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Hi!
She is figuring it out but you will want to keep a placed reward out there for now (can be a manners minder!) – too many errors when there is no thrown toy (we only want 2, total :)) That way you can do the switch to the MM, and mix in some wraps to you for a toy or treat.
Think of it as first turning her on the flat, then cuing the obstacle. The arms were both turning and cuing, so she didn’t always get it right. So start her a bit further back like you did at the end, then show her your hands first nice and low (as close to nose level as you can, even at a distance) – get her head turned, then cue the jump. It is a tricky skill but she is beginning to lock it in!!!
>>Should I give it a different verbal from my rear cross verbal>>
You probably can use the same verbal but we can change our minds on that later down the road if she needs more clarification :)
Nice work!
TracyGood morning!
>>>I’m in so much trouble with this little girl!
This is what we call “good trouble” and also why we are proceeding slowly to lock in all the pieces. Imagine if she was at a trial or something and she had this question? There would be frustration getting built in. But because you are being super amazing rockstar awesome about putting all the foundation pieces together, we can figure out the answer to her question without frustration which will lead to maintaining all of that speed while keeping her in a happy arousal state.
On the videos:
The lazy game stuff on the first video looks really good – your shoulder turn was earlier for sure! And she was both finding the jump AND setting up a gorgeous collection, then powering out to the next line (this is something whippety dogs can do that other dogs cannot do LOL!) Great session!
Looking at the 2nd video – You actually had more momentum into the sends to the middle jump, and she was still great. On these sends, you had the decel and a big send, which works really well (as opposed to the decel from the previous videos where you were rounding the line with her and decelerating. The send and go worked really well here.
The blinds to the tunnel were tricky at first because of the timing when you were doing it on one jump: too early, and she didn’t take the jump. Too late, and she took the tunnel 🙂
You found the sweet spot at 1:05 – very nice!!!When you added the send to the middle jump – you can wait for her to land and let her cue you to start the blind. When she lands then looks at the blue jump: that is your cue to do the blind.
How to do the blind with the quickness of a tiny whippet coming at you? Have your arms drawn in tight to your sides (elbows bent near ribs, hands low and behind your hips) so that all you need to do is turn your head. When your arms are out to the side, it takes a pretty long time (in whippet years) to get your new connection visible, which is why she would sometimes be wide on the blind. The low arms held in tight to you will make a huge difference especially as you start running.
I think the best arm use here was at 1:11 – 1:12 – 1:13. Your arms were low and back, not really out past your body at all. Note how she found the blind cross side change immediately AND found the next line perfectly. As she was passing you, you were saying the tunnel cue straight down to her head and that was perfection. It really showed her the line.
Great job on these!!
TracyGood morning!
>>Ha, this will make it a whole ‘nother ballgame
Yes, it sure did but in a really good way 🙂 One thing I REALLY like about the send reps in the beginning where that you were asking her to drive to the wing and commit to the turn independently while you decelerated, and sent hr past you. She was pretty darned perfect! You are becoming SUPER connected with her on these sequences and that is really food with such a young dog.
I also love her balance of full out speed and lovely tight turns.
This is turning into a post about how fabulously well you two are working together LOL!!! But it is true – super lovely session!
>>I know at 1:22 I cued the middle wing too early and should have supported her longer with my dog side hand because she started to come in at first. >>
Yes, one more step would have been ideal however – you caught it IN THE MOMENT and supported her, so she could be correct. No errors, no frustration, great teamwork. That is why connection is so key!!!
>>The next rep I tried to support her better in that spot….>>
Yes, that looked good! And your timing of the FC after the 2 wings was looking strong throughout.
>> (My older dog has conditioned me to cue really early, so still trying to find that sweet spot (and knowing that can change when MiG gets more experienced)).>>
This might be a good thing because really early for the older dog might just be perfectly on time for MiG! When you add bars, you will get a better feel for what her true timing will be and you are correct that it will change as she gets experienced. In general, we start off with what would be slightly “late” timing with the youngsters to really help support everything, then with experience and maturity, we can cue really early and that is good 🙂 In a perfect world, the timing would be the same for both of your dogs so you don’t have to switch back and forth between timing moments for the dogs.
I am looking forward to the lazy game videos and also she is definitely ready for the rest of the sequences we did in the live class 🙂
Great job! Enjoy your weekend!
TracyGood morning! Sorry about missing the previous videos!
One more coffee-fueled thought about the teeter, after watching the video I missed: when he gets to the top and gets his treat, he tries to get the heck off… so give him the super high value treat then get him outta there so he doesn’t start to think about it. And very short session will help too – I don’t think he was seeking shade, I think it was too hard at the top so he was asking to stop. Only doing one or two reps will help avoid that fore sure.
Looking at the 2 lazy game videos:
First video:
He is definitely getting the idea here! He is being pretty quick to get the treats in the first one, so you can slowly keep moving while he is eating, like you did at approx 1:03. That way he can see the info (your motion) as soon as he lifts his head from the treat, and move forward to the jump without looking at you as much. Moving the middle jump out went really well, he found it really nicely!!>>and he won’t bring a toy back to me yet
As he puts this together to 2 or 3 jumps in a row, you can try a lotus ball and see how that goes!
On the 2nd video – he was so engaged with the toy! I love it!!!! And holy WOW he is fast! This allowed you to string together several jumps in a row, with the only questions being about how fast you had to move (answer: FAST lol!!!) I am loving his speed and excitement here!!!
Since he has decided to kick it up to a higher gear of speed, you can add the tunnel and start the sequences added last Tuesday in the live class. That builds on this and adds more speed ad fun. If he will do it for a toy – perfect!!!
Great job here!!! Fun times ahead!
TracyHi!
He is doing so well here, lots of grown up stuff! He was finding the 3 jumps pretty easily and then finding them after the tunnel.On the left turns – he is doing worlds better!!! He had trouble when you were pointing forward, high arm, not really moving, too far from the jump. 1:12 and 1:49 (where he jumped on you, frustrated) are good examples of that. Compare to 1:37 when you were connected, closer, and moving – he totally found the jump! Then you need to move more to the middle jump (1:39) so he finds that too. So use less arm on the left turn side and lots more connection and motion near the jump. That will really help lock it in.
You are more connected and closer to him on the right turns, so he finds them more easily for sure.
Great job! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
He did well on the go go go here on he first clip! He was not sure of the rear cross – I think a bunch more reps of driving ahead will help, and maybe someone else can throw the to? it will be easier when he almost automatically drives ahead of you, so you can set the rear cross line.
So to structure a rear cross session: have the jump about 5 or 6 feet further from where it was here. Do 4 or 5 reps of go go go til he basically expects it and drives ahead. Then throw in a rear cross…. Then go back to the go go go lines. The heavy emphasis on the Go will make the RCs a lot easier
On the angled grid – he seemed to have zero questions about finding the line and keeping his head low! Yay! I think the first 2 jumps were too far apart (he was taking a stride and should be bouncing like he did between jumps 2 and 3) so try jumps 1 and 2 set at 5 feet apart and see how he does.
On the 2nd video:
He is beginning to get the idea of the lazy game – loving that he was able to sort it out and get all 3 in a row in both directions!!! Definitely a little better turning to his left as you noted – so keep your line very close to the jump to hep him out. The other thing that can help is if you have a bunch of cookies already in your hand – when you reach for your pocket in between throws, he is watching you and not the jumps. Having a bunch of treats in your hand will really help his stay focused on the line.He is also doing well with the wing wraps and tunnel!!!
>>Keeping my shoulders open and more connection=TTFJ!!!>>
Ha! Yes!!!! Connection really sets the line.
The wing wrap to the left needs a lot more connection for sure, that is where he was having the most trouble. I think his questions were partially because he was not getting a lot of connection there and partially because another dog was barking (don’t underestimate how hard that is for young dogs, because their brains are not set up to ignore the barking – it is entirely possible the amygdala prioritizes the barking as ‘Danger! Danger!’ Which leaves not a lot of bandwidth for the newly formed front of his brain to process cues and respond. So there are lots of little errors that can be avoided – any way to not have the dogs barking at him? It might not be as big if an issue when he is adult and more experienced, but I am pretty sure some of the errors were due to the processing and prioritization his brain was trying to do (that includes the little refusals on the right wraps too). Maybe the other dogs can get good chew bones when it is his turn, so they can be outside but not barking?
Nice work on these!!
TracyHi!
These all look really good!!!!
She is one confident girl on the mountain climbers so you will need to stay with her (which might mean moving faster sometimes LOL!) so she doesn’t jump off or lose her balance.
Plank confidence is looking super good too – she was turning around really nicely here so you can add in tossing the reward off the end of the plank, so she can find her balance getting on it at a run (I promise it won’t mess up contact criteria LOL!)
Look at her being a pro in a new location and in the blazing heat! Good girlie!
Very nice commitment in both directions! I felt your connection was MUCH better into the wrap at :33 (you don’t even need to point forward of her to the jump, you can keep your hand pointing to her nose). She had a little question at :12, where you disconnected and pointed forward so she almost came off the line (but the verbal and prxomitiy to the wing convinced her to take it – super!) So in those spots, remember to add a little more connection and let your hand follow her nose 🙂
Great job on these! Stay cool!
TracyHi!
Lazy game part 2 – super! The sends are really strong and she is collected to make the turn all on her own: PERFECT! The main thing on the send is to be connected til she is past you as you send. You can bowl after she passes you LOL! I think the last rep was the most perfect in this respect: note your eye contact and low hand as she is passing you, and she went miles away with no questions 🙂 Super!
You can definitely be adding more and more speed to this now – the distance is great for what we want it to be, so now we can start to get into the handling stuff more and more.
Great job!
TracyHi!
>>That was so interesting seeing your dogs gain so much speed and confidence on the mountain climber. >>
Yes, those videos were from an 8 week process to teach them the teeter 🙂
She did well here, and yes, you can lift her off if she doesn’t mind, or reward her for turning around and help her walk down. By visiting this game here and there for the next 6 weeks, you will see her confidence really bloom!
She did really well on the send sequences at the beginning!
The 2nd sequence was the wrap and it was a Goldilocks moment showing the transition: On the first rep, she went a bit wide on 4-5 because you were stationary at 3 then really accelerated to get to 5 – so she accelerated (good girl!) It was too much giddy up 🙂On the 2nd rep you were better about not suddenly accelerating at :34, but that meant you were decelerated the whole time so she never saw the transition 🙂 So it was not enough transition into the wrap. Same thing on the 3rd rep at :49, going the other direction, and your feet were pointing to the RC line so she rear crossed (very good girl!) Be sure to reward when that happens because she was correct! On the th rep, your feet were pointing to the correct line so there was no RC (yay!)
To get the ‘just right’ transition on the wraps – you can hustle as she is exiting the tunnel and show lots of acceleration from 3-4 – then when she landing from 4, show the decel followed by the rotation into the wrap.
Great timing on getting to the blind at 1:09! I bet you can do it even sooner, which will make the reconnection faster so the line will be better. And excellent job thinking on your feet when you did the FC after it on 5, then had to rear cross 6, Caper thought it was GREAT! So did I!
You started the BC sooner on the next rep but actually finished it later, so the turn was wider – watching it in slow motion from 1:19 you will see that you started the rotation as she landed from 3 but then took a few steps before you did the reconnection, which is what ended up making it late.
The send to 5 looked good!
For 6 and 7, you ran forward for a few steps at 1:23 which committed her to go straight (and past the 7 jump, as young dogs will do :)) On the very last rep, you turned sooner, which totally helped!!!Great job working to sort out all of the timing! It gets easier as she gets more experienced and then you will not have to be as perfect with the timing :)
Tracy
Hi!
On the fast lazy games, most of it was perfect – I was all set to say that she is a righty because she only had trouble finding the middle jump on the left turns… til she had trouble finding the middle jump on the right at the end. Aha!So, a couple of things:
Try to turn shoulders to it sooner, no later than landing of the previous jump. If you are at all facing forward, she shoots past it.And, break it down without the tunnel there – the tunnel can be present but not used, so it is stimulating but not *that* stimulating. She can be in a stay in front of the jump after the tunnel to do the little pinwheel section, then back chain so she starts at the exit of the tunnel.
And, add a clicker: click the moment she makes the turn to lock onto the middle jump. That might be very clarifying for her!
Also – take out go verbals – too stimulating for now 🙂 We are getting a lot of go and so we don’t need to worry about that verbal 🙂
2nd seq – the wraps are looking good! Super!!!
The hardest part for her was the middle pinwheel jump. You were decelerating to help her, which worked, but we want to fade that decel asap because it is more of a management tool there than a cue.
Ideally you can just turn your shoulders. Since we have been talking about timing and the window to look for – let’s see how she does if you are turning your shoulders no later than landing from the jump before it (staying connected, of course LOL!) That should help fade out the decel.
The decel over the bar is what caused her question o the bar at :22 – and it also delays the transition into the wraps. Her wrap turns looked really good, so let’s focus on getting her to just follow the line of your shoulders as they turn without adding a change of motion/deceleration. Then you will be able to really drive into the wrap turns and decel which will get them even tighter 🙂
Nice work here! Let me know how she does with the earlier shoulder turn!
TracyHi!
>>I’m hoping to work on the Raise Your Game Challenges this weekend for package 2, so I need the weather to cooperate! >>
For real! It is like living in a rain forest here!!!
These sequences went really well, and you made really good adjustments!! Some ideas for you:
Seq 1: Finding the sweet spot of connection 3-4 is hard! Yes, your shoulders were open to the off course jump on the first run but you kept going like a pro 🙂 Yay!
She took off a little early for 4 on the 2nd rep because you closed shoulders and broke connection. The 3rd rep had the sweet spot of turned shoulders and connection so she did great! YAY!
The FC and wrap at the end looked great!
Seq 2A – The blind went well! I was writing that I think she needs a turn cue on 4 so she knows she was turning left, and then you added it on the 2nd rep (verbal cue, a little decel) and it really helped!! Super!
2nd rep had a turn cue (verbal) and it really helped!
You were a late on the turn 6-7 – some of the commitment questions and bars are definitely the processing in this tighter spacing with the tunnel right there: there is a whole lot of visual processing going on as they learn these skills!
2B – to help her set up for the threadle, she needs a turn cue on 2 so she is already turning. The threadle cue only tells her which side of 3, but if she is not already heading towards the the correct line, the threadle cue will be harder to get. A name call might be all she needs, or a right verbal. And the bigger upper body motion REALLY helped too (more rotation, swinging the upper body back like at 2:27 and 2:40).
She had a bar down at 4: a lot of the FCs are send and go where you don’t get past the entry wing to set up the turn. On this one, you were center of the bar at 2:30 so she read it as a slice based on your motion and position, then you did the FC as she was jumping and she tried to adjust and couldn’t keep the bar up. You were a a little less across the bar at 2:43 and she was already better! So try to not go past the line you want her to run and that will help with the bars too.
seq 3:
>>>.I did stop a couple of times for crazy bar knocking.>>It was happening in seq 3, so this is where we can look and see what is happening. I don’t think she was reckless on the bars here, I think she was trying really hard with what she could see. Reckless seems a little like we are blaming her. It is a different way to look at it: extreme effort versus reckless LOL!!
>>, but one of the things that seems to be making her more thoughtful about jumping is stopping when she plows into it;
I don’t think it is more thoughtful… I think the next rep is more cautious, which is different. She added strides and was more careful and slower.
>>there is no punishment, just communication that we are stopping and sometimes asking her to sit or down so she doesn’t turn into a barking tornado.>>
True, there is no punishment in the form of a physical correction or harsh verbals (positive punishment). But it is still punishment: there were verbals markers associated with it and a withdrawal of the availability of reinforcement, aka negative punishment. And that can work, of course, because the quadrants can work – but there is fallout that comes with it such as being more careful/slowing down, and/or frustration. We saw a bit of both here (she immediately barked when you stopped, so she has frustration built into the stops). And that frustration could bleed over into the frustration and barking we sometimes see when you decelerate.
Plus… the jumping error is all handler induced 🙂 She needs to see the info to process it, and if she can’t see it or it is delayed, the processing is delayed too and with agility dogs, the jumping form is usually the first thing to go. She is making a really big effort to get it done, and is not always successful with the mechanics. Reckless? Nope. Huge effort? Yessssss 🙂
So looking at the bars: at 2:52 there was a late left cue and sudden acceleration:
you marked it, stopped, she barked.At 3:06 -you were a bit too center of the bar on the FC set a wide line then you accelerated away without a lot of connection to support the next jump, so she rushed to get on the next line at 3:07 – you trying to get around the tunnel, a little disconnected, so she didn’t have time to produce good form. Definitely not a great mechanics processing moment! But not reckless.
You stop her, she barks…
On the next reps she didn’t touch bars but she was adding little strides to be cautious and also was barking a lot more on that section (frustration perhaps?) .So if there is a jumping effort that goes totally awry, you don’t need to acknowledge it by stopping or marking. If it needs to be fixed for a safety reason, you can do a couple more jumps with more connection, reward, then go back and as you reset the jump – think about adjusting the handling to be able to give more motion and connection support (or watch the video if you are not sure what went wrong :))
Nice work here! Let me know what you think!
TracyPS – since you are a teacher, you can also ask yourself what you would tell a student in that momen twhen you want to make it perfect 🙂
Hi!
>>, specifically wraps where I was decel’ing, was put her Lotus Ball near the wing of the jump where she was landing. It made a BIG difference with just a couple of reps. I will be adding this in where we have issues in sequences but also just to build value for obstacles as you have mentioned here.>>
Yes, this can totally help as long as you are not relying on the lotus ball to create the behavior (which means we humans are not actually cuing it properly :)) I do a lot of either-or in this context where the lotus ball or Manners Minder is there the whole time, but only available when I cue the jump. Otherwise, we don’t really develop the handling skills or commitment we think we are developing.
Like this:
>>>You don’t need to run it clean
I need to write this down and read it before every training session! >>
Yes, the brain is a crazy creature!!!
Maybe think of it like this:
Practice Makes Plasticity (Not Perfect)
Our goal in training is to create new neural pathways (plasticity in the brain) for 2 creatures: you and Nox. The practice creates the plasticity. Too much practice doesn’t create perfect behavior or more plasticity – it just depletes the brain. So do the 4 reps total and then be done with it 🙂 No need to revisit it or try to make it perfect, because you have accomplished the mission of more plasticity 🙂
T
Hi!
Yes, that was the only hard part for him: finding the jump after the tunnel. He had no trouble finding the line back to the tunnel when you asked him to layer with the jump-jump-tunnel line (probably because he could see you). So, we can build that layering skill from a tunnel with placement of reinforcement:
For each time he looks at/heads towards the jump after the tunnel, throw the reward to the landing side of the jump. You did that once (:55) and that was spot on!! The other rewards (especially the 2 reps after the rep at :55) were all tossed close to you, which is why he was confused and offered coming to you at 1:05. The placement of reinforcement will help him predict what the behavior is, so being more precise will make a big difference. And for now, it doesn’t matter if the bar is up or not, you still reward for looking at and seeking out that jump.
And to make it easier, you can move the jump in a bit more so that he sees it very easily on his line and doesn’t have to seek it out as much. When he doesn’t feel the need to head check anymore, you can then start to move it back out to where it was in this session.
The rest went really well! I only have one small suggestion: when you do the switch away at jump 4 at :38, do it more from the takeoff side of jump 4 and not the landing side – that will set up a tighter turn there 🙂
Great job! Let me know what you think!
TracyThank you for this! It explains why she couldn’t do it with layering: She doesn’t understand the RC pressure/convergence/arm cues unless you actually do a real real rear cross on her line – which we can’t do when layering. She got it at :49 but that was the only one.
So I htink the main thing is going to be to get her to read the arm cues and not rely on the foot work. You can go back to the tandem turn cues on the flat (like we do with Audie and the turns aways!) and then on a wing – I suggest using 2 hands: first both hands get her attention, then both hands ‘flip’ her away – and then you turn your feet 🙂 That can be easily done at a distance. We can get it started on the flat then on a wing, then apply it to a jump and the distance lines. Let me know if that makes sense!
Tracy
