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Hi!
If she loves the treat n train as the remote reinforcement station, have you tried using it at trials? It can be on a chair or in a bag. As long as she knows where it is, she might really love it! I use it with my Papillon, Nacho. The sound is off and at the end of the run, I run to it and flip the cover up and let him shove his face in it LOL it has never distracted any other dog.
TracyHi! I’m glad he stayed with you and came back. Yay!!!
Moving to the line on leash is great, I do it too. You can isolate the focus and engagement needed in the moment when the leash comes off by just practicing that section. By doing a full stay, you are cuing a lot of behaviors and I’m not sure if he knows just how much we like that offered engagement in the moment when the leash comes off 🙂Good morning!
Wow, she is getting faster and faster each time! Look how fast and tight she is on the wraps!
One general idea: because she is moving so fast and you need to get to next line and be able to make connection on the exit of the tunnel for the next wrap or left turn – after a wrap, stay connected like you did and move forward and repeat your tunnel cues (you were great with those!). And see if you can do all those things while your feet are moving away to the next line :)So your voice and upper body will support that tunnel cue, and your motion can start to move away so you are way ahead of her at the tunnel exit. Let me know if that makes sense (there is not a lot of coffee on board yet haha)
At :28 you were doing this a bit and you were miles ahead of her at the tunnel exit at :29, making the next cue very connected and lovely!
:41-:42 might be the only spot where you were not connected. As she exits the tunnel there, you were looking ahead so she kinda looked at you. On the send to the wing, you were looking ahead and pointing ahead and didn’t quite step to the wing, so she was confused because the foot and shoulders didn’t indicate the wing.
Nice reset cookie!!!!! It was a handling blooper (baby dogs need a ton of connection and physical cues) so the reset cookie was correct and kept her happy and in the game.
Your physical cue at :57 for that wing on the next rep was much clearer!! Add more connection/eye contact to that and it will be perfect. Looking back at the early reps, like at :19 – you had VERY clear connection coming out of the tunnel and a strong physical cue, so her commitment was super strong on those reps!
It is great to do a bit with the toy then switch to the lotus. That was a great toy 🙂 Since she seems to like to chase, you can tie it to something and swing it around as part of the reward delivery.
Great job here!!! Fingers crossed for more spring weather so you can keep up this lovely handling work!
TracyGood morning!
I will dig up a threadle/wrap video, I have a bunch somewhere 🙂
Really nice stay here makes the training of this grid SO MUCH EASIER!!! So great job with that and with all the reinforcement to maintain it.
She did well here with an introductory session on this grid. It is possible that 5.5 feet is a too wide and 5 foot distances would be better to get her landing more in the middle of the space – although some dogs juts set up their jumping to land slightly closer to the bar in this grid.
But before you change the distance… the next variable to add in is the moving target (it is not in the demo video mainly because we gotta get the dogs introduced to the grid without a moving target, to make sure the stay and the coordination is where we want it. Well, she hit a home run on that so we can have you dragging the moving target toy for the next session. Do exactly what you did here, back chaining it, and let’s see where she lands exactly. The moving target changes things so don’t change the distance. We might go back to 5 feet (or not LOL!). But either way, that is nit picking and I think she did a GREAT job here!!!
Tracy
Good morning (or afternoon now haha)
She is just the most fun dog to watch – adorable and brilliant and fast!
I totally agree that left was easier. She is a lefty! So for the right turns, you can use a pre-placed reward a few times to help her out: either hold her and toss the toy to between the 2nd and 3rd bar, or use food by putting a food bowl out between the 2nd and 3rd bar for her to target to (with a cookie in it at first, then without a cookie and you can toss the cookie in)
You can use a reset cookie on the good try moments or if that might disturb the tugging, you can reset then tug then try again.
She did really well turning away from you especially to the left. When you were too close to the jump wings, turning away got harder and she went the other direction – so for the next session or two, you can stay nearer to the center of the bar on the turn aways so she can have full success.
Zig zags:
Great job rewarding the terrific stay!
Having the 2 wings angled more visibly like you did on wings 2 and 3 really helped her – smart training! She did really well with her lead changes here. How far apart were the wings? They looked to be a little less than 2 meters, so you can try them at 1.5 meters. And if that goes well, you can try them at 1 meter. That will be pretty close and require her to do very fast lead changes (and require you to do fast handling LOL!) but because of her size, working that short distance will help her get super quick with the lead changes.Great job here on both! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning! It is perfectly fine to put several games in one post.
You are so right: connection sounds so easy, but yet it turns out to be the hardest thing for all of us LOL!
On the serp video – having the cross arm seemed to really help the upper body get into position. Might not always need it, but you can also choose to keep it! It is totally personal preference.
On the serps, she was coming in really nicely and able to transition back and forth between the FCs and the serps easily. Nice!! She also got the backside pushes really well – SUPER!!!
My only suggestion for the serps and the pushes is to place the reward out ahead on the next line (towards where the next jump would be on a serp). She is looking at you over the bar and not making the next turn til you throw the reward. So placing the toy (or a food bowl) will help direct her focus to the line so you can get both turns on the serp and backside slices.
Zig zag video:
Having a great stay totally helps! This went well!
She did well on 2 wings and just needed a bigger indication to come to the correct side on the first rep of 3 wings. When there is a handling error (because that was indeed a handling error because the lead changes are cued by handling :)) you can totally give her a reset cookie. She didn’t know what to do and by walking away, you got some stress sniffing. So stay connected to her, give a reset cookie when there is a handling error. Note the difference in her striding when you gave a clearer, earlier indication at :43 – she was great! And be nice and early like you were there – you were a little later on the last rep so she was delayed in responding.
For the next session, start like this on 3 wings for a couple of reps. And then if it is going well, move them about a foot closer together so that you and she both have to do it all faster 🙂Find the jump – wheee! I think she liked this one LOL! Be connected but keep moving and upright. Think of it more as running while looking towards her eyes, rather than hovering (you were bent over and hovering on the last couple of reps). As long as you keep your dog side arm down and back towards her, you should be able to connect and run without bending over back towards her.
She was perfect here, so you can add more distance between the jump and the tunnel, as well as change your position. You were ahead on these, so now try to be more lateral. And you can run in closer to the tunnel so she can drive ahead of you.Great job here! Let me know what you think!
TracyCool! Remember to count failures: if he fails twice in the session, make it easier usually by dialing back the motion 🙂
TracyHi! He did well here!
I think you were combining a couple of games here and we can get even better skills going by keeping them separate:At the beginning, what would he do if you just took off the leash? Run towards the window? For the leash engagement game, I would just want to take the leash off and see what he does. You were getting his attention and getting him into position, but that is not the same as allowing him to offer engagement as a conditioned response ot the leash coming off. So keep that element separate from the stay and the jump for now.
>>I normally shove the harness and leash in a pocket but my food and ball were in the way today. Going to have to work on throwing the leash back because that’s definitely a distraction for him.
Yes, that is a good point! You can work the tossing the leash aside as part of the engagement game. If he can offer engagement when you take the leash off, great! Reward that and then in the next session, put the leash on the ground when you take if off: can he still offer engaged (and get rewarded :))
For the line up games: try to do them in front of random object rather than a jump for now, so you can smooth out the process of position, where he is facing, etc.
>>A lot of position choice today I don’t really care but I’m trying not to give the Q for sit or down if he’s going to choose the position at the start line it’s a work in progress.
You can use a general line up cue (like at our side or between your feet) and then he can choose the position and you don’t need to say the down or sit cue.
>>Is it okay to shift him over he has his crazy habit of lining up at an angle.
Most dogs don’t like this at all, which is why I like the line up cues – I can put myself where the dog needs to be so that he can line up in the right position. So if he is at a bad angle, you can reward, release and reset in training so he doesn’t think he was wrong to go into the line up.
>>So I don’t think at least for now tugging the leash inside the ring probably wouldn’t be a problem but how do you get it back when they accidentally have it? >>
For my leash tuggers, I also train a really strong out verbal that does not rely on a cookie… for the exact reason you mention of not being able to trade for a treat in the ring. I train it by tugging then relaxing my tug hand… when he lets go of the leash, I sometimes use the leash as the reward for the out, and sometimes line up to start, or sometimes run over to a cookie station for a food reward.
Nice work here! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
>>I think you are exactly right about her being conditioned to work only for food when her breakfast bowl is out!
It is a conditioned response – Pavlov is more powerful than Skinner!
> So it very much simulates what we do at home in the mornings for her breakfast bowl. I think I mentioned that the cooler has worked really well to get her to stay in the game and do her weaves in the competition ring. My only issue with Char’s runs are that she seems stressed when we walk in the ring and she typically starts slow. I’d also like her to weave faster but that is a separate issue (I think). Should I try feeding her breakfast before the trial? She is a complicated girl!>>
Hmmm that is a good question. Does she eat anything in the morning at a trial? I would try feeding her a tiny bit just to help with blood sugars and brain function. Having a bit of food as fuel really helps our canine athletes. Doesn’t have to be a full meal, just a couple of bites to start the day off. See how it goes!
T
Hi!
>> So, do you think it is ok to play some of these games outside the ring, just like I would with my puppy to begin building value for them in the show environment? Tango is willing to do lots of things outside the ring that I can’t get inside the ring and I don’t think it will change her attitude about the new games being fun. However, I wanted to know your opinion so I don’t break down the process that we are trying to build on.>>
100% yes! Because of her history, we won’t make any major shifts in the next 2 trials 🙂 If she was a youngster, we would approach things differently.
>>Tango will run a whole run with the ball in my pocket, so should I trade off between that and building on the remote reinforcement?
Yes – but build the remote reinforcement slowly and in small pieces, as if she was a puppy. And develop that reward station that we are talking about, it gets really useful 🙂
>> Fortunately, we took your got remote class and she has a massive value for that relative to the treat and train, so I am just trying to really help her generalize that to any kind of remote reinforcement.
You can totally use the treat n train as the remote reinforcement. It can sit on a chair or table outside the ring, 15 feet away or so – it is really no different than leaving a bag or a jacket with a pocletful of treats.
>>With the ‘leash off’ game in class/training, how do decide when to move from treats in the pocket to asking for an obstacle and then treating and subsequently moving to remote re-inforcement? >>
With the goal of the off leash offered engagement being a conditioned response, I would not combine it with any other behaviors yet. Continue to reward engagement on a one-to-one ration for a while longer in training. At the trial, since you won’t have a cookie: take the leash off in a position where you can take off and run – because if she offers engagement, I want you to just take off and run and start the course, as that is likely the only available reinforcement in that moment 🙂
>>I am having to really try to figure out how to make sure she really has value for or has changed her attitude about something completely enough to move on. Any insight you might have is greatly appreciated.>>
Lots and lots of short high value reps, with the goal of shifting the conditioned response – and developing that remote reinforcement station to the point that she will run full courses with it out there.
>>Untraining and retraining is always more challenging that working with a young dog, at least for me.
For me, too. Training youngsters is often easier, because we have a blank slate.
Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
>>I did an accidental marshmallow test when I left the room to move my 13-year-old border collie (who COULD NOT handle hearing me play tug with the puppy) away from a baby gate in the hall
That was HILARIOUS! And also amazing – he was such a good boy! Not surprising, though, as he really has a long track record of making great decisions.
The remote reinforcement is going really well. The simple walking away was easy and stimulating – maybe too repetitive because he did a little barking and popping up, perhaps indicating that he was stimulated and knew he was going to get to do something… but going back to the cookies did not actually count as doing something LOL! I am glad you went into the tricks/behaviors because he settled into a really lovely work mode when you did that and was lovely in his responses. Add in a couple more action tricks along with the positions and line ups, just to keep building the toolbox.
Having the other dogs barking in the background was an excellent distraction!!! The latency was higher when the Swissy was barking behind him (thanks for the distraction help!) and that is great – working through that in a close environment with reinforcement easily available will be super helpful for when he is in a trial environment and both the distraction and reinforcement will be further away.
Great job on these – you can also add longer sequences of ‘stuff’ like a trick, a line up, a release, trick, etc before going back to the reinforcement.
Tracy
Hi! Great job on these 3 games – she was VERY engaged here especially when we consider that all 3 games relied on HER offering engagement, and not you asking for it with excitement or motion. Yay!
Instant Focus
>> watching my video I see 2 missed opportunities to reward the early approximations of the target behavior. Oops, will do better next time!>>
Great first session here! Yes, that first paw lift can be rewarded. It is a hard game and she figured it out quickly! This went well – she took literally 6 seconds to assess the environment then get to work. You were great about NOT helping 🙂
Looks like she was happy to do the chill on the table and was also asking for more engagement too! The two of you were able to relax for a bit. That’s great!
Leash off game – does she often do a body shake when the leash is off like she did on the first one? Just curious – we will track it to see if it indicates anything. She didn’t do it on the other reps. She was very engaged – excellent! Now you can bring this game to the start line in training class!
>> I want to do a lot more of this including carrying her & setting her down,
Yes! Do both walking in with her on the ground, and carrying her in. You might find that she prefers one over the other. Either way, she will get lots of reinforcement for engagement.
>> but we are getting better at keeping it short!
Yes – these little bits of games were terrific!
>.I am dubious about Take a Breath, will give it a try tomorrow or Friday.
Dubious about it working, or dubious about being able to get the behavior? You’ll spend quality time staring at her little nose LOL and it really does work!
Great job!
TracyHi!
I think it is a situation-specific issue, not a toy issue:
At :50 when she wandered off, she was working for her breakfast bowl at that time, and I think she might be conditioned to work only for food when her breakfast bowl is out there. “MOM I THIS IS WHAT WE DO FOR BREAKFAST” hahaha But at a trial, toys are much more part of the norm. So try this when you are not working for a meal and when a food bowl is not nearby – I bet you see different results. You can also move the toy away from her to chase a bit rather than present it to her , that can be more reinforcing in that scenario as well! Let me know how it goes!
Tracy
