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Good morning!
Thanks for telling me about the video – the sound is WAY off! UGH! I am simultaneously banging my head on the wall and shaking my fist at YouTube. Sigh. I will get in there and fix it, or re-film it if I can’t get it fixed because yes, the timing of the click is kind of important. Eek!!!!!! But yes – try to click for back feet.
Also yes – if you don’t have a box, you can totally use a mat. I have used large bath mats and also chunks of yoga mats that are big enough that it is relatively easy for the pups to trot through with all 4 feet. I will take a look for more video, I am sure I have some of Contraband doing it, somewhere.
The retrieve looks awesome!!! Well done! And even in the short time that I have known her here on video, her play behaviors are really blossoming! I know you mentioned that she didn’t play with you & toys as much as you wanted when we got started – but looking at recent videos, I would not have guessed that if you have not told me. That is exciting!!!
I think you were really quiet during this video for the retrieve elements (probably by design, because it is a relatively new behavior, as compared to the strike). When you think you can consistently get this behavior, go ahead and add words, even if they are informal. For example, my informal retrieve cue for toys is “bring the ting” haha! And it works really nicely for agility and flyball. Obedience would need a more formal cue because it is a more specific behavior. But no rush to add the cues – the context is the cue for now and she is doing beautifully!!!
Great job 🙂 And I will get to work fixing that video, hopefully today 🙂
Tracy
Hi!
>>Jump threaded (close) jump threaded wrap (maybe I need to see them). Is there a reason to not use “in” for both (coming from a person that obviously doesn’t remember dog side leg, let alone which of 100 verbals to use 😜)?The reason different verbals are needed are because they are completely different behaviors and we cannot rely on our handling to always be right there to show him. It would be like using sit to mean both sit AND down – something is bound to go wrong with that.
And practice, practice, practice will make the verbals seem like second nature 🙂
THi!
>>Should I shelf that for a while and work only this? He should have a fair understanding of the command>>Do you mean the motion override game versus the mat work here? You can do both – one is on the flat, the other is with the mat, so they won’t interfere with each other.
>>I find myself saying “go weave” or “get your weaves” as well as just “weave.” Do I need to try and break those habits on course or will using “Weave” during training translate and override my bad habits?>>
Good question! I vote for breaking the habit, especially because Go and Get are also the beginning of other cues that are not related to weaves. So, just use “weaves” and no other chatter unless you need a directional like “get out” before it. Get your weaves doesn’t really have specific info.
T
Hi! Sounds like a long day but you got really good work in!!!
On the prop practice:
He is showing really great value for his prop, so we can add some things:
For the sends:
– when tossing treats, be sure that he is engaged and sees you toss them, and more importantly: use a marker like ‘get it’ every time. He didn’t always see the treats and you were not saying anything, so it got a little muddy. I don’t want him to start scanning the floor for treats, so the engagement and marker become really important.– speaking of engagement… engage before each send. It is not a loop of send-cookie-send- cookie. It is more of: engage, send, reward. Engage, send, reward. The engagement prepares him for what is coming and also helps you get the mechanics ready.
At this stage, the distance is perfect, so now you can add countermotion! Get closer to it to start and move to the countermotion games 🙂
The parallel path also looks good. The errors were when he was not ready because you moved away quickly while he was finding the treat, so he just followed you. Let him find it and chew it before you move up the line again.
The handling game also looked good (and Suzie gave perfect feedback and advice!). With this, you definitely want to get him excited with the ball. And use the get it for the cookie toss. And don’t worry if he is tight to you or not – that is accomplished with you decelerating sooner. He did great here! And if his stays are coming along nicely, you can use those rather than cookie tosses to start 🙂
Nice work!
TracyHi!
>>Found the registration! PS. It is not easy to find clasess to register for on this website. I would think that you would want a list of clses and registration to be up front and clear on the website.>>
Glad you found it! It is hard to find because we hide registration once they get past week 2. So there are several active classes at the moment but registration is hidden because they are either finishing or halfway through 🙂 the new classes are much easier to find (no new classes at the moment :))
TThis all sounds good! I’ve found that limited the training time AND having to train more than one dog in that time helps us make better plans and be more efficient 🙂
And you can see if the jealousy thing helps in class! There will be some extra noise 🙂 but hopefully no one minds 🙂
TracyFor more RC foundation, try this:
First on the flat, then add in the prop in front of her so you do the RC then release forward to the prop (this was done before we got all proppy lol)
T
Hi!
Thanks for trying the RCs again – I think you just need more room to do it, like 20 feet, because she had already committed to doing the prop a certain way when you were cutting in behind her here. But, we can also teach her to turn away for a RC with some other games – I will grab the videos to show you that!Parallel path also looked great, it was an easy concept transfer! So now – don’t click anymore, because it causes her to look at you and we don’t want her to look up. Instead, mark with a get it and throw the cookie (or toy). And, mark and throw sooner: you are looking for the intent to commit, the decision to move to the jump, rather than waiting for her to get between the uprights. When she is between the uprights, there is nothing else to look at so she is likely to look at you. When you mark intent, the reward will be placed earlier so she won’t look at you 🙂
The RDW mat also looked good! Next step: now, stare at the mat (don’t watch her) and click for back feet only. At first, any back feet then you can ramp it up to clicking for the 2nd back foot 🙂 Staring at the mat makes it much easier 🙂
Definite progress with the retrieve to hand!!! This looked great! Food value is high enough now that you can do stationary shaping stuff like this with success. Yay!
2 things to consider:
First, make sure she swallows the treat after the click, before presenting the toy again. The toy came out fast, so she finished chewing the treat after she gave the toy back to you LOL!Second – now for some words 🙂 Maybe add a word to pick it up, and a word to out it? Thinking ahead to obedience, you’ll want words for all that eventually.
Great job on these! Let me know what you think and be right back with the rear cross videos.
TracyHi!
Thanks for trying the RCs again – I think you just need more room to do it, like 20 feet, because she had already committed to doing the prop a certain way when you were cutting in behind her here. But, we can also teach her to turn away for a RC with some other games – I will grab the videos to show you that!Parallel path also looked great, it was an easy concept transfer! So now – don’t click anymore, because it causes her to look at you and we don’t want her to look up. Instead, mark with a get it and throw the cookie (or toy). And, mark and throw sooner: you are looking for the intent to commit, the decision to move to the jump, rather than waiting for her to get between the uprights. When she is between the uprights, there is nothing else to look at so she is likely to look at you. When you mark intent, the reward will be placed earlier so she won’t look at you 🙂
The RDW mat also looked good! Next step: now, stare at the mat (don’t watch her) and click for back feet only. At first, any back feet then you can ramp it up to clicking for the 2nd back foot 🙂 Staring at the mat makes it much easier 🙂
Definite progress with the retrieve to hand!!! This looked great! Food value is high enough now that you can do stationary shaping stuff like this with success. Yay!
2 things to consider:
First, make sure she swallows the treat after the click, before presenting the toy again. The toy came out fast, so she finished chewing the treat after she gave the toy back to you LOL!Second – now for some words 🙂 Maybe add a word to pick it up, and a word to out it? Thinking ahead to obedience, you’ll want words for all that eventually.
Great job on these! Let me know what you think and be right back with the rear cross videos.
TracyHi!
I think the strike a pose game looked really great! And considering how stationary it all is, she was really driving in wonderfully! Yay! Her target hits were strong – I think there was one at :54 she didn’t quite hit it but yo were also moving your hand to the toy and she got distracted by that (not quite ready for that distraction yet). So the toy in hand is a GREAT thing to work through, because this game also has a nice level of self-control built in!
You can also work on cleaner mechanics to make it easier – tossing the cookie from the target hand like you did at the end worked really well. She also did her best reps when you looked at the target. And, plan your reinforcement markers – you had get it got a tossed treat, get it for the toy in your hand, and get it while tugging 🙂 I think you need different cues for get it as a tossed thing versus grab the thing in my hand (and probably just praise when you tug or silly noises :)) And same with treats – you had “yes” as a marker, but when you want to her to leave the target and come to the cookie in your other hand, a separate marker will help her know where to look and where to go, which suits this game really nicely too 🙂
Ladder –
>> I might try a target plate at the end with a piece of kibble on it to get her to focus forward all the way through rather than start looking at me for the treat as she reaches the end.Yes, an empty target or food bowl, about 6 feet past the ladder will be a great focal point. You were feeding her high and towards you, so the target is a great way to keep her looking straight.
She was really good with her trotting here!! Both directions looked good and she was also good with the taller ladder.
>>Unlike a certain auntie of hers who shall remain nameless, she has yet to try jumping through the ladder, and kibble should be a low enough value that it won’t get her doing that.>>
I think maybe you were overly concerned about jumping through it and you were not giving her enough space to do her thing. For example, why did you tell her she was wrong at :12 and :31 and :51 by stopping her and telling her to come back? She was trotting into the ladder nicely and you were moving towards it, so she was correct to also move towards it. She just needed more space to turn around and enter correctly, she didn’t have enough room. Then at :21 and later on you were saying “easy” or “hey hey easy” – she doesn’t need any of that 🙂 especially not the hey hey which can be a negative marker. Just let her do her thing, she is doing awesome!!!!
>> Question on Week 4 Beginning Start line. You mention you use ‘get it’ for a reward they get ahead of them. Do you have a separate word for a situation where you’ve tossed the toy back behind them (they can’t leave position) and THEN release them back to that toy?>>
I almost never toss a toy back to proof not leaving position. I feel it sets dogs up for too much failure and it is also boring as heck, so I can’t think of a time that I do it. If I did do it, it depends on exactly where the reward lands (yet another reason why I don’t do it – precision reward placement LOL!). If the toy lands ahead of the dog, I would say get it because they move forward to get it. If the toy lands behind the dog, I say “toy toy” which means they should turn back and get the toy behind them. I can’t use ‘catch’ in that situation because they are allowed to move on a catch.
>>I’ve always used ‘get it’ in both situations since I never (well, can’t think of a time) have two toys out available on the ground for a reward when working. If you do have a separate word for that situation, can you explain why?>>
I use separate markers because the more specific we are, the better the behavior will be, the less frustration the dog will experience. Plus, if you are proofing, then specifics become even more important so we don’t set the dog up for failure. And I have multiple toys in sight a lot, especially in flyball 🙂 and also in skill training in agility (contacts and weaves for example) The more we give the dog in terms of placement of reward clarity, the better the behavior gets and the happier the dog is 🙂 And there are people out there with so many more markers than I have 🙂
Nice work on these! Let me know what you think!
TracyHi!
Lap turn video:
This is going really well! I think your position relative to the prop was good on both sides – you were a little more off-center on the first side, so maybe that is why it felt weird? And you were going slow enough, the rhythm of the movement was really good!
Two tweaks for you:
Keep your feet together and your arm in place (extended towards him) until he is about 3 inches from your hand. Then the hand and leg can move back together to set the turn. You had your leg stepping back too soon, when you were releasing him. That made the hand movement a little more awkward and he was not as clear on the turn cues (like at 1:39 when he was not sure if he should stay on your hand or go to the prop). So, as weird as it feel – keep your feet together and arm extended to him til he is super close 🙂My only other suggestion is that you do more rewards for stays by going to position and tossing the treat to him. Now that the ‘work’ has more action, the stay is less interesting so he was not as strong with it. But we don’t want to reward with you handing it to him, we want to build the value of that stay with you on a big lead out – the cookie toss works well for this!
Tunnels – ah yes, he is totally on board with this now LOL!!! So you can now put it in a loop so he only does it on cue: line him up, cue the tunnel, let him do it, click the MM, then as he is getting the cookie, call him back to you on the arm outside the tunnel so he does not go back through the tunnel (you can totally use a cookie for that too!) and then repeat the process 🙂 he was getting good at offering so now we can set him up to come back to you without the tunnel again LOL
Once you have that loop going, you can start to change your position and move further back to add more challenge to finding the tunnel entry.
And I think he is also ready to do the tunnel threadle intro, where he starts between you and the tunnel.Great job on these! Let me know what you think!
TracyGood morning!
Perfect timing for tunnel threadles to show up in the in-person class too! He was great both on the shorter straight tunnel and the longer slightly curved tunnel. Being on the threadle side didn’t bother him at all, plus the self-control element of ignoring the toy on the ground was terrific!
At the very end of the 1st tunnel section, I think you were saying “through” – I see that through is also at the end as his tunnel; threadle verbal, which is great! Be cleaner with your markers when he is correct on those – the marker is “get it” but in the heat of the moment you were throwing in his name and yes before the get it 🙂 So say get it then celebrate when he gets to the toy 🙂 Everything looked great, so feel free to add more angles to the tunnel threadle line ups now.
Turn and Burn looked good too – I think I also heard your wrap verbals? Hard to tell with the camera behind you. When he started on your right side, he was perfect and you can now add in leaving sooner. Your goal is to be starting the FC before he arrives at the barrel, so he has to finish the wrap to his left with already moving away. (Then the goal becomes that you finish the FC before he arrives at the barrel, just like we would want on a jump).
I think he was fine on your left side to start too, other than the tunnel being right on his line so he had a legit mistake 🙂
One thing I notice here is that he was really thinking, not as low to the ground as he drove to the barrel as he is at home. It is likely an indication that he is processing the behavior AND the environment – so it was SUPER exciting that he was able to process BOTH. That is unusual for adolescent dogs, especially males, so I am doing a little happy dance here! Good boy!Handling combos – looked great too! When you make connection on the new side (same side as you will drive to the toy on), you can give your toy cue sooner (or a go cue) – he was watching you and waiting for more info 🙂 You can also ‘hold’ the connection on the FC side for longer, so the BC happens on the flat (some of them were more like spins on the barrel so you were on the final side before he exited – and that is a great skill too). You might need more room to do that, as he continues to pick up speed you’ll need the extra time for all the crosses.
One other thing: Now that he is learning stuff on a jump, try to have the line after the barrel clear of jumps or hoops so he doesn’t ignore motion towards them. They were a little off to the side here but we don’t want them to fade into the background at all at this stage.Parallel path is also going nicely. Working on one jump, when he arrives between the uprights he is looking at you (nothing else to look at). So, throw sooner so when he arrives between the uprights and already see the reward in place (or moving into place). You would be marking the decision to commit and the intent to move to the jump, rather than the arrival between the uprights. The 8” bar seems to be no problem and he is old enough for it, so keep that in there as long as he doesn’t start touching it.
The rotated sends looked fabulous too, no problem at all! You can add your wrap cues. And also you can add countermotion like on prop where you are moving away earlier and earlier (he was really good at this, if my memory is correct). Basically we are showing him to exit of a cross or serp where the timing was good and he should maintain commitment even though you are running the other way (this makes for amazing turns!)
Great job! Let me know what you think!!
Tracy
