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Good morning! The wing wrap looked good here! And he was a good boy finding the poles on both sides of you (excellent job with your line ups to make sure he was on the correct side too)
He definitely was more pumped up for the toy and was faster. That will be great to keep increasing his speed!
The other thing I noticed is that he looks up at you a lot, which we need to change to get the speed and accuracy on 12 poles. We can convince him to not look at you by taking you out of the picture 🙂 During your next session – you will be seated the entire time 🙂 Pull up a comfy chair! Have some snacks! But you will be seated and not moving. Use just one base of 2 poles to get started (because he is going to think you have lost your mind) and the PT. Send to the poles from your comfy seat and reward from the PT. Then call him back, send again. And so on 🙂 When you need to switch sides, either move your chair to the other side, or move the PT to the other end.
When he can do it with you seated on 2 poles, we go back to 4 poles. When he can do it on 4 poles, then you can get moving again – but we need to take your motion out of the picture for now because he is coming to rely on it. He can weave when you are there, so no the focus shifts to weaving when you are not there (because you will not want to have to be next to him when he is weaving, you’ll want to be running to your next position on course :))it is fun to train from a chair LOL! And you’ll see him figure it out very quickly 🙂
Nice work here! Keep me posted!
TracyGood morning! Hope your butt and ankle feel better today!!!!! The things we do in the name of training…. LOL!
This session went well. I think he was not driving to the toy on the ground because he didn’t really know where it was each time. You can bring him to the start spot, then throw the toy to the end line, then cue the weaves so he can know where it is and find it immediately. He does better with the thrown toys because he can track them as they move so does not need to find them. But either way – the striding was good and I think at this point you need to close up the poles 🙂 The exit poles looked a little wider so he lost the striding – maybe put the entire set to a half inch of width and do a session just like this one. We should see the striding there too – at which point, the session after that can be straight 🙂 Yay! If he struggles at the 1/2 inch width, we dial back your motion variables until his success rate is higher, then we add them back (no more opening the poles unless he really really really struggles, which is unlikely to happen :))
Let me know if that makes sense – he is rapidly closing in on 12 straight poles!
Tracy
Hi! My general road map to diagnose issues is a progression through the following til we figure it out. I am sure you have already done some of these, but there are some other ideas:
– bloodwork to look for tick disease, inflammation markers and hypothyroidism. All of these can absolutely be the reason behind the issue he is having
– palpation by a rehab vet and also a chiro vet. This might turn. If he is muscular and tenses up, a sedated palpation is worthwhile
– radiographs of hips/spine/knees, neck, shoulders. And then the digital rads get sent out to be read by a radiologist because some little thing might get missed by someone who has a different field of expertise.– musculoskeletal ultrasound of the hind end (psoas, for example) and also shoulders. That can find things missed on rads and palpation as well as calcifications that might indicate something chronic in that area
All of the above is not all that expensive but it does add up which is what I start with bloodwork and palpation to narrow things down if possible.
And last but not least is an MRI, which is super expensive and basically a last resort.
I worked with Dr. Leslie Eide online to guide me through the process and well as some professionals here on the East Coast (one in North Carolina, one in Maryland) to get the diagnosis. Do you have sports vets in your neck of the woods?
Fingers crossed that this all becomes unnecessary and he just needs a little rest 🙂
let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
Yes, he definitely likes the fast fast fast stuff! I think he is doing fine with his footwork and some of it is the mats – a little slippy! Do you have access to grass or good dirt so he can grip? The footwork questions were more due to slipping and I don’t want him to slow down to answer those questions. He will get it immediately on grass then you can close them up.One thing though – I don’t recommend doing them as rocking horses like you did here as it ends up being a lot of weaving and a low rate of success. For example on this session, he did 8 sets of 6 weaves, which is a really good number. But he got paid directly for the weaves twice and one reward came after the wing wrap. So with correlating the wing wrap reward into the total – that was 3 rewards for 8 reps which is under 50%. And that can lead to confusion when he has questions that might cause errors because the rate of success is relatively low coming into that. Continuing to the next thing does eventually become a secondary reinforcement but for now the primary reinforcement is what we are looking for. Also, by doing the rocking horses, there were some perfect footwork moments that did not get rewarded – I would be looking to have a big cookie party for those in particular.
So to keep the speed and excitement, spread out the wings so there is more running into the poles. But continue to reinforce on a 1:1 ratio for now until he has a longer history of 90% or higher success rate on straight poles.
That being said – I am pretty sure the poles can go straight in the next session or two! He is looking great!
Nice work here! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning! Lovely session here. Meatballs are life! Meatball explosions are the BEST ever! Ha!
He looked perfectly happy to run up the board and shift his weight, hitting and holding target position. The only thing he didn’t want to do is release from the Meatball Extravaganza, but that is fine LOL!!!!So, next session: everything exactly the same:
Warm up with regular elevators
Do a couple of crazy elevators like you did here
One rep in the middle of the session is the full teeter
Then end on one or two more crazy elevators.The session should be a meatball filled party unless you have food that is even better than meatballs LOL!
And on the full teeter rep, a couple of things:
You should be moving but in a supportive way. Don’t sprint away and leave him in the dust 🙂 Stay near the board and try to plan to arrive at the end position as he does for these early reps.
Use your verbals similarly to what you did on the elevator games – teeter cue for getting on, then give the target cue when he is maybe halfway up.
And… reward anything that is even remotely correct, make a massive fuss over any effort to teeter: if he is perfect? Jackpot! If he is almost perfect? Still big rewards. If he has an oopsie and doesn’t get it right? Still reward because we don’t want him to overthink or get concerned. So basically, he is going to be paid no matter what (nice work if you can get it, right?)I am not worried about perfect criteria on the first full teeter because making it a great experience is far more important. He has a TON of understanding of the end position and stuff so rewarding one that is not perfect is fine 🙂
Nice work here! Keep me posted!!!
TracyGood morning and thank you for the great update!!!
It is those set backs that often push us to higher levels than we could even imagine. The dogs teach us a LOT! And I am glad you are using your FEO really well. The long term benefits will be soooooooo worth it!!! Put a video on Facebook, I wanna seeeeeeeeee!!!And give that girl some extra PB, she deserves it LOL
Hi! Because motion is hard, let’s start with something he might find relatively easy- both sets at 1&7. If I an wrong and this is hard when you are running, try both sets at 2&8. If he does a session and it is easy peasy, the next session should be straight poles 1-2 and the 3-4 poles still at 1&7.
Don’t change the pole tightness within a session, unless you need to open them to make it easier if he has a lot questions – if he is hitting homeruns, change the motion/handling variable 🙂 move faster, add the wings before the poles, do some crazy handling. 🙂
Have fun!!! And keep me posted 🙂UGH!!!!!! I really want to see you on the 21st. Do you need any vet ideas? Have they figured out the issue? Poor Summit!!!!
Hi!
What a good boy, ignoring the people and the Sheltie! That is great! And he was definitely excited to be there, he was faster for sure especially at the beginning of the session.A couple of ideas for you: since he tends to make mistakes when the MM is out there in the beginning of the outdoor sessions, you can start with the lotus ball and bring out the MM later in the session. You can also warm him up to ‘ignore’ the MM in order to earn it, by doing simple tricks near it. That should help! But he did really well with the lotus ball.
On thing from now on, all sessions: keep moving! You tend to default to standing still but we need to get you up to running 🙂 So – rather than tighten the poles or add more poles in the session, leave the poles where they are, a little open and the variable you change will be your motion. This can include both working up to running and also adding the handling challenges (rear crosses, countermotion, moving away laterally, getting way ahead, etc).
The good news is that he will really love it 🙂 Just keep adding the motion challenges in gradually – no need to do this on straight poles or even on 6 poles, because we would have to open them back up to add the running in now anyway.
So remember to layer in the motion gradually, and watch the success rate: if he fails twice, make it simpler: I would say at this point, make it simpler by staying in motion and opening the poles a little. We know he can do the poles when they are closed, so now we will enhance the skill or doing them while you are moving 🙂
Nice work here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
>>So what is the criteria for wrapping a wing half way around? >>
Not sure what you mean – do you mean what is the verbal? It is based on the shape the dog makes: a C or U shape or anything like that is the wrap verbal. If the dog does more of an “L” shape, then I use left or right.
>>I assume all mistakes are mine
Yes- but if you mark them with ‘uh oh’ and don’t reward… he will read it as a punisher (negative punishment) and the rate of success goes way down.
>>Will open the poles and see what happens what is a good starting point for how open?>>
On those high speed entries, I suggest starting at 2&8 to establish success. And if it is too easy, you can tight to 1&7. If it is too hard, you can open them up to 3&9.
T
Hi! Ewwww, 90 degrees! Stay cool!
I have some ideas (and questions for planning purposes) for the tunnel threadles!
Starting with the last video:
>>>Part of the arm position thought process is in regards to not confusing her with NADAC style motion. I am putting a recent video of that work….>>I think the NADAC style for distance with upper body, foot position and verbals is very consistent with what we are doing here. The get out arm and turn away arm is different than a threadle, in that they are out ahead of the body, up really high and moving in a bit of a swoosh to cue the turn. A threadle arm is back towards the dog, rotating your upper body towards her with your palm facing her nose (but at about your chest level). Looks different enough that you can use it and it will not confuse her (I have 7 different opposite arm positions/cues for my dogs and they are fine with them :))
Now on the tunnel threadle videos: I think the main thing will be to pick what you want the cue to look like in terms of your line of motion, feet, arm, etc and then stick with it. You were showing her several different things (rotation towards her like a lap turn, pulling away very laterally, moving towards the correct tunnel entry, sometimes with the arm, sometimes not). So if you pick what you want, she will learn it faster because it is very consistent in how to earn reinforcement.
There are a ton of ways to do it but I vote again the foot rotation (like the lap turn) because it will require you to both be ahead of her early enough to get the rotation and also the rotation will slow you down. I think the reps where you turned your feet towards the correct end the tunnel looked really great – and my favorites were when you moved very directly to it rather than pulling away very laterally – pulling away that laterally was effective for her to read your motion but it can leave you really out of position on a big course. I liked your line at 1:18 on the 2nd video, that was really strong!
So you can choose your physical cue and start it with the nice calm slow motion you had at the start of the 2nd video. Threadles are trained cues and not really ‘natural’ cues, so slowing the motion way down to get started will help her see it and process the verbal. When you were moving too fast, she stayed on her line to the straight-ahead tunnel entry.
The other thing you can do is turn the incorrect tunnel entry a little further away so it is less visible on the straight line – that will make getting the threadles even easier, especially when you add motion.Question: what is your threadle verbal? It sounded like In? But that might be too similar to her name (and dogs generally don’t turn all that tight when we call their names on course :))
Also with the threadle verbal, as you move slowly, you can repeat it so she can process it. And if you decide to go with the arm across the body, you can wave the arm to help her see it.
And one other thought about verbals:
>> With the barrel, I only use one command to get around it.
You might need to reconsider this if barrels are used in situations that have more than one exit. But if they are not used like that, no problem! She definitely did better when you had the different verbals on the wings! And you can use the same verbals on the barrels as you do on the wings, dogs have no problem with that 🙂
Nice work here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi there! This looks great!
The first 4 reps were really fabulous: lots of motion plus the crosses, no problem! I think that the games you’ve been playing here directly contributed to his success on the full teeter when you were way out ahead 🙂 Yay!He did think the rear crosses were a bit odd LOL!!! So you can put the target out for those rear crosses reps – either put the target on the plank, or put the cookie bucket out ahead, or both 🙂 As soon as he realizes that the rear crosses are a legitimate thing, he will stop looking at you and keep driving forward.
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
Heavy bread LOL! Now I am hungry! This session looked really great.
One little tweak that he is ready for on the crazy elevator game: don’t catch the board til he is ust about arriving at the end – if you catch early, he weight shifts early.The full teeter looked GREAT!!! You were caught in the moment and got way ahead… try not to leave him in the dust as much, support him by staying closer for now until he has more full teeters under his belt, so he doesn’t get tempted to bail off or stop early.
And the last crazy elevator looked great too, he was NOT worried about the full teeter and was still very happy.One more suggestion – you can remove the mat from under the down side of the teeter, so he doesn’t use it as a target – it is not reducing the slam a lot so you’ll still want to limit reps, but we want to be sure that the visual is correct as we transition this teeter into the trial ring.
Great job! More sessions like this will help get him used to the full teeter 🙂Tracy
