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Hi!
>>Sounds good about the stays too! He is a tough guy for me to get to stay, I swear my other dogs were not this challenging>>
Some dogs don’t really understand the traditional ways of teaching stays – my 5 year old dog had ZERO idea what I wanted when I tried to teach her a stay using what I had done with the others. So, I switched to throwing the reward back to her, making the release the key information point – and the lightbulb went on immediately š Yay! Kat is just like her, so I know we will get his stay going really well too š
TracyGood morning!
Nice collar! Wow!!Great news about the teeter games! Super!
He did well finding the jump and the jump to tunnel.
I think asking him to do the 3-4 camp sequence was above his pay grade LOL!! You can back chain it by starting him in a stay on a slight angle and teaching him to find the tunnel entry. Then putting him on front of 3 to show him 3 to 4. Then you can try tunnel 2 -3-4, etc. It is a hard angle of entry to the tunnel because he has to collect and turn away from you, so that is why he ran past.
But his line from jump 1 to the tunnel looked great!!!! And so did the stays!!
So that is going to be very helpful for start lines in the future.Nice work š
TracyHa!!
I mean, the training courses can be a bit evil or sometimes my design is bad, but I appreciate Jamie saying it looked weird LOL!!
Hi!
It is pretty funny when handers start to have great connection and then I am like… ok, now connect less. And in spots: don’t connect at all. HA!!
I agree that you can jump into the package 3 walk through stuff (the live class in particular) and then if you wanted to do more walk through stuff, package 4 has more – then you can go back and apply it to the courses in package 2, 3, 4, etc š We have another month or so of time to do stuff, so you will be able to give the boys a good workout š
Tracy
Good morning!
Nice work here!
The threadle slice warm up looks great!!!The Threadle wrap is all about that shoulder turn away, then hands turn on the flat, then hands send back to the jump (but you donāt need to turn and face the jump there). More below on the wraps!
Sequence 1 looked great! Lovely connection, timing and verbals all the way through. YAY!!
Threadle wrap on Sequence 2:
She was frustrated on the first bunch of reps because your line of motion cued a threadle slice, and upper body was trying to cue threadle wrap. You can see it most notably at :51 – :53, and :59 – 1:01 where your lower body was moving along the threadle slice line – but you had your hands involved like the wrap then you moved to the wrap wing after she had already taken off.At 1:40 – 1:42 you turned your shoulders away from the jump and away from the slice line, then used your hands to send her back – big difference! So much more successful!
>>if I keep practicing it like that, am I going to be able to exaggerate less as she gets more understanding of the body and verbal cues, or am I going to be stuck overhandling threadle wraps with the loopy turn?>>
Eventually you will be able to exaggerate less plus she will understand it more, so the lines will get tighter. But for now, it doesnāt matter that the lines are wider – she is doing it exactly according to your cues, so when you are more comfy, she will automatically tighten up.
Seq 2 looked great too, with the shoulder turn away from the wrap to get the threadle wrap. The rest looked really smooth and fast: great connection and timing!
Seq 3: This one looked good too!
She gave you a bit of a reminder to be sure she is committed before you turn to the next line:
At 2:11 – you said go tunnel and turned away, so she came with you.
Much better at 2:36 where you made totally sure that she was committed to the tunnel š That tunnel turns her away from where you are running, so she is potentially going to need stronger commitment cues to convince her to do it šOn the threadle/wrap spot at 2:23 – your shoulder turn provided a good set up, but she needed more hands to then turn her on the flat before your feet turned. Your feet turned before she ws turned so she didnāt take the jump. The rep at 2:45 was much clear with the shoulders *then* hands *then* feet š She will continue to get better and better at recognizing this skill, but you should definitely keep showing her the distinct steps of it.
Great job! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning!
Sorry to hear about Covid 2.0 š You ran really well here!!Thanks for leaving in the training elements! SO MUCH great stuff here – I think he was particularly brilliant in the handling sections!! It is always a good thing when the errors are handling errors and not motivation issues or dog issues. Yay!!
I like that BC in the opening! I bet you can do it even closer to the #4 tunnel to get the slightly tighter line.
More on the weaves below.
8-9-10-11 looked great! I am sure it was a million degrees out and he was flying there!!!
He had some trouble knowing which line you wanted 10-11. What was happening was that you were cuing a great collection with great connection: then when he had the commitment, you accelerated a lot and looked forward (āwhere the heck it 12?ā Perhaps)
So in that moment – the cue totally looked like a spin to him, which would cue the off course. This is what happened at 1:18 and 2:03, and even more so at 1:45 when you were moving laterally to clear his line. He was reading you correctly!
To get him through the gap more smoothly, you can leave the wrap at 10 a little sooner and also you can have a HUGE connection there (I would have my outside arm across my body to really open up the connection. No need to get as far ahead at 11 because 12 is not a threadle š
He had a backside at 1:21, you were on his line after 11, good boy! You can totally keep going when that happens because it is a good think-on-your-feet moment and it will keep him fresher in the heat (frisbee chasing is awesome but also tiring).
12-13 as a double threadle was wicked hard (12 is actually a backside, natural line from 11) – if you are going to stay on takeoff side of 13 especially after a threadle, you will need to push in towards 14 to change his leads back out to get it. I am a little evil in course design by maybe not THAT evil haha!
He has good distance to the tunnel backside – I donāt think you need to run as much of a parallel line with him to be at the tunnel entry at 15, you can send – the forward motion was sending him wide or off course there. The decel and send should work like a charm for him š
At the end you did a bit of the other course – after the weaves, remember to stay off his line to the backside, and then make that massive connection as you exit to the next line.
About the weavesā¦
>>His weaves have been quite a pickle for me. I have put a ton of time in them and they still are iffy. He will give me one really good set in trials and then misses entry or wonāt make the bend. I had been thinking it was related to footwork but not sure thatās it. I do think they use a lot of his mental energy.>>
How did you originally train them? That can give us ideas in what to do next. He had trouble here even with the frisbee in your hand, so it doesnāt look like it is a āno visible rewardā issue at trials only? The weaves clearly stress you both out like when pulled him out on the first run and he got stressy even with the frisbee.
It might be a matter if a quick re-train with channels or guide wires, or help set up a ton of success and fun when he is coming into the weaves at high speed – then some pattern games using the weaves, to help take the stress out. I am not entirely sure why he is stressing about them but that might not matter because we would probably do the same thing anyway LOL!! It might be footwork questions if it is mainly happening on courses and not in smaller sequence setups.
Do you have access to channels or guides? Let me know what you have access to and we can plan!
Great job here š
TracyGood morning!
Opening – The turn on 3 got better and better as you worked on it – the first one was late, 2nd run was better 3rd run even better with the timing but positionally you are too far from the tunnel. So even with early timing it was harder to show the line, because the dogs will jump towards our position on course.
Also, since she was facing you at 1, you had to push her back to 1 with a big stepped which worked nicely – but made it really hard to get up to 3-4 for a FC. A BC right at the tunnel entry (same timing as rep 3) should get it done nicely and keep you ahead for the poles too!
Good girl finding the poles first run – and outside arm will help support her driving past the jump to find the poles because it turns the shoulders to support the line to the poles (dog side arm turns shoulders away, which is what created the zig zag line on the first run.
You did indeed say push at :45! Good girl for listening, Roulez!!
On the next run to the poles she did not find them:
You decelerated near the jump at :55 – so your physical cue saying something different than your verbal so she was confused. Try to keep in motion until you see her lock onto the poles. For the layering, running closer to the tunnel so you donāt get too far ahead will help too!Nice job getting the timing for the backside at 7 – you needed one more step on the first run, but then nailed it after that and had good timing with the verbal (as she was weaving).
Nice job 8-9-10 each time! The FC on 10 looked great!
On the first run through the closing section – you had a bar down at :26 (11) – there was a little disconnect and abrupt decel that caused it. Then not enough turn cue on 14 so she continued straight. Good girl!
You had turn cues on the 2nd run there – a left verbal and pulling away laterally – try to keep your dog side arm lower (when it is above your head it blocks connection and turns your shoulders away from the line, which is why she did not take 14).
The ending line after you got the 15 tunnel looked good!
>>I kept forgetting to cue the threadles at 12 and 13.>>
Those were not threadles – 12 is a backside (the obvious line from 11) the way you ran it the first times. Doing 12 as a threadle made it harder – the line didnāt make sense to either of you LOL! Remember to reward her if you have to stop!
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
Tracy
Hi!
>>Question about the backside/FC at 6. Feels like this is a place where a verbal would helpful.
100% yes š I was using a specific verbal for this context.
>>When I first taught backsides it was just one verbal ā Back. Lo has ābeen after meā to have a different verbal for backside wraps than backside slices, and we sort of played with some of that in your jumping skills class this winter.>>
Yay Lo! I agree, I think it has become important nowadays to have the 2 different verbals.
>>But Iām ready to add a new backside verbal, which will mean that I now have 4. Flip for Threadle Wraps, In-In for Threadle Slices, Back for Backsides (non-threadle) that donāt require much collection and Round-Round for backsides that need him to put in a āsquare upā stride. >>
Perfect! To make it easier on when to use which backside verbal:
My backside slice verbal is for any situation where the dog enters on one wing and exits closer to the other wing. My backside wrap verbal is only for when the dog enters and exits on the same wing, so there is a lot of collection.>>I picked Round-Round cause thatās what we used for our barrel/cone/wing stuff and seems like it fits. Thoughts? Would a different verbal have been helpful to Sly in this sequence? Selection of words? They are all words that fit for me, easy to remember. Enough of a difference for Sly? What about Round-Round vs. my Wrap-Wrap (which is a Front side wrap)? >>
I think wrap and round are both “r” heavy words, so you will either want to emphasize the vowels or pick a different one. I use noises for the front side wraps, back for the backside slices, and digdigdig for the wraps – all very different sounding š
Enough geekery on this dreary Saturday morning. Have a great weekend.
>>I didnāt totally understand/appreciate the significance of your comment about being careful about being too open until I just walked the 1b sequence. Now I get it!!! Did some RDW stuff (whoever said RDW isnāt training, itās a lifestyle wasnāt kidding) so I just walked and planned 1b and the first 2 sequence, will run with Sly later. Sun is trying to come out so weāre going to the lake!!!>>
Perfect! yes, the dogs read everything so we have to be precise (while running, while saying the right word – it ain’t easy!!)
Have fun at the lake!
TracyHi!
The 1-2-3 to the threadle looked good! At :06, you had rotated to get her to come in for 4ā¦ then when you turned back to the jump you took a really big step or two so off to the tunnel she went. That is what the handling said: good girl! Great job to just keep going!You were much more subtle on the next reps when you opened up and you turned to 5 sooner, so she did not consider the tunnel again. Yay!
>>I couldnāt figure out a good way to do that turn at 6.>>
There are two options:
The turn at 6 is either a threadle wrap if you keep her on your left, or you can BC the landing of 5 to get her on your right and do a push to a wrap.
The threadle wrap is like a tandem turn, where you would decelerate, turn away from the jump, then use your hand cues to turn her back to the jump. It is like the turn aways we do in Huckās class š Your physical cues were showing the slice line, so she ws a good girl to go there.
The other option of BC on the landing of the 5 backside, then push her past you – and decelerate, turn your feet to 7 as she is passing you – that should get the wrap there too!
The end line was hard to get mainly because your brain was still tired from the weekend, as you mentioned. The RC on 8 was great but you had skipped 7 LOL! No worries – you were great about either keep going or stop, reward, have a laugh. I think Maple had a great time!
Nice work here!
TracyHi!
Looking at Rosieās video:>>I think my problem with jump 5 was that the approach, at least the way I had it set up, was straight on to the side of the jump.>>
Then you set it up correctly š Either side of 5 should be visible to the dog so you would have to cue very clearly. A little evil, yes LOL!!
Also yes, the forced blind (a slightly delayed BC, waiting til she got on the backside) worked really well! Those reps looked great!
The key to her getting this course correctly with the MM sitting out there was your line of motion: parallel to the 4 jump meant MM to her, and pulling away to 5 meant come to 5. You can see your line of motion was towards 5 very clearly at 1:38 and 3:21 and 3:37 for example: really good running lines there!
More verbals before the tunnel totally helped her turn to you better as well.
>>At the end I was trying to get her to ignore the MM when it wasnāt delivering treats.>>
That was really good! And you can also reward more from the lotus ball near you on course, for turning away from the MM in the middle of a run (like 4-5, for example).
On Lilyās video:
She had a little trouble taking the bar on the backside of 6 because the MM was so close! I could see steam coming out of her ears! Nice job breaking it down and rewarding her a lot at the end.>>Am I showing her something different because I am anticipating where the course is going?>>
She also had trouble on the tunnel – I am not sure if there was a rhyme or reason to it other than the MM was distracting so she couldnāt always maintain her commitment. Sure, there were a couple of moments where you could have been connected better (like at 1:30 and 1:45) – pointing forward and being lateral turns your shoulders to the other side of the tunnel, so keep your eyes on her until she is really locked onto the tunnel, which might be when she is about a foot from the entry.
I thought you were better at 2:04 – much clearer connection, and the outside arm helped for sure! – but she still curled off it – try making the tunnel entry easier, curling it towards you a bit – and rewarding lots of tunnels.
Rather than focusing on the layering (which went really well!) you can focus on the tunnel commitment by moving the MM to the halfway between the tunnel and the last jump -so you can sometimes click the MM for when she commits to the tunnel.
The rest of it was great! So it was mainly 2 spots, probably both MannersMinder-induced š And that is fine, because it simulates a trial-like distraction and then you can work through it really well.
Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning!
Great job on these! This is really hard with a young dog, because we donāt really know everything they need. So part of it is getting the walk throughs and runs greatā¦ then the other part of it is getting feedback from the dog on what they need more of or less of, and how fast they go š
>>I didnāt see some of her lines since we arenāt walking them and got a few off course choices.>
Actually, that is more of a āLearn Your Dogā moment than a needing to walk the lines moment š Those were the 2 spots that I chose handling that I new my dog would need, because she is 5 and I have learned through this type of exercise. Sprite, at 2, has informed you well š
Sequence 1: one biggest thing here (and on the others) is that she ran her first run a lot faster than you ran your last walk through š So on your āgo fasterā walk throughs, try to get it all in as fast as you can. Even faster than you think she will go! You wonāt always have to do this – the rhythm will lock in and then it gets much easier.
And one other detail –
Watching the walk through: on that last backside, I was thinking she needed a spin like I needed with my dog there, Sprite and Hot Sauce are similar in how they approach lines. So they post turn showed her the line to the off course. Oops, planning error. Noted! Nice adjustment – you did a decel/brake arm on the 2nd rep and got the line, but I think the spin will get the line AND keep you moving better.
Everything else looked really good on the first run and even better on the 2nd run:
Nice turn on 3 to get her to the threadle side of 4! The dig dig on the 2nd run at 3 was AWESOME – you decelerated a little sooner and she was really strong with her independent collection. So cool!!Both times at the threadle jump, you can move a little closer to the threadle jump to reduce the zig zag line (she came too much towards you based on your position)
Great job on everything else! Strong fast lines, great tunnel exits! Great connection and timing from you!
Seq 2:
Looking at the walk through: I thought you were perhaps looking ahead of where she would be too early on the exit of 5 and on the exit of the FC at 6 but then you fixed it when you starting thinking about your cues and her cues ā¦ but then looked ahead too soon there on the fast walk through too. So as you add more speed, keep reminding yourself to look back at her eyes on all exits: exits of wraps, tunnels, FC, backsides, etc.
Nice first run!!
I think one thing to add with her is earlier turn cues from the tunnel exit to jump 3. They were happening about a stride after the tunnel exit, so she was a little wide at 3. Noted! So you can be moving forward then as she exits, start to decel with your right verbal, and maybe even a brake arm to get it a little tighter there.On the first run, you can leave sooner at 5 (as soon as she turned her head to it) but keep looking at her – she went wide there on the exit of 5 to 6 (not enough connection) and took a step to the front side (1:32) before realizing you wanted the backside. It all happens really fast, you will see it in slow motion š
That made the FC a little late, and you can also decel into it (1:34) – that is why the bar came down (late info so she was surprised about how tight the turn was). I think that is the same spot on the sequence where I fell on my butt because I didnāt plan my decelerating into the FC well enough – at least you remained upright LOL!!!
Great connection at the end, really lovely!!The second run was great!!! You can definitely play with earlier cues for 3. I really loved the backside FC at (1:57) – check out her collection! And also the ending line looked great!!
Seq 3: Watching this walk through, I was thinking that she might need a spin on 5 to get the tunnel and not the jump, because she is Hot Sauceās sister from another misterā¦
Sure enough, she stayed straight on the line of the post turn there on. The first run. Noted!So you donāt need to walk all of her lines – but when there is a discrimination (especially jump-tunnel), you will need a spin for now to bring her to the inside obstacle because the post turn sends her to the outside obstacle. This is excellent info, thanks Sprite!!!!!!!
And I recommend a spin instead of a decel and brake arm, because the decel leaves you too far behind her. On this sequence, it works out fine for the backside push to the FC (that was LOVELY) but you could not outrun her to the blind before the threadle wrap. Maybe with a spin you could?
And everything else looked lovely. Nice ending, she never looked at the off course tunnel behind you.
The threadle wrap is only worth it here on this sequence if you have time to do the blind and decelerate: her stride is too big, she is too fast. Yay!! So the push to wrap worked great.
You did break it down nicely and get the threadle wrap – you were a little too far from the jump at first but then got it nicely!!!
Overall, these 3 runs were a big win – sure, there were little spots in the first run that could go better but the second runs were LOVELY and also she gave us amazing feedback on handling choices.
Great job! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning!
>>Adding the tunnel wasā¦ interesting. I was surprised that at first he seemed to be avoiding the tunnel.>>
Having watched both videos, it probably just falls into the category of āsometimes there is learning even if we donāt see the behaviorā LOL!!!
I donāt know why he was not going into the tunnel in the first video: different tunnel? More motion from you? Too far ahead of him? Not enough tunnel work recently, especially in that tunnel and outdoors? Teenage brain trying to process too much – motion, outdoors, tunnel maybe wet & smelly, losing sight of youā¦ who knows. But it was smart to just end the session and try again later.
The 2nd video was definitely a lot better! What changed? You might have been moving less at first then gradually got faster? Or he just acclimated to the environment and was able to āseeā the tunnel. Either way, there was a lot of success and that is great! The only time he missed it was when you started at the tunnel and he was totally not expecting you to say tunnel and take off LOL! But everything else looked the same.
Yes, you can always connect more, but I donāt think that was solely to blame here š Sometimes a session just needs to be done again before we see the behavior.
>>Also, as hard as I was trying to remember not to switch the ball in my hands I busted myself doing it a couple of times.>>
Either run with empty hand or a ball in each hand – problem solved LOL!I think the serp Countermotion went really well! He is happy to go to the bump and around the barrel, even with you facing forward like that. Super!!!
Time to add a little more motion: After the release, as he is moving towards the jump, you can throw the toy to where you dropped it and also be slowly moving forward at the same time. You were moving a bit but it was after the toy throw, so now the movement will start before the toy throw.
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Yes – looking back to the landing spot more is great, that will support the commitment as you begin to add more motion. He still went to the bump even when you were looking at him, but when we add motion he might not be quite as sure as first.
Great job here!!
TracyYes! It is great to see how confident she is on her lines, at such an early stage in her career! You’ve done the homework to get here there, so a big high five to you š
TracyGood morning!
The sequences are looking really good here! His commitment is looking strong, he is getting FAST and your connection was great!!! That made for sooooo much lovely work!
The speed circles/pinwheels in each direction both looked great at the beginning.
The wraps were a little late at :32 and 1:18 because you were switching the toy from hand to hand when you should have been rotating š Soā¦ run with empty hands so you donāt switch the toy around, because he doesnāt need a reward precisely in that moment (you can whip it out at the end).Little more connection at 1:28 to the tunnel (good reset reward there)
The BC at 1:46 and on the last rep looked great! He had trouble with the spin and then the send – he probably doesnāt understand that is it ok to turn away from the course, so he ended up back jumping. No worries! You can isolate the send and the spin, and move more slowly, then drop a reward at the exit of the wing when he wraps and does not back jump.
Everything else looks great! He also has a start line stay now – SUPER!!!
Great job :)āØ
TracyHi!
>>Heās very quick to pull off, I need to learn when heās fully committed, keeping the ālooking behindā will help.>>
Yes, looking behind and also throwing the toy back there (or a cookie) to help convince him to go there even when you are going the other direction š
>> Iāll definitely need him to not cue off a deceleration, and getting into place without my being right there. >>
Since he does so well with the target, you can slowly walk past as he is moving to the 2o2o with the target, then throw a reward back to him as you keep walking š
T
