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Hi!
>>We have done a bit of driving straight out of the tunnel to a toy. >>
That might also be why she was freezing there – expectation of placement of reinforcement, then she was all like “WHERE IS MY THING?!?!?!” hahaha! Love her!
>>I also noticed that I need to be careful with my feet. If I didn’t step in with the appropriate foot she didn’t seem to understand.>>
Yes! Baby dogs are incredibly literal so you have to exaggerate your steps. But it will get easier (and it reminds me how much my experienced dogs cover me when I am wrong LOL!)
>>I used food specifically because of her arousal with a toy. Which is so funny since initially she wasn’t interested in toys. Now they are manna from the gods. I’ll play around with that some this weekend. We’ll be at her first trial so it will be a great opportunity to work on focus during arousal.>>
Working for the optimal internal states is SUCH a pendulum with young dogs, things can shift quickly and also unexpectedly. And conventional wisdom tells us that food is that way to work through the arousal stuff but I have found that toy play is actually much much better for it and also it helps us learn about the needs of each individual pup 🙂
T
Awesome! Welcome, great to see you here! If anything doesn’t make sense, let me know 🙂 Have fun!
TracyHi! Since this game is all about developing form, it was good to see all the things you played with to see what works best.
Bearing in mind that 10 month old boys are not known to be fully aware of all of the legs LOL!! I think he is doing well here! A couple of ideas:
I like that you shortened it to 5 feet – you might want to start the next session at 4.5 feet and see how it goes. He looks like he will end up being a 6 foot distance dog as soon as he sorts the whole hind end thing (definitely not sorted out yet, but that is NOT a worry, he is really young and this will help :))I see that toys brought more excitement into it, as did your motion. But they also brought less thoughtfulness into the mechanics of how to get through the grid with balance, so a couple of ideas on how we can get the best of both worlds:
The MM is definitely NOT the most interesting thing to him… but you can make more of a reinforcement sandwich: does he like tug toys? You can tug tug tug to increase excitement – lead out to the MM, release, reward with the MM… then as soon as he has swallowed the cookie, throw the toy or play tug. That will get him more excited for this setup in general and will also raise the value of the MM – without him diving into the ground for the toy.
I also suggest moving the MM further away – make it a solid 12 feet past the landing spot of the 2nd jump (so will probably total out at 15 feet) – he was shortening a little because the MM was so close, plus your position out there will make it more exciting to drive to. I think his stay looks really good so you should be able to use that to your advantage here.
And the toy play being incorporated into it will build excitement and that will build speed – that way you don’t have to use your motion. If we install your motion too early, he will focus on your running and not on his mechanics, so for now, keep standing still.
One last idea for using a toy: we don’t want him diving on the toy on the ground, but you might consider getting a really huge holee roller toy – the dogs tend to scoop those as they move through, so there is no slamming into the ground but all the benefits of using a toy (I use one attached to a bungee a lot with my BorderWhippet)
When you added the bar, was that also when you shortened the distance to 4 feet? I think he is old enough to see that low bar, but I we can also see how he does on bumps at the shorter distance.
And, separately, he is a good age for us to start talking to him about his hind end. Three things come to mind: how is he doing with backing up independently? Have you started cavaletti trotting? And I also like to do ‘pop ups” where the dog is in a nice square sit in front of me, facing me, and I have them pop up to get a treat or toy from my hind – popping directly up, not striding towards me at all. That gives a little wake up to the hind end pushing off 🙂
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning and welcome!
She was a super good girl on this session! I love how it was very broken down to one ‘jump’ and the bowl and the stay, to basically just teach her the concept – we have a lot of time to get jumps involved and so this conceptual work was very fun to see.Her stay behavior is going nicely – I think at the beginning you had a few too many rewards in position then the big praise was mistaken as a release – you can totally release more often as that also helps build a strong stay behavior through the clarity of the release (either release forward to ‘work’ or throw back a reward and release to get it).
Does she like to tug? You can also play tug before and after the stay, and use the toy as a reward thrown back to her (rather than going back to hand deliver the cookie) – you can play tug, set her up, lead out to the bowl, and then either toss the toy back to her or release her and drop a cookie into the bowl.The form concept is going well – you spent time here working out the reinforcement strategy of when to get the cookie into the bowl and that is VERY useful! I think release-then drop the cookie worked best for her. You can remain standing as you release and then drop the cookie down into the bowl, you did that several times very effectively – dropping then releasing caused some errors on the stay. If you see her looking at the bowl, great! That is a great moment to release her. But if not – no worries, release anyway, the cookie placement will draw her focus to the bowl and the forward focus will develop naturally without any questions about holding the stay.
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning!
I am going to go make a quick gratitude offering to the tech gods for being so helpful here LOL!!! I love when the tech works!
Vahni did well here! She is so fun 🙂 I think we can smooth out the mechanics to get started: hold her collar or ask her to stay at your side, so you can connect and start when you are ready 🙂 on some of the reps where she didn’t do the wraps on the first video, I think she was just starting without you and guessing. Plus, she is clever – after 2 wing wraps she seemed to be thinking: OK, it will be the tunnel this time. SMART! So that means you will need to be extra careful about accidentally falling into patterns or rhythms 🙂
This was an interesting and fun session and I think gives us some insight into Vahni! The first couple of reps were really good! Then a little frustration, a little arousal, a little tunnel LOL! You stayed on Team Chill and worked her through without any demeanor change. That was great. And I think we will focus on teaching her to be as accurate as she was here, even as we build in more arousal. I love how your wrap and your tunnel cues sounded VERY different, that is helpful for her. I think the cleaner your transitions were into getting her on your side, connecting, delivering the cue – the better she did as the session went along.
One thing I see here (and we saw it a little on Tuesday night) was that she sometimes does not drive back to you after the tunnel to go to the wing. Now it could be that she needs to see more connection, or you need to let her see more of the wing (you might have been blocking it). Also, it might be an arousal thing – I see you were using food but I think you can mix in toy play to help her drive back and set up. I know it sounds crazy that more tugging will help balance her arousal – but when the arousal comes up, bringing play into the picture is often the very thing that balances it. So – tell me more about how she does with toy play and we will build it in!
On the 2nd video to the tunnel – she just needed a little more physical support on the cue to the tunnel, then she got it, And yay for going right back to the wraps. NICE!!! No freezing on the end of the tunnel here. Lovely session!
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning! Sooooo much great stuff here, she is doing really well! Yay!
Working through the videos:
>>We do use a left and right command for the wing wrap. However, we have separate commands for the barrel work and they are not left and right focused, so you will hear the same command for each direction. We then have a second command for the threadle or turn away direction on the barrel. I justify this because we will do NADAC and it seems more intuitive that way.>>
So the wing cues and the barrel cues are different? That makes sense to me – they are different obstacles and are using differently on course. And plus, the handling challenges in NADAC (particularly the distance challenges) do require a pretty large toolbox of verbals, so I am in favor of this!
Looking at the pre-games:
The wing wraps are going well! She is leading with her head and bending nicely! She looks confident and it looks like there is a lot of value there. You can also introduce toy play into this, either before & after the cookie rewards… or to replace the cookie rewards 🙂The barrels are also progressing very nicely! She is showing strong commitment and bending really nicely. Good girl!
Onwards to the proofing game! You can also use the barrels in the proofing game near the tunnel, not just the wing wraps, to work on all of your verbals and all the skills! I figure this is especially important with NADAC in the future for her – there are a lot of tunnel discrimination elements.Set point jumping foundation:
>>Issue 1: The Treat-n-Train decided the batteries were done, so had to improvise today.>>
I feel that pain – my TnT likes to work up until the moment of the first rep… then it decides it is not going to work. LOL!
>>Issue 2: Because awkward for me, it was a longer video. I edited to shrink it, not a strong point. Tried to cut most of our “catches” and down time.>>
The length was fine! No worries about needing to shrink it more. And great jump reinforcing the stays!!
She is off to a good start here! I agree that the jumps were too far apart at the beginning, I liked your instinct to pull the jumps closer together. Because it is a form game, the distance you moved to was great for producing the form. She is only 5 months old, so it will take her a while to get up to the ‘normal’ adult distance – it will probably end up being 6 feet but she is too small/young/puppyish to start there. The distance you used at the end was great, and then over coming months between now and 14 or 15 months old will be used to gradually inch the distance out between the jumps while maintaining form.
Also because she is still so young, do you have bumps or pool noodles? I like to teach form without the bars at her age, because the pups have a lot of sorting out to do with all of those legs LOL! And those legs are in a slightly different place every morning when they wake up 🙂 So using a pool noodle or bump or something gives the pups the opportunity to do all of that sorting out on irrelevant things. And then when the pups are more grown and more coordinated, we start to introduce the good form she has rehearsed to a bar.
One last suggestion – Great job building her stay, that is LOVELY for such a young dog! Try to look at her before you give your verbal release (or before you throw the reward back), I think she was moving a bit on your arm motion/head turn before the release early in the session. We want to protect that fabulous stay 🙂
Wind in hair – Yay! I agree, this went really well 🙂 She is being really good with her commitment, both on the wing wrap and also on the jump out ahead. Super!!! You were ahead of her on these, so an additional challenge you can add is stay really close to the wing as she wraps it, stay there til she is done with the wrap – then run forward to the jump (using your Go cue, that was perfect) – that will help her learn to drive ahead of you. She was finding the line beautifully so I think she is ready for that. And after that – yes, add some more distance.
Two things to tweak in your setup – rather than a jump bar, use a pool noodle or bump. She has a lot of multitasking to do here and was touching the bar a bit and also trying to sort out her striding. So like with the set point – let’s teach her everything she needs to know about the handling cue and the line… and then in a few months, the bar can go back in. And that helps protect the future jumping effort, because she won’t be rehearsing touching the bar.
The other suggestion is for the next session – no need for a target out ahead 🙂 Use the toy as the thrown reward, and the timing of the throw would be when she locks onto the line to the jump (but before she gets there). That turns the jump into the target, and she will look for the jump out ahead without needing a target there. I think she is totally ready for this too.
Smiley Face – wheeeeee how fun! This looked great – one thing that I particularly liked was how she is really focused on her commitments but also clearly paying attention to your cues – what a lovely balance!!!
You can add challenge to this by decelerating sooner on the way to the wing, then rotating sooner. This will challenge her commitment skills while also working on your timing of the wrap cues 🙂
And using the toy was fabulous! Be sure to engage with her after the throw so she doesn’t get into a party-of-one habit 🙂Race track – also fun! She seemed to like it…. sooooo much speed! Love it! When you are closer to the wings like you were here, you can play with using less arm cue and more connection to her eyes as you run the lines. You can also add some distance – and that is where you can try more arm to support her (planning ahead for some big distance skills :))
You can definitely move on to the Advanced Level here 🙂
Great job on all of these! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
He was a good boy here – really driving to that target with those front feets! Movement of the board under him did not seem to phase him one bit. And I love the jackpot moment at around :50 where he slid a bit more into position – I think you were generally making a HUGE fuss over those (he did it a few more times) . He was also doing a GREAT job of working on holding position when things starting moving faster, like at 1:39 when the board was really surfing around under him and he held on!
And those nose touch moments when he is driving to the target with his nose are actually really effective! He has built in leading with his nose and feet to the target, and that head-down is what is also helping him slide into position (Quarter Horses also have their heads down when they are sliding). Plus your placement of reward was encouraging it, so I think it is looking really good!! I would not change a thing, other than to do it in different places. Also, when you have more room and less rain… add the wing before it 🙂 Start with walking of course but then see how much motion you can gradually add! He is nailing it!Great job!
TracyHi!
I think this was actually very successful because it is an incredibly weird setup LOL! He was GREAT about continuing to run up the board even with all the movement and instability. GOOD BOY! I don’t think he was avoiding the weight shift… I think it was more about the reward placement and trying to figure out what works best to produce the weight shift. For example, at :46 when he offered that bow – perfect! That counts as weight shift. When the cookie was on the table – he was weight shifting to stop but then had to streeeetch forward to get the treat. But even then, he was still getting value for remaining on all that wobbly stuff without bailing off.When you switched the cookie to the peanut – he was much better using his body there. I think the ideal reward placement will be center of the peanut, kind of between his front feet – and you can even do a little peanut butter smear there so he licks it and has to weight shift to do so (yes, gross on the peanut, but totally effective hahaha)
So keep playing with the reward placement to get him into the weight shift at the end, it will end up being somewhere near the middle of the peanut (you can also tape a target to the peanut to give him a focal point). Then you will see him more consistently do it (rather than stretching forward). He is off to a good start here, and I bet the teeter itself feels a thousand times easier for him after this crazy setup LOL!
Safe travels to NAC, and have a blast!
TracyHi! Nice work on these sessions! I think her original trepidation might be linked to her stopping a bit short on the teeter, so this is a goond one to work through. Using your original setup that she hated, you can play with it as a parkour game or random hop on, hop off stuff 🙂 to build as much confidence as possible.
On the setup you used in the video – great job getting her happy on it! And it was very smart training to use her dig dig to get her happy, she really lit up! It gave her something to think about other than the movement. Note how at about 1:07 she hopped right up onto the end with a waggy tail, wobbly board and all. Yay! And then she continued to build confidence so at the end, it was more about getting the dig dig and not about worrying over hte wobble 🙂Great job! This is something to revisit here and there, with high value rewards, and keep building the love for that wobble at the end 🙂
TracyHi!
>>Thank you again for the wonderfully aromatics!You’re welcome. Thinking of you!
This session went really well, he was driving down and on that last rep had a good weight shift too (you can hear him sliding into position a bit). And I agree – he didn’t care where you want (I mean, he cared, but not that much hahaha) and he seemed positively patient to wait in position for the cookie delivery. Yay!
With the board parallel to the ground to start and almost on the ground when he arrives at the target, we want to get a few more sessions of this with maybe a tiny bit more tip under his belt – and to complement it, how is the bang game going? You can have him leap from the ground into target position at the end of the board and ride it down, at this level in this setup. If it is too hard, you can have the end of the board a little closer to the ground but I think he might be able to do it here! Doing the bang game up high will really solidify that weight shift. And if that goes well, we will be blending a couple of things together.
Great progress here!!! Let me know how it goes!Tracy
Hi!
He did really well on both games here!!Did he start without you on the first rep of the uphills? LOL! Good boy LOL!
He seemed to like coming in from the tunnel – just be sure to give him a perfectly straight line up so that he doesn’t have to slow down to find the balance (and also so he doesn’t slip or worry himself) – we will add line ups later on. When he was turning to his left out of the tunnel, he had to slow down to find the board but when he was turning to his right- he had a nice straight line entry.The added tip seemed fine! Yay! So… onwards to a little more tip 🙂 with all of the excitement of running in from the tunnel.
He had to think about the downhills on the first rep, so you can make the first rep more predictable by moving with him rather than sending . At :55 you made that a really exciting rep and that is a great way to start the session too – get him a little wild then run with him 🙂 For the downhills, stay at this amount of tip (and you can add in toy play or ball throws before & after each rep) until he drives through that first rep and doesn’t look for the tip. That is the signal that he is ready for more.
Great job here!
TracyHi! He is doing really well here, he even adding a little scratching at the target 🙂 He is looking down to the tsrget and shifting his weight really nicely. Super!!!!
One more thing to do on the plank before we move the game to the teeter: introduce the bang game concept to the target, on the plank here:
https://agility-u.com/lesson/the-bang-game-end-position/That will get your position off to the side and also start to add excitement and motion for both of you. I think he is ready for this! And it will prep him for being able to do it on the teeter 🙂
Great job here! Sorry that the feedback is a little boring, but the session was lovely and he is ready for the next step of the bang game LOL!
Tracy
Hi! He is doing really well here! I think he is really understanding to drive across the board and is looking for the end, not the tip in the middle. One more back-and-forth session is not a problem here LOL! Now you can add a little more tip – and now with all the tip, definitely go downhill only 🙂 We are all getting creative about things we can do to prop up the board LOL!!!!
Great job here! You can also jazz him up with some play before and after – tugging or disc – so he runs the board while it is still easy, but in higher arousal 🙂
Keep me posted! Onwards to more tip!
Tracy
