooming by having him work on leash in group settings (and if the skill requires him to be off leash and he might struggle, then don’t work the skill). Bolting/zooming is not a fun thing for the dog, he just doesn’t know how else to earn reinforcement. So, continuing to ask him to be in that environment sets him up for too much failure. When the reinforcement procedures are stronger, it will be easier to get him successful in training scenarios.
>>I’m also struggling with contacts and getting through my head when to treat. He usually looks up at me before he does the nose touch and doesn’t touch the target completely.
You can abandon the nose touch and just do a foot target. The nose touch behavior was developed for dogs with a specific front and hind end structure (Border Collies!) and Bichons are different. So you can do a foot position and head bob to dramatically increase the rate of success. And if he is watching your hand, I suggest using the ‘catch’ procedure (work that away from the contact on the flat first, then in a stay). On the videos I posted yesterday, you will see a demo of me doing it with teeter behavior (2o2o).
>>My instructor wants me to try with the MM to get his focus more forward but I’m sure he will just go straight for it rather than doing the 2on 2off first.
Yes, a MM is a good idea but also yes, he needs to understand how to NOT just run to it. So you can start to install the MM into your remote reinforcement procedure. Also posted yesterday is the placed reinforcement games and you can play those with the MM! That will allow you to eventually use it the way the instructor described.
Tracy
Hi!
>>#1 Wish: Give the ball back. Please.
Does she run off with the ball, or come towards you but doesn’t release it? The get it and out procedure (especially reinforcing the out with another get it for the ball or a food reward) will really help there.
>>#2 Wish: Faster agility speed outside of the backyard. Annie is much faster at home than she is at lessons. While she tends to be a worrier, I don’t think she’s stressed at her lessons. I think she just has a history of mostly only being rewarded at the end of a course.>>
So her remote reinforcement procedure needs to be broken down to get more reinforcement into her at the beginning and middle of the course, not just the end! IF the reinforcement only comes after 20 obstacles, it makes sense that she would conserve energy earlier in the course and save it for getting closer to the reward at the end. More on the remote reinforcement work in weeks 3 and 4 🙂
>>#3 Wish: Stay in the weave poles even if you think your mom’s hand moved slightly toward her pocket.
Ha! That is partially a clean mechanics issue – if she is watching your pocket as a cue for ‘reinforcement is available’ then there is probably a history of your hand moving to pocket, reward appearing… then the reinforcement marker 🙂 So the hand to pocket is the reinforcement marker, not the word LOL! I am guilty of that too – my Hot Sauce has a fabulous toy ‘out’ with my hand touching my pocket as the cue LOL!!! OOPS! So really be attentive to when the hand goes to pocket, being sure it is after the marker. I also suggest 2 other things to help break that cycle:
– no more weave reinforcement from you hand. It is a bit of a poisoned cue right now, so we just delete it for the moment.
– instead, use a remote reinforcement process where the reward is elsewhere (behind her, off to the side, out ahead) and when she finishes the weaves, regardless of what your hands are doing – use your remote reinforcement cue then she can drive to the reward.T
Check out yesterday’s games about building value for toys! I think that will help!
>>The whole agility trial loop needs work, walking to the start line, doing the things, and leaving as well as other performance sports- mostly leaving and taking a reinforcer when you’re super high>>
Yes, that is mainly a combination of some of the engagement installations and the remote reinforcement procedures – more on that in weeks 3 and 4.
Hi!
>>Always always love working on interval between reinforcements and increasing that interval.
That will probably involve a combination of things depending on the context, but definitely the remote reinforcement procedures are key for that.
>> Also, working on me being quiet and still being a cue that a reinforcer is coming and you are doing well–almost a keep going cue but not exactly.>>
So basically – continue to ‘work’ without chatter from us 🙂 As long as the dog understands the context and environmental cues, I think tha can work for any of them. For example, the ‘catch’ marker – you can extend the duration of the stay behavior with you looking at the dog, then catch then toss back the reward. Ping pong the duration and your body language (for obedience, facing, arms down, no verbals, looking at the dog, right?) will be the keep going cue.
> And working on random treats that are on the ground and only the treats I specifically give/toss to you (i.e. doing a tracking test through a field covered in goose poop or heeling on an agility floor covered with left over treat scents and often treats).>>
I do LOTS of get it work in grass/dirt/leaves, etc – it is really important that the dogs understand that the get it is the ONE treat that you have tossed (and they see you toss it) 🙂 and to immediately re-engage. Then the delicious goose poop (eeww!) will fade away into the background 🙂
Tracy
Good morning!
>>All dogs were up, just sharing the space from a kennel and or ex pen.
He says that is too much 🙂 Especially if the dogs were not the usual friends in that environment. But – instead of agility, can he do tricks for swimming in that environment? Play friz? Agility does not have to be the primary thing installed at the moment. Engagement can be the primary thing installed. Next Monday, I will also be posting some engagement installations and I think that will help him too.
>>I’m really trying to add more distractions so hopefully we can trial someday but can’t quite get from sterile with no distractions to working past more than one dog there. It’s certainly not linear and some days are more discouraging than others.>>
Let’s take a different route – dial all the distractions all the way back. Reduce, don’t increase. Instead, install reinforcement procedures. Then I think you will find it much easier to fold in distractions. When distractions are difficult to add – it is not really about the distractions, it is about the reinforcement procedures. So set him up to understand more about the RPs and don’t worry about distractions for now. If we keep working distractions without the RPs in place, then the conditioned response will not improve and then it will continue to be frustrating to you both.
>>hopefully we can trial someday
The more I learn about dogs, the more I realize that competing is not about sport-specific skills or handling distractions… it is all about the clarity reinforcement procedures. I have complete faith that he will get it. In the lead up to the US Open, when I was getting CB ready for his runs (first competition runs, first outdoor trial, first all sorts of things) – I only worked on reinforcement procedures, not sport skills and not distractions 🙂
Catch is a super fun procedure and I agree – he was beginning to brace for it LOL! Good boy!
Yes, you are turning to him and starting to throw before saying the word on some reps. Try to mix in a little praise then ‘catch’ – that will get you to be a little cleaner. And for some dogs, we mix in a ‘ready, set….’ to pump them up but I am not sure he can do this yet – you can see how he does with the praise before the catch. And yes, you can cue a position if you think he will be successful – otherwise, let him offer. I like it when dogs offer in front of the jump because it means they are understanding the process we will use on the start line.He LOVED the whoosh! Wheeeee!
>>At the end you can see me go to pet him and he’s clearly like “no touchy while working” but also can tell the session is over by my affection. Smart boy.
Yes, let’s talk about it – I agree, he does not like the petting. That is not unusual for a lot of dogs who are working. So… don’t do it. Why would we add something that they don’t like to a scenario that we want them to love? I mean, when you are working and focused and concentrating on something, you would be annoyed if I came up and started petting your hair or draped my arm around yur shoulders. Ewwww, right?!?! And then when I approached in that scenario, you’d get a conditioned response of ‘ewwww.’ So – no petting needed unless he asks for it 🙂 And don’t take it personally if he doesn’t ask for it, he is not a whippet or terrier LOL!
Also, I don’t really want him to predict the session being over like that because note what he did: went off and did his own thing, in a work scenario. And that is precisely what you don’t want him to do in a work scenario (predict that he can leave). When he does that in a training scenario, you kinda hate it, yes? So we don’t want to build it in at all, anywhere. This is especially critical for dogs that are still learning how to engage in training.
I know a lot of people out there do ‘all done’ marker stuff but I am not a fan – it disengages the dog, handler disconnects and can also be a marker for a negative punisher (removal of something the dog wants – toys, food, engagement, access to work, etc). Poopy! So…. we can end the session differently, as a team, with engagement and reinforcement to continue to build behavior I want. The dog is always learning. So when you are done, you can have him come off the field with you, playing, eating treats, engaging with you, running back to the toy or bag of treats left outside the area. That also matches what the end of a trial run would be like! And then you can let him go for a run with his toy, or play a little frizzer or root around for some treats in the grass – all of which you remain engaged during even if you are just watching or cheering. You can release him to sniff or potty, or move with him abck to his crate area. The ‘wind down’ procedure after training or a run should still be engaging.Great job here! Let me know what you think about the end of session ideas.
Tracy
I can totally relate! No need to add more cues than needed, and also no need to change something that is already working so well!
Good morning!
>>I can tell you I’m stuck with bring it back only because she will bring it (toy or lotus ball) back but throw it at my feet. She wants a cookie for bringing it back OR she wants me to pick it up and throw it for her again. It’s a piece we have struggled with and it’s making the dumbbell retrieve a bit tricky as well, LOL!!
Any suggestions?A dumbbell retrieve and a lotus ball retrieve can be treated as different behaviors. I personally would tug on the dumbbell with her, so she has a reason to want to put it in your hand (trust me, she will not tug on it in the obedience ring because you can develop a procedure that tells her how long to hold it, when to release, when to tug on it, etc.)
But basically – sit on the floor and do little retrieves – hold you hand out as a target, nice and low, palm up. When she gets the lotus ball to hit your hand as she drops it, click then treat. The hand is a target for the lotus ball. At first you can help her by making the retrieves short and any interaction clickable – then she has to specifically put it in your hand to get the reward.
I have video of this with Nacho *somewhere* but I can’t find it at the moment. But here is something similar –
Voodoo putting the ball in a bowl as the target. You can start with a big bowl as a concept-builder then replace it with your hand.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ka6xrtHNNhA
On the video – good job with all of these! a little feedback on the mechanics, keeping them as clean as possible to strengthen the markers:
When you are working the Get it and snacks markers – try to be a little more precise with the verbal marker like get it coming before the hand moves. They were pretty simultaneous here and that will cause her to just watch your hands. Same with the shhhhhhh and also the catch – word then movement will help get them really clear so she doesn’t watch your hand as much.And when you did catch with the toy at the very end – say the catch word before you begin any throwing motion – you can see you turned, lifted your arm then said catch. You can lead out watching her to be sure she is not moving, then say catch then turn and throw (btw, this is the procedure I use to get great stops on contacts even when the dog is highly aroused and I am running – I do this in FEO runs too. In AKC where the reward needs to stay in your hand, you can use a really long toy so you are holding the other end. UKI has not such rules about thrown toys, which is why it is a far better place to train the contacts – you can throw a ball or something back to her as you run by.)
The Bite marker looks good – you can increase the challenge and see if she will move to the toy after the word, before you move the toy 🙂On the toy “get it”, the toy was too high in value so definitely you will want to work on getting that toy back starting in a smaller space. And it was also too high in value as the remote reinforcement toy but also a REALLY good indicator of how much the remote reinforcement procedure needs to be built up! That is the bedrock of trialing. Try to avoid any markers like “hey!” – just simplify the game by starting with lower value rewards and putting the reinforcement up on a chair or table so it is visible but less easy to grab. The ‘hey’ is a punishment marker and will increase frustration – making things easier will increase success and reduce frustration 🙂
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi again!
On the decel and turn, your mechanics were not off, necessarily – you might have felt weird because you didn’t really decel: you moved at the same pace then pivoted. So I think the only thing to add here is slowing down more clearly when he is about halfway to you, so he prepares to decelerate. He is doing really well with the stay! If you use a cookie toss instead of a stay, you can send him to a cookie toss and then run a few steps, which sets you up to be able to show a bigger deceleration. Great job keeping your reward nice and low!!!Great job here! He looks awesome!
TracyHi there! This was a really fun session!
This is a great start o getting toy play involved with his training! You made it such a fun game: chase the frizzer a couple of times, then you held him then tossed the friz. Since he does not love coming into you, I think you slipped the holding onto him really nicely into the session: he seemed super happy with it! Question: if you wiggle it around more and let him grab it… will he grab it? Will he pull it out of your hands? If yes – you can add in more of the grabbing and letting him pull it out of your hands.
Are there are other toys he really enjoys putting in his mouth? And, does he like to chase balls? I am planning how we can add in more toy play and keep it fun like you had it here 🙂 Eventually it will be no problem hold in him in close to you and letting him drive ahead to the toy then tugging with him.
Great job!
TracyHi! That fun match opportunity sounds amazing – what a great way to get a baby dog into the trial environment!!! And it sounds like he was pretty perfect – excellent choices on what to ask him to do!
On the wing wrap foundations:
Picking up where you left off, he did a great job here!
I don’t think you need the yes then the bowl marker, I think the dish is fine to mark the behavior and availability/location of reward. He was great with wrapping the gate! And had a distraction on the other side of the baby gate and he was fine with that too LOL! But then it was a little harder when the other dog looked out the window LOL! You can add challenge to the gate by extending it so it is a long wing to go around.
He also did well on the upright and was still great hen you moving it away. That is about as far away as we want him to leave for offering (it will become a cued behavior pretty soon), so we can work on other elements of it:
You can start to move the bowls behind you to begin the fading process for the bowls – still toss the treats into/towards the bowls but they will be less obvious.
I was going to suggest something bigger but you whipped out the blue bucket and he did well. Have you tried any of this with 2 toys? I suggest a quick revisit of the entire progression using 2 toys. It folds in arousal early on and teaches the dogs to find commitment even when there is a toy *rightthere* and possibly moving too!And have you started thinking about what verbals you want to use on your jump wraps? That is a whole ‘nother thing to obsess on 🙂
He was great about generalizing to the tree! I love it! Good boy! I definitely think you can get 2 toys involved – the behavior is getting strong and he is generalizing, so we can move forward into adding the excitement of toys.
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi! We are winding down and I will look at any remaining posts through December 1.
>>I was wondering how things went at the Open? Were you pleased? Wish I could see you and your kids run sometime. We see bits and pieces in your videos for class, and I can imagine how great you must be on a full, challenging course.
Thanks for asking! I was on the management crew at the Open (I was in charge of making sure all 8 rings of courses got built including several 5:15am course builds eewwwwww!), so it was more of a work trip than a competition for me. I ran 3 of the dogs a little bit on the first 2 days – the two baby dogs were AMAZING and Hot Sauce in particular was one butt-width away from the finals in those two events (I was in her way on one line at the very end of an otherwise brilliant speedstakes, and I didn’t get my sorry butt across the finish line fast enough in Snooker so another dog with the same score but a faster time got into Finals and she was the first to not get into finals. oops! LOL! Contraband made hs debut and he was perfect! I messed him up here and there but it was a great debut. And Voodoo, my experienced dog, struggled with the long layoff after Covid and sharing time with the 23 others (they all ran within a few dogs of each other) so he was blazing fast but both of us had errors 🙂 But it was fun and things ran smoothly on the work side of it for me 🙂
Have a great Thanksgiving!
TracyHi! This might be a better angle for it:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Oc3ESj8odL5y6wf2HYzy-RjnNYBUKpuhGPeuz2s8LpM/edit?usp=sharing
Let me know!
Tracy
